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Total Members Voted: 137

[narhiril]

I'm having a little trouble with paragons at the moment which I hope I can resolve shortly.

Pray, elaborate?

I'd rather not, at this point, since I've spent half of the day fiddling with it without much success, but I suppose it needs to be said.

Simply put, the resurrect effect isn't working the way it's supposed to.  For some obscure technical reason, the ANIMATE effect allows you to fully heal an already transformed unit with another transformation, but the RESURRECT effect does not.  In other words, paragons are resurrecting, but not being transformed for that brief moment that would allow them to heal up to full, meaning that they're being revived with all of the injuries that killed them the first time around.  In other words, few of them are surviving for more than a frame or two, and limbs are not regenerating at all.

This never showed up in arena testing because I can spawn a paragon directly into arena mode without any active transform effects, but when a dwarf in fortress mode is transformed into a paragon, the transformation interferes with the resurrect effect.  Curiously, the same is not true if the resurrect is changed to an animation effect, but doing that raises all sorts of other issues.  I can get paragons to work, and I can get a reaction to get dwarves turned into paragons, but I can't get the dwarves turned into paragons to work.

What it means is that I'm going to have to do a pretty radical redesign of the entire paragon concept if I can't find a workaround, and so far, I haven't found a workaround.  I tried a variety of different tricks, including pairing the resurrect effect with an animate effect (the animate effect overrides it).  Unless someone far better at coding than I am finds a way to do it with an internal call to DFHack, it's not looking so good.


Since paragons work if they are born as such, I may elect to make them a rare caste instead of a ritual unit.  I'm tossing around ideas for what this would mean going forward, but at the moment it just means that a lot of editing needs to be done.

Here's the idea I'm leaning towards at the moment - paragons will be a rare caste of dwarf that are born, much in the same way that savants work currently.  Paragons are ageless and deathless, but are otherwise identical to regular dwarves and have no innate abilities.  Paragons, however, can be "dedicated" at the Temple of Origin to one of the five original gods, which bestows upon them a set of abilities, but locks them out of the abilities of the other four options.  Paragons dedicated to Visthel will be able to resurrect other paragons.  This does not require an active transformation, so it *should* work.

A reaction will be added to the Temple of Origin to dedicate a paragon to Visthel, bestowing a few abilities onto them.  This reaction will be fairly inexpensive - the rarest component will be the paragon.  The current expensive and/or risky reactions to "create" a paragon will be reworked to have a much more interesting function. 

I apologize for the abrupt change and any delays it may end up causing, but I simply see no other alternative at this point.  Hopefully it will still turn out in a way somewhat resembling the original concept.  It actually may be for the better that this issue raised its head now, as it gives me a few ideas moving forward.

[simonthedwarf]

@Sandiego

Deep wolves are LFR content? Hot dang diddetidongdongdoo. At any rate these ragged semi-dogs really do feel like four legged crundles, haha.  And they show up a bit too often considering how little of a fight/challenge they impose.

I guess my complaint is deep wolf blocking other content! Though I guess its the job of the player to  continually do genocides against uninspiring critters

Maybe Nari could add a reaction especially using deep wolf parts? "hood of the wolf rida"


@Pan

Magnificent idea, really. The flying shedim thing. But I think you should take it to the natural conclusion.

You want siegers to impose more challenge, but if you add a caste you'll have the situation where probably one third of the flying caste makes a successfull attack, and the rest wait outside.

No Pan, what Nari should add if she wanted to go "crazy" or lets phrase it to make a real challenge...

Is make a race of flying building destroyers. That's the only way you can scare seasoned DF players currently, in my view.

Its funny when I think about the succession game, since I think I stated early that RL stuff usually dont block my gaming "commitments". And then a huuuuge amount of stuff happened that left me plucked haha. At least I was able to organize the start. How did the fort go?

Im definitely up for another fort. I'd like to do a fort where we attempt to conquer hell using constructs. Doesn't that sound pretty fun? We could say for instance that the fort goal is to produce 50 mantis or tarantulas.

@Nari

Another issue I have with DF/LFR right now is creatures with webs. They are lame in my opinion. I wish we had a construct immune to webs. I'm not saying its too hard, I'm just saying that a single devourer for instance can tie up a huge army in the caverns, while its attacks are glancing off some construct.  I'm surprised the mithril tarantula isn't webimmune. Perhaps a weaker "slicker" tarantula with web immunity could be given a construct reaction.

OR.. OR...

Web immune steel spider-dog. I would like to donate 50$ to Nari if she adds that. Its crazy that she dont have a donation box already, I've easily spent 200 hours playing this mod since i found it.

[Putnam]

Would adding a syndrome (with ADD_SYNDROME) alongside the resurrection effect work for that?

[noppa354]

Uh, is the conduct research reaction supposed to make 10 ethereal spheres (various quality levels, quite high though!) and a research result? I knew ethereal spheres were a possible result, but I thought it was one at a time.

[Jilladilla]

Uh, is the conduct research reaction supposed to make 10 ethereal spheres (various quality levels, quite high though!) and a research result? I knew ethereal spheres were a possible result, but I thought it was one at a time.

yes it is possible for this to happen, it is NOT possible to make the results mutually exclusive

on that note, it is possible for the Weapons Concepts Lab to produce one of EVERYTHING on a single try.
the chance of that is much worse than 1 in a million though

[Stirk]

yes it is possible for this to happen, it is NOT possible to make the results mutually exclusive

Actually, spheres come in rounds of 10. Always. That is the way they are coded.

[Putnam]

Uh, is the conduct research reaction supposed to make 10 ethereal spheres (various quality levels, quite high though!) and a research result? I knew ethereal spheres were a possible result, but I thought it was one at a time.

yes it is possible for this to happen, it is NOT possible to make the results mutually exclusive

on that note, it is possible for the Weapons Concepts Lab to produce one of EVERYTHING on a single try.
the chance of that is much worse than 1 in a million though

As of the most recent version I have, it's about a 1 out of 10^445 chance to happen.

Shiyat.

[simonthedwarf]

What can you use etheral spheres for anyway?

[Pan]

Melting down into bars, then make it into a sharp blade or something.

[simonthedwarf]

That reaction is bugged. I've never been able to melt etheral spheres to ether bars. I've processed ether spheres at at furnace but it never produces anything, so I've just sold spheres cause they were worth like 10k urists each.

On a related note, is anyone else getting way too much weapon prodigies? These guys make it too easy to get masterwork weapons.

[Jilladilla]

That reaction is bugged. I've never been able to melt etheral spheres to ether bars. I've processed ether spheres at at furnace but it never produces anything, so I've just sold spheres cause they were worth like 10k urists each.

On a related note, is anyone else getting way too much weapon prodigies? These guys make it too easy to get masterwork weapons.

each sphere produces 1/10th of a bar, you need to melt all 10 at the same smelter.

the Process ethereal spheres reaction does NOT melt them, it just strips the quality from them (so your alchemists dont tantrum due to destroyed masterwork spheres)

Melting them is the same as any other metal thing.

[SanDiego]

Well, that explains a lot...

[simonthedwarf]

Wait you have to actually melt them manually?

The bowyer prodigies will pay for this with their lives!

[Imp]

I'm not sure if giant armadillo sows and boars are LFR critters or normal ones, I rather assume their normals, but they've been catching my eye a lot during my current LFR game.  For one thing, they're a bit typo-riddled; the sows are male and the boars female.  Though they're called 'giant' in their name, their description refers to them as a "small mammal".

When I noticed that, I considered mentioning it here, then figured, nah, they're normals.

Then a caravan's human guard encountered one.  It rolled into a ball.  The guard went to town, hacking wildly at it, the first 10 attacks glancing away.  The next 6 strikes landed, each one fracturing the shell.  That 6th strike apparently managed to break the remaining connective bits, because on the 17th strike the shell was again struck, and severed.

Funny as it is to imagine an armadillo with the shell struck off - rather like the idea of an egg with the shell struck off, somehow without crushing the whole thing - what really amused me happened next.  The armadillo stood up, then took off like a dwarf after some socks.  I've seen a few faster things in the game, but my oh my oh my could that armadillo, minus a shell, run quick!  It got around 25 squares away from its attacker before the apparently surprised human began to chase after it.

Made me think of one of those Looney Tune cartoons, Meep Meep goes the shell-less armadillo, neck and neck with the road runner as they race into the sunset, coyote and human caravan guard watching with equally bemused expressions.

[SanDiego]

A suggestion - would it be possible for Bog Troll thieves not to get enraged so often? It easily gives away their position.