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More tech tree!

36 (26.1%)

More ritual tree!

8 (5.8%)

More lore!

12 (8.7%)

More mythical weapons/armor!

22 (15.9%)

Plagues!

28 (20.3%)

More secrets!

21 (15.2%)

More mechanical constructs!

11 (8%)

Total Members Voted: 137

[astianax]

nah, slither weed's not lfr, but since i was trying to get *any* good or evil growing plant to show up wild, i figured i'd mention seeing one, even one from outside the mod, as a partial success. only partial 'cause i still dunno why they don't want to show up or why this one randomly did decide to grow

on other fronts, also still trying to determine why the kittens want to hoard all their tasty fishies instead of selling them to other races. or even their outposts, who have to do all the fishing themselves

[Pan]

Throwing gloves? Or something that resembles a glove, probably, like hand wraps or something.

This was the plan ^.^

Just for the sake of argument, one can throw projectile weapons barehanded perfectly well. Perhaps the technological advancement is a spring loaded knife in the hilt of a normal weapon? So before charging the enemy, they shoot a knife out the bottom handle of the weapon hilt?

[narhiril]

I'm debating how I want to do this.  It might come as a glove, it might come in the form of a "knife belt" (though, for technical reasons, it's going to have to be equipped in the hand).  It's not really about the ability to throw them without a glove, it's about how it will actually work.

I do like the idea of a spring-loaded knife launcher, but I think I'll tack that on to another advancement.   I'm leaning towards a "spiked throwing glove" for the basic weapon and using striker for the melee attack.  They're really more of a novelty item at this point in time, but they're going to get incorporated in some new weapons down the stretch.

[Trapezohedron]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

[Pan]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

 I actually googled that up right before I posted 'my' idea. That link is in dark orange for me 

 For the sake of argument, a spiked glove is really not that technologically advanced to make either. It sounds like something that would be available at the start.

[narhiril]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

 I actually googled that up right before I posted 'my' idea. That link is in dark orange for me 

 For the sake of argument, a spiked glove is really not that technologically advanced to make either. It sounds like something that would be available at the start.

I agree, which is why I won't be tying it to the tech tree.  It will be available from embark, mostly as a way of getting the "thrown" class of ammunition on the table for the tech tree to take advantage of later.

[Pan]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

 I actually googled that up right before I posted 'my' idea. That link is in dark orange for me 

 For the sake of argument, a spiked glove is really not that technologically advanced to make either. It sounds like something that would be available at the start.

I agree, which is why I won't be tying it to the tech tree.  It will be available from embark, mostly as a way of getting the "thrown" class of ammunition on the table for the tech tree to take advantage of later.

Once again, for the sake of argument, barehanded throwing of a knife or axe is still possible, and if I was a dwarf, I would, instead of grabbing an axe throwing glove and a belt full of throwing axes and fighting, I would make the much more sensible choice of a melee weapon + handful of throwing axes (throw them barehanded). Your method works and everything, but frankly I find this a little strange.

On hindsight, though, dwarves carrying crossbows but not side arm melee weapons (not using them when in melee) also doesn't make sense in vanilla gameplay.

By the way, is it possible to get other races to bring their race specific weapons and shields during trade? Cuz if so, perhaps you could give Nephilim powerful weaponry that can only be imported from them. I mean, Nephilim are more advanced than dwarves, right? I've recently seen a movie regarding how during the colonial ages, China and Japan and other less advanced countries would import Western weaponry as expensive but tactically useful weapons. Just a thought.

[Sunday]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

 I actually googled that up right before I posted 'my' idea. That link is in dark orange for me 

 For the sake of argument, a spiked glove is really not that technologically advanced to make either. It sounds like something that would be available at the start.

I agree, which is why I won't be tying it to the tech tree.  It will be available from embark, mostly as a way of getting the "thrown" class of ammunition on the table for the tech tree to take advantage of later.

Once again, for the sake of argument, barehanded throwing of a knife or axe is still possible, and if I was a dwarf, I would, instead of grabbing an axe throwing glove and a belt full of throwing axes and fighting, I would make the much more sensible choice of a melee weapon + handful of throwing axes (throw them barehanded). Your method works and everything, but frankly I find this a little strange.

See, I think the problem with barehanded ax throwing is purely mechanical. "Throwing gloves" are a workaround, not something put in for versimilitude.

One cannot equip throwing weapons in DF fort mode, as much as we would be able to do it. If someone wants to create an "ax thrower" dwarf, there has to be some mechanism for getting the dwarf to equip the axes. To do that, one might have to create a situation analogous to a crossbow: a "weapon" (here, the throwing glove) that fires the "ammunition" (here, throwing axes). One can't just give a dwarf some weapons you've created and tell him to throw them if possible.

Of course, if you can think of a way to implement throwing axes without such a workaround, then that's awesome.

[Pan]

Speaking of knife launchers... this might inspire you guys a bit.

 I actually googled that up right before I posted 'my' idea. That link is in dark orange for me 

 For the sake of argument, a spiked glove is really not that technologically advanced to make either. It sounds like something that would be available at the start.

I agree, which is why I won't be tying it to the tech tree.  It will be available from embark, mostly as a way of getting the "thrown" class of ammunition on the table for the tech tree to take advantage of later.

Once again, for the sake of argument, barehanded throwing of a knife or axe is still possible, and if I was a dwarf, I would, instead of grabbing an axe throwing glove and a belt full of throwing axes and fighting, I would make the much more sensible choice of a melee weapon + handful of throwing axes (throw them barehanded). Your method works and everything, but frankly I find this a little strange.

See, I think the problem with barehanded ax throwing is purely mechanical. "Throwing gloves" are a workaround, not something put in for versimilitude.

One cannot equip throwing weapons in DF fort mode, as much as we would be able to do it. If someone wants to create an "ax thrower" dwarf, there has to be some mechanism for getting the dwarf to equip the axes. To do that, one might have to create a situation analogous to a crossbow: a "weapon" (here, the throwing glove) that fires the "ammunition" (here, throwing axes). One can't just give a dwarf some weapons you've created and tell him to throw them if possible.

Of course, if you can think of a way to implement throwing axes without such a workaround, then that's awesome.

Yes, I was referring to realistically, a dwarf would not need to equip a spiked glove to be able to throw axes. I understand the mechanics.

I believe I read somewhere before that gnomeblight is fatal to gnomes, who gets necrosis when they step on it. I believe, narhiril, that this could be exploited and shoe horned into the technology tree somewhere to make.. oh I don't know... FACE ROT TO VOIDWALKER SCUM? Perhaps you could make it out of voracious maws? Frankly, I find atrophic bliss' weaponizing effects is... well, I'm sure no one has ever tried doing that before. (I must say it was a rather big let down once I realized the 'weaponizable bio weapon' was severely limited in deployment and effectiveness)

Heck, given the large amount of lore you devote to plants, I'm surprised there is only one reaction (transmutation), not an entire section (or sub section) of technology tree to cover some aspects of it.

[narhiril]

The stressed-out (finals week) college student viciously hacks the quote wall in the lower body with her *mithril reaver*, and the severed part sails off in an arc!

To be fair, solid material weaknesses won't be possible until the next release, and gnomeblight is not exactly easy to use in its current state.  That being said, an alchemical reaction that yields a volatile liquid would work.  Actually deploying it is a bit difficult with current abilities, and you would probably need to do something similar to what you have to do with gnomeblight to actually get it working.

It's going to need a contact syndrome, and it's going to be pretty easily countered by any sort of footwear, but I can probably work something out to specifically counter a certain enemy.  I could even make it require voracious maws, or use them as a "natural" alternative to another, synthetic reaction (this might be best, given the current state of good/evil plants).

Also, Pan, the only thing I could think after reading your post was "STOP RIGHT THERE, VOIDWALKER SCUM!"  Thanks.

[astianax]

random thing i noticed earlier, while playing with meowkin as a civ controlled race. their creature file has them listed as [PET] and gives a pet value of 300. that's rather odd and unexpected for a sentient race (but, in a way, goes with their whole slavery being acceptable) but, got in the way on my first embark, when they were all pets of themselves and could only get the option to butcher themselves/each other. was a bit silly, but easily fixed

and, about testing them as a civ, got them delivering fish (with the [USE_ANIMAL_PRODUCTS] tag) but, that tag, even when they refuse to kill animals, even in self defense, has them bringing various meats and leathers to sell, too. grr, frustrating lack of flexibility with some of these tags. can't have them just bring fish, milk, and wool, they've gotta bring meat and hides too or nothing from animals

...what i wouldn't give for variations of the common domestic tag. like aquatic/amphibious, good, evil, savage, or flying (that way, the nephilim could go back to flying and only have flying pack animals)

speaking of the nephilim, pan, if you want to specify them to bring stuff (and any other race, too), there's a guild representative position that can be added to the entity raws. they'll then bring a person to talk to your leader, akin to the dwarf liaison, and let you specify what they bring with their next caravan. although, adding that to the nephilim can get a little overwhelming when they show up 3 times a year...

[Pan]

The stressed-out (finals week) college student viciously hacks the quote wall in the lower body with her *mithril reaver*, and the severed part sails off in an arc!

To be fair, solid material weaknesses won't be possible until the next release, and gnomeblight is not exactly easy to use in its current state.  That being said, an alchemical reaction that yields a volatile liquid would work.  Actually deploying it is a bit difficult with current abilities, and you would probably need to do something similar to what you have to do with gnomeblight to actually get it working.

It's going to need a contact syndrome, and it's going to be pretty easily countered by any sort of footwear, but I can probably work something out to specifically counter a certain enemy.  I could even make it require voracious maws, or use them as a "natural" alternative to another, synthetic reaction (this might be best, given the current state of good/evil plants).

Shoes... Hadn't thought of that.

Just a thought, but Shedim do not have clothes, right?

[narhiril]

Shoes... Hadn't thought of that.

Just a thought, but Shedim do not have clothes, right?

No, shedim don't.

Also, here's a magnetic dart launcher.  Hopefully this does it justice, this was my first time ever using gimp for concept art.

Spoiler: MDL (click to show/hide)

The bayonet is made of copper, with a copper dart loaded up.  The weapon is held like a crossbow, with one hand on the padded area (between the bayonet and the coil) and one on the bottom handle, resting the stock on the shoulder.  It is fired by pulling the entire weapon in towards the dwarf's body, compressing the stock and completing the circuit, which fires the external capacitors and energizes the coil. 

Once upgraded with the bayonet, the weapon can be swung by the stock very much like a sword, though only the leading edge will be much use (you can bash them with the coil, I suppose, but there isn't much point, and the alchemists will be furious when they have to fish another set of goblin teeth out of the firing mechanisms).

Because there is no string to draw, the weapon can be loaded and fired as quickly as a dwarf can keep putting darts in it.  The downside to the magnetic dart launcher is that it is limited by the amount of power it can hold in its capacitors, meaning it has to sacrifice some power in order to fire a reasonable number of shots before it has to be recharged.  This problem can be partially alleviated by research, which can increase the number of capacitors it can carry at once.  Also, you're going to need to include iron when making magnetic darts (of any material), so making copper darts will require a copper bar and an iron bar.  Fortunately, you get a lot for your investment - magnetic darts are produced in stacks of 50.  And if you run out of iron (I don't imagine this ever being a problem, but for the sake of argument), you can always pray for more at the shrine of victory for a slow but inexhaustible supply.

For technical reasons, you won't actually have to recharge the capacitors at any point, they just serve as a component of weapon construction and lore.  Just imagine your little military dwarves furiously pumping the handle during their down time to keep them up and running.

[IamanElfCollaborator]

I can imagine that a military dwarf spending his time keeping that up and running would have a very strong left or right arm, depending on which hand he uses to pump it.

[Putnam]

I can imagine that a military dwarf spending his time keeping that up and running would have a very strong left or right arm, depending on which hand he uses to pump it.

giggity

in all seriousness, I'm sure they switch