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What would you most like to see next from LFR?

More tech tree!
- 36 (26.1%)
More ritual tree!
- 8 (5.8%)
More lore!
- 12 (8.7%)
More mythical weapons/armor!
- 22 (15.9%)
Plagues!
- 28 (20.3%)
More secrets!
- 21 (15.2%)
More mechanical constructs!
- 11 (8%)

Total Members Voted: 137


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Author Topic: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.21a *=*=* [DF 0.34.11]  (Read 403561 times)

narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1605 on: March 07, 2012, 11:08:38 am »

I'm so happy that this worked in testing that I'm going to go ahead and share it with you guys. 


Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.  This is a delightfully evil feature, so you'll get both a heads up and a way to counter this when it comes around.  Those damnable lizards are getting craftier.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 12:20:32 pm by narhiril »
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SalmonGod

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1606 on: March 07, 2012, 03:01:22 pm »

Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.  This is a delightfully evil feature, so you'll get both a heads up and a way to counter this when it comes around.  Those damnable lizards are getting craftier.

.........

Ok.... you have to let us craft tin foil hats for our dwarves now.
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Meph

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1607 on: March 07, 2012, 03:16:59 pm »

Paranoia for the win. :)

Good to see that you are a more proficient interaction caster then I am. My resurrected creatures startet attacking people ^^
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Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1608 on: March 07, 2012, 05:43:45 pm »

I'm so happy that this worked in testing that I'm going to go ahead and share it with you guys. 


Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.  This is a delightfully evil feature, so you'll get both a heads up and a way to counter this when it comes around.  Those damnable lizards are getting craftier.

Hm, what if the paragons die, and require a burial or memorial slabs? What if you memorialized and buried them? Can they still be revived? What if dismembered? Will they revive the severed arm separately from the body, then the body itself? Or will every bodypart create a new paragon?

Just some precautions.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 06:04:10 pm by Pan »
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narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1609 on: March 07, 2012, 06:50:26 pm »

I'm so happy that this worked in testing that I'm going to go ahead and share it with you guys. 


Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.  This is a delightfully evil feature, so you'll get both a heads up and a way to counter this when it comes around.  Those damnable lizards are getting craftier.

Hm, what if the paragons die, and require a burial or memorial slabs?  What if you memorialized and buried them? Can they still be revived? What if dismembered? Will they revive the severed arm separately from the body, then the body itself? Or will every bodypart create a new paragon?

Just some precautions.

I appreciate the concerns.  Here's how it will work...

Dead paragons are revived using their corpse as the target.  Since only one corpse is ever created, only one can be revived (the dismembered limbs stay as they were).  If these limbs are re-animated by a necromancer, they will function as normal.   Buried, memorialized?  No problem.  You just need the corpse.  Preferably, you should try to keep it away from those emberlight nutcases. 

Here's where it gets interesting.  If an undead limb is healed by a healer, it will remain an undead limb, but will regenerate the rest of the body parts associated with it.  Basically, it means that a paragon and a necromancer team can duplicate undead servants, so all I need to do here is restrict the target for the healing interaction so that it can't target undead.  Paragons will not resurrect the undead using their heal interactions. 

For technical reasons, paragon healing does not have any effect on emberlight warriors or wavebreakers - but I can balance things around this.  The heal interaction works by transforming a dwarf into another creature momentarily (I've been using the will o' wisp, it seems appropriate) and then allowing them to revert back to their normal state, fully healed and very much alive.  For a creature already under the effects of a transformation (i.e. emberlights), this has no effect, since only one transformation can take place at a time.

Now you may be thinking...  but narhiril...  if you can't heal or revive transformed creatures, how do paragons heal themselves?  Fortunately, I've worked this out.

Emberlights and wavebreakers use body transformations because I needed to do this to change them physiologically (specifically to make them immune to fire).  Paragons will just be regular dwarves, given a new name and abilities via syndrome that does not require a transformation.  For this reason, they will be able to heal and resurrect.  I have also taken the time to verify that syndromes persist through death, so a dead paragon will revive with all of its abilities intact.

It's a little eerie, actually, how well this is working out so far.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 06:52:54 pm by narhiril »
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Stirk

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1610 on: March 07, 2012, 07:18:55 pm »

I am personally interested in how the whole reviving thing would effect the dwarf's mood. Or more accurately, the mood of everyone else. How does a dwarf feel about a love one dieing and them coming back? Would the family still be sad, or would the mood be gone?

It would be kind of interesting to make an invincible fort with a vampire who did the ceremony. Goblin attack, killing fifty somehow? Bring out the vampire, possibly right into the graveyard reviving everyone. Cave crocodiles uninizing and taking down your miners while your military is fighting the goblins? Take out the vampire. Someone died to a vampire attack when the vampire got out? Use the vampire. Emberlight warriors starting a fortress fire? Memorialize the dead and move on.

Another question is how this effects the kill counter. Does the kill count if they get revived again?
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narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1611 on: March 07, 2012, 07:23:00 pm »

I am personally interested in how the whole reviving thing would effect the dwarf's mood. Or more accurately, the mood of everyone else. How does a dwarf feel about a love one dieing and them coming back? Would the family still be sad, or would the mood be gone?

It would be kind of interesting to make an invincible fort with a vampire who did the ceremony. Goblin attack, killing fifty somehow? Bring out the vampire, possibly right into the graveyard reviving everyone. Cave crocodiles uninizing and taking down your miners while your military is fighting the goblins? Take out the vampire. Someone died to a vampire attack when the vampire got out? Use the vampire. Emberlight warriors starting a fortress fire? Memorialize the dead and move on.

Another question is how this effects the kill counter. Does the kill count if they get revived again?

I honestly don't know, as I've not tried this interaction in fortress mode yet.  This calls for some !!SCIENCE!!

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1612 on: March 07, 2012, 08:14:27 pm »

My guess is dwarf thoughts wouldn't take into account resurrection at all, unless the dwarf died twice.  Same with the kill counter.  I wouldn't be surprised to see stuff like "six Urist McCatten in SyrupAxed" 

I had no idea the interactions were powerful enough to handle stuff like this.   :D
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Meph

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1613 on: March 07, 2012, 09:02:19 pm »

I sent you a little something, hope it works with your mod.
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Putnam

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1614 on: March 07, 2012, 09:31:28 pm »

Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.

Wha? How? I can't even imagine the method through which this would be done.

SalmonGod

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1615 on: March 07, 2012, 10:09:20 pm »

Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.

Wha? How? I can't even imagine the method through which this would be done.

I just think it's hilarious that she chose to give this ability to the lizard people :P

If I ever find one of these things infiltrating a fort, I'll seriously mod in tin foil hats myself if I have to, and make them required uniform for the whole fortress.
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In the land of twilight, under the moon
We dance for the idiots
As the end will come so soon
In the land of twilight

Maybe people should love for the sake of loving, and not with all of these optimization conditions.

Courtesy Arloban

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1616 on: March 07, 2012, 10:15:03 pm »

Seriously that's awesome, everyone of my reanimated creatures kills the creator.(Though for Frankenstein's Monster that's appropriate)
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Pan

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1617 on: March 07, 2012, 10:15:35 pm »

Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.

Wha? How? I can't even imagine the method through which this would be done.

Indeed, I am also pretty confused by this. And besides, strange new 34.05 interactions aside, how does this even work lore-wise? Pretending to be leper dwarves?

As for the buffs and such for the units of the Twins and Kerox (guys with all the buffs), would they constantly rebuff buffed creatures? Also, will the healer units specifically target injured people instead of spamming this on nearby dwarves whenever the cooldown ends? Apologies I don't really know much about these new interactions.

And a question: Will there be any soldiers who can spew webs? I'd like to capture voidwalkers in cage traps (with ease) without heavily injuring them through a fall or cave in.
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Imp

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1618 on: March 08, 2012, 03:46:01 am »

Mmm.  So happy this is out.

Have next to no time to touch it, but still very pleased with it.

Had a short chunk of time this eve to toy with the newly improved toy.

Spotted two new oddities in the supplies from the parent civ (one's not so odd, but the other makes up for it).

Under bars both the somewhat familiar (I've actually never used it yet) Visthel's embrace and the not mentioned in change log or manual 'dwarven alchemical remedy' are available, each for 25 units apiece.  I feel totally spoiled by the 'dar' and imagine that it will cure or reduce in severity illnesses (like the syndromes alchemists can catch)
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narhiril

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Re: *=*=* Legends of Forlorn Realms (LFR 2012) v0.15f *=*=* [DF 0.34.05]
« Reply #1619 on: March 08, 2012, 02:09:57 pm »

Mmm.  So happy this is out.

Have next to no time to touch it, but still very pleased with it.

Had a short chunk of time this eve to toy with the newly improved toy.

Spotted two new oddities in the supplies from the parent civ (one's not so odd, but the other makes up for it).

Under bars both the somewhat familiar (I've actually never used it yet) Visthel's embrace and the not mentioned in change log or manual 'dwarven alchemical remedy' are available, each for 25 units apiece.  I feel totally spoiled by the 'dar' and imagine that it will cure or reduce in severity illnesses (like the syndromes alchemists can catch)

It's a soap that's there to be imported, since you couldn't import soap before.  :)

It didn't make the patch notes because it was a rare byproduct of an advanced alchemy experiment that I hadn't fully tested.  It wasn't originally supposed to be importable, but I kind of like the way it turned out, so I'm sticking to that.


Also, I have devised a way for lizardman spies to hide themselves among migrant waves.

Wha? How? I can't even imagine the method through which this would be done.

Indeed, I am also pretty confused by this. And besides, strange new 34.05 interactions aside, how does this even work lore-wise? Pretending to be leper dwarves?

As for the buffs and such for the units of the Twins and Kerox (guys with all the buffs), would they constantly rebuff buffed creatures? Also, will the healer units specifically target injured people instead of spamming this on nearby dwarves whenever the cooldown ends? Apologies I don't really know much about these new interactions.

And a question: Will there be any soldiers who can spew webs? I'd like to capture voidwalkers in cage traps (with ease) without heavily injuring them through a fall or cave in.

Lizardman spies are masters of disguise and illusions.  On the technical side, it works in a similar way as a vampirism curse, except very heavily modified.  In legends mode, you will periodically see "(some new god) smote (some defiler dwarf), allowing an opportunity for a lizardman spy to take his place."  Technically speaking, it's still a dwarf, but it has "lizardman spy" appended to its name (and then hidden), and it can immigrate to your fortress.  Once there, it will pull levers and empty cages at random (MISCHIEVOUS tag).

In order to counter it, Pel's lesser servants will have an ability called "expose spy" that they will cast if they see a lizardman spy, which turns them into a berserk lizardman, "exposing" their disguise.  Ultimately you'll probably have Pel and Armok's servants lined up screening migrants as they enter your fortress, but a lizardman spy can cause some real damage before you unlock those if you're not paying close attention - which is how the lizardmen are supposed to work, through sabotage and subterfuge.  Admittedly, this is pretty elaborate, and I'll need to test it very thoroughly before I can speak for the end result, but it works well enough in theory to get a saboteur past your outer defenses long before the DF army arc comes around.

There aren't currently any plans for web dwarves, but tempests of Bartoth will be able to cast a wide-area, short-duration paralyze spell that should have a similar effect.  Buffs and debuffs are what I've spent a lot of time recently working on to structure them so that dwarves will only use them when appropriate (which involves a lot of manipulation and testing of target tags).  The end result should be dwarves that will not buff already buffed dwarves, will not debuff already debuffed enemies, and will not heal dwarves that aren't injured*.

*The inner workings of the last bit are so elaborate and unproven that I can't yet promise that they will work.  Meph and I have been developing a way for dwarves to detect each other's injuries.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2012, 02:29:17 pm by narhiril »
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