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What would you most like to see next from LFR?

More tech tree!
- 36 (26.1%)
More ritual tree!
- 8 (5.8%)
More lore!
- 12 (8.7%)
More mythical weapons/armor!
- 22 (15.9%)
Plagues!
- 28 (20.3%)
More secrets!
- 21 (15.2%)
More mechanical constructs!
- 11 (8%)

Total Members Voted: 137


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Author Topic: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.21a *=*=* [DF 0.34.11]  (Read 403968 times)

Putnam

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2100 on: April 14, 2012, 07:35:43 pm »

Why do the rift wardens have [CRAZED] & [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE]? The former makes them attack everything, while the latter makes them attack everything except other [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] creatures.
Also, why [CAN_LEARN] & [CAN_SPEAK]? Does it have something to do with interactions?

Also, why such a huge MAXAGE? Nobody's ever going to run a game that long, so why have the MAXAGE at all?

You have two SCRATCH attacks in the rift warden. Couldn't you have the latter one be called SLASH or such, considering that anything goes in that spot?

Damn, I'm feeling comby today >_>

Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2101 on: April 14, 2012, 08:14:07 pm »

Perhaps the maxage and speaking and learning is just to shape what creature the rift warden is?

I sort like to think, for flavor, that rift wardens were exiled by the gods for releasing the voidwalkers from the void into this world. And the shedim and voidwalkers are related to the collapse of the vanguard civilization. Perhaps the voidwalkers were released by the rift wardens and destroyed the vanguard civilization, who were holding back the shedim.
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Jilladilla

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2102 on: April 14, 2012, 08:24:03 pm »

i like to think of it that the voidwalkers and vanguard were close competitors, then the vanguard and shedim fought and severly weakened each other, and then the voidwalkers just cleaned up everything...

that would explain why the vanguards aren't alive anymore, why the shedim were gone, why the voidwalkers know that "left unchecked, the shedim will eventually overwhelm even the most coordinated and advanced defenses" (copied + pasted straight from the lore)
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Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2103 on: April 14, 2012, 08:50:08 pm »

i like to think of it that the voidwalkers and vanguard were close competitors, then the vanguard and shedim fought and severly weakened each other, and then the voidwalkers just cleaned up everything...

that would explain why the vanguards aren't alive anymore, why the shedim were gone, why the voidwalkers know that "left unchecked, the shedim will eventually overwhelm even the most coordinated and advanced defenses" (copied + pasted straight from the lore)

Agreed. Parasitic race wiping out advanced, former civilization seems to be the idea here.
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Putnam

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2104 on: April 14, 2012, 09:02:57 pm »

Perhaps the maxage and speaking and learning is just to shape what creature the rift warden is?

I sort like to think, for flavor, that rift wardens were exiled by the gods for releasing the voidwalkers from the void into this world. And the shedim and voidwalkers are related to the collapse of the vanguard civilization. Perhaps the voidwalkers were released by the rift wardens and destroyed the vanguard civilization, who were holding back the shedim.

No, I mean CAN_LEARN & CAN_SPEAK as opposed to INTELLIGENT, which is the same thing as both.

narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2105 on: April 15, 2012, 09:05:48 am »

Why do the rift wardens have [CRAZED] & [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE]? The former makes them attack everything, while the latter makes them attack everything except other [OPPOSED_TO_LIFE] creatures.
Also, why [CAN_LEARN] & [CAN_SPEAK]? Does it have something to do with interactions?

Also, why such a huge MAXAGE? Nobody's ever going to run a game that long, so why have the MAXAGE at all?

You have two SCRATCH attacks in the rift warden. Couldn't you have the latter one be called SLASH or such, considering that anything goes in that spot?

Damn, I'm feeling comby today >_>

The reason for both is to add another layer of hostile behavior if the CRAZED tag or OPPOSED_TO_LIFE tag are removed.  This isn't relevant now, but may be in the future.

Huge values for MAXAGE make it so that creatures will sometimes have a HUGE number as their age.  So, you might run into a rift warden that is hundreds of thousands of years old.  It's a flavor thing.

Perhaps the maxage and speaking and learning is just to shape what creature the rift warden is?

I sort like to think, for flavor, that rift wardens were exiled by the gods for releasing the voidwalkers from the void into this world. And the shedim and voidwalkers are related to the collapse of the vanguard civilization. Perhaps the voidwalkers were released by the rift wardens and destroyed the vanguard civilization, who were holding back the shedim.

No, I mean CAN_LEARN & CAN_SPEAK as opposed to INTELLIGENT, which is the same thing as both.

Rift warden lore will get fleshed out a little more in the coming updates.  They actually don't have much to do with the voidwalkers, vanguard, or shedim, though this was a nice bit of speculation.  If you comb through the raws very thoroughly, you might find a hint about the rift wardens (but I wouldn't bother, since it's not in the file you'd expect it to be in).  You're correct about the voidwalkers greatly contributing to the downfall of the vanguard, but that's all I'm willing to reveal at this point.

Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2106 on: April 15, 2012, 09:53:31 am »

Had a pretty epic fight with voidwalkers. Got lucky.

It is late summer, and the human caravan arrives in the south. However, in a disastrous turn of fate, a bog troll theif spawned right next to it, and slashed the leading merchant and his head off, causing their swift departure. I forbid the items there till I can dig a safe, underground passage to the loot site.

I wait a couple seconds, and a western Nephilim caravan appears, making a beeline for my fortress. However, barely two seconds past when the backdoor entrance came the screams of a marksdwarf - voidwalker! They had ambushed him as he was taking a stroll through the woods (off to send off a message raven to his elven leaders, the sympathizer). He is quickly dealt with, for I have not equipped him with bolts. I ordered the backdoor bridge to be pulled. Here's the brilliant stroke of luck. The delay allowed half the voidwalker foot to step upon the bridge, which immediately raised and atom smashed them. This was key to the resulting battle.

With the back entrance no longer an option, the ambush force leader, a cavalry destroyer mounted on a giant lion circles along my western side of the fortress to get at my south west causeway. This means they pass through the western bunker loaded with 15 novice marksdwarves. I see their numbers, 7+ on foot 1 on lion. I decide it's still risky, and decide to pull the causeway bridge. The bulk of the forces shrug off the blows of the unskilled marksdwarf battalions, who only managed to stop the cavalry soldier by shooting down his lion, and the large force of voidwalkers are nearly past the bridge when it closes, throwing 3 off the causeway. I decide to let the marksdwarves continue shooting them while the sat there unsure what to do. However, I quickly notice the Nephilim caravan, oblivious, was heading towards the voidwalker soldiers. I decide to make a sally with my armored speardwarf squad, so as to prevent harm to the lovely steel trading angels. I lower the bridge and crush the majority of the remaining voidwalkers foot. The soldiers rush forward.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So ends the first voidwalker encounter. While it felt great, and sort of like a mid-movie victory where after the battle, theres party and trading, you can't help but worry for the big battle later on. I mean, I barely stood a chance with an ambush squad. What if a full on elimination force greets me in a year? Here's hoping I can get the soldier's skill and equipment up.

As I fiddle right now with the bridges and burrows and clean up, I hear a disturbance, and it appears a voidwalker who was on the backdoor bridge, got flung up to the roof, and made the mistake of attacking the western bunker. He is currently being pin cushioned.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2012, 09:56:33 am by Pan »
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narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2107 on: April 15, 2012, 12:51:17 pm »

A hell of a tale, Pan, if I do say so myself.

Right now, voidwalkers are kind of a roll of the dice when you encounter them.  The lashers and "callers" are fairly weak, due to the nerfed whips and a spear concept that never quite worked out the way I wanted it to, so they'll be seeing a bit of revision in this next update.  The long-planned "voidwalker creature update" gives them more of the humanoid-insect hybrid feeling that I was going for, as well as overhauling their spear units.  The "void hurling staff" isn't going away, but it will be getting an edge attack, and the voidwalkers will be getting access to two additional types of spear (that are far more deadly) to put them on par with reavers and swordsmen, which are an order of magnitude more dangerous right now.  Obliterators and arbiters, their mace and hammer units, will likely not be changing much.  Likewise, lashers will probably remain largely as-is.

"Callers" are being re-name "impalers" to better suit their new function...  and also because "caller" is another caste I planned to give them later on down the road, and I'm going for preempting any confusion that might cause.  Also in preparation for any new castes, the "patriarch" and "matron" distinctions will be dropped in this update.  From now on, you'll just see things like "voidwalker reaver" or "voidwalker mistshroud impaler." 

Likewise, I have more tricks up my sleeve for them and for the other hostile races if things prove to be a little too easy for the new dwarven tech and ritual units.

Vanaheimer

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2108 on: April 15, 2012, 02:31:47 pm »

Tougher Voidwalkers would be nice, whenever they show up my relatively small military tends to waltz through 'em.
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narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2109 on: April 15, 2012, 02:36:56 pm »

Tougher Voidwalkers would be nice, whenever they show up my relatively small military tends to waltz through 'em.

Oh, you'll also see shedim corpse devouring in this update.  Every time they kill something, they destroy the corpse and spread NOEXERT and NOSTUN throughout their ranks.

Vanaheimer

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2110 on: April 15, 2012, 02:49:49 pm »

Awesome. I look forward to seeing if I need to enlarge my military.
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nekronuke

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2111 on: April 15, 2012, 08:47:42 pm »

maybe you could add dwarven biological labs.
Heres what you need. TROGS! trogs are underdeveloped humanoids, so are easily used for biological experimentation! you could synthesize muscle-mass tonics, growth serums, mutagens of multiple types, and test them on trogs. Make supersoldiers, berserk beasts that kill everything they see, a new type of farm-able animal that bloats itself with meat! creatures that can be milked for serums and extracts... ENDLESS !!SCIENCE!!
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Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2112 on: April 15, 2012, 08:54:55 pm »

Good idea. Shame the dwarf will get scared of the hostile trog, and you will have to tame it first. Sadly, trogs cannot be tamed. But Narhiril understands the interactions more than I do, so maybe there could be a compromise for your concept? I've always thought the tech tree was purely mechanical and ethical. We're dwarves, dammit!

Vanahelmer, how the heck do you train your military? Danger room? Cuz otherwise the voidwalkers shreds through soldiers not armored in candy like paper, and their archers punch through even addy.
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nekronuke

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2113 on: April 15, 2012, 09:03:14 pm »

Good idea. Shame the dwarf will get scared of the hostile trog, and you will have to tame it first. Sadly, trogs cannot be tamed. But Narhiril understands the interactions more than I do, so maybe there could be a compromise for your concept? I've always thought the tech tree was purely mechanical and ethical. We're dwarves, dammit!

Vanahelmer, how the heck do you train your military? Danger room? Cuz otherwise the voidwalkers shreds through soldiers not armored in candy like paper, and their archers punch through even addy.

keep em in cages!
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Stirk

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.17a *=*=* [DF 0.34.07]
« Reply #2114 on: April 15, 2012, 09:30:14 pm »

Biological labs sound kind of awesome as well...

I was personally wondering for the far future of the robotics. We have the technology for AI spiders, what else can we accomplish? Mech armor? Androids? Gods of metal (Duex Ex Machina, if you prefer). The !!SCIENCE!! tree has a lot of potential and I can't wait to see what it accomplishes.

It will also be interesting to see it's parallels to the ritual tree. An archer who throws ice in the ritual tree? Magnetic guns in the science tree. Fire breathing dwarves in the ritual tree? Spider pits in the science tree. Bringing dead paragons back to life? Making elixirs that defend dwarfs from dying in the first place. Hands of Armork with steel skin and amazing powers? Can't wait to see what the parallel is in the !!SCIENCE!! tree...
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