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More tech tree!

36 (26.1%)

More ritual tree!

8 (5.8%)

More lore!

12 (8.7%)

More mythical weapons/armor!

22 (15.9%)

Plagues!

28 (20.3%)

More secrets!

21 (15.2%)

More mechanical constructs!

11 (8%)

Total Members Voted: 137

[narhiril]

Not sure if this has been mentioned already, but in the female weapon savant entry, it should say [CASTE_PROFESSION_NAME:WEAPONSMITH:weapon prodigy:weapon prodigies] but instead says [CASTE_PROFESSION_NAME:ARMORER:weapon prodigy:weapon prodigies].  And now that I've said that, I'm going to go try this mod for the first time. Certainly looks fun. And Fun.

Good catch, I'll fix this immediately.

Hey Narhiril, 14c will add shrine reactions, right? I mean, I know you'd like to wait till the next version, but I would like to make shrines to have a purpose when I build them. In fact, why not move all the 'greater' type rituals to their respective shrines?

Also, not to rush or anything, but you haven't given up on concept art, right? Cuz the voidwalkers weren't bad at all.

Also, I like Angus' idea. When that gets implemented, my troops will carry javelin throwing spears and crossbows with a BFS attached to it, like a Brute Spiker in Halo. It's almost like the red shirts back in the Napolean days, where they shoot as they advance, then fight with bayonets.

0.14c will add some reactions to the three shrines.  The reason I am not moving the greater rituals is because they do not correlate perfectly with the shrine themes (five types of ritual, but only three shrines in tier 2), so I thought it would be more appropriate to leave them at the altar.

Bear in mind that "greater" is a relative term.  They certainly have better possible rewards than lesser rituals, but they're still just kicking out items of relatively early-game usage.  I don't expect to see anyone carrying a bloodforged club when a (superior) tungsten maul is available.  That being said, future advances in the ritual tree will create more lucrative rewards.  Expect a reward item from the final tier of the ritual tree to rival the power of ether, hadrine, or voidshard.

So, while it may be called the "greater ritual of power," expect something along the lines of the "ceremonial procession of the martyred" to overshadow it in the future, which may in turn be overshadowed by something like "superior ritual of the encroaching void," which may again be overshadowed by the next tier's "grand invocation of the inevitable tempest."

Note that the exact names of these rituals were just thrown out from the top of my head, and may or may not end up resembling those of actual developments.

The tiers are currently planned out as follows, but some aspects are not yet finalized... (some spoilers present)

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

LFR RITUAL TREE

green = done, completed for 0.14b
yellow = done, completed for 0.14c
orange = not done, planned for 0.14c
red = not done, relies on unreleased features, will not see release in 0.14c

-------
Base Level

Sacrificial Altar (prereq: none)
    -power (lesser, greater)
    -shelter (lesser, greater)
    -wealth (lesser, greater)
    -sustenance (lesser, greater)
    -knowledge (lesser, greater)
    -Kogut's first sacrifice (ties in with mechanical tree to produce fishing pond)

-------
Tier 1

Temple Component Foundry (prereq: none)
    -enormous gold goblet (gold bars)
    -silver candelabra (silver bars)
    -overgrown pedestal (stone and plants)

-------
Tier 2

Fishing Pond (hybrid, prereq: advanced mechanisms, Kogut's magical fish food)
    -fish (no input)
    -make lure (thread and stone)
    -fish for the "big one" (consumes lure)

Shrine of Nature (prereq: overgrown pedestals)
    -ritual of nature (takes seeds, produces soap or wooden ammunition)
    -prayer for amnesty (no input, can produce soap)
    -prayer for healing (no input, won't appear in 0.14c, may end up being cut due to technical limitations)

Shrine of Victory (prereq: silver candelabras)
    -ritual of victory (takes body parts, produces iron bars or weapons)
    -prayer for fortitude (no input, can produce iron-quality armor)
    -prayer for supremacy (no input, but I'm not telling you what it does.  This will not be present in 0.14c due to technical limitations)
    -bless statue (takes iron statue, produces iron torchbearer gargoyle, an item used for another future tie-in with the mechanical tree)

Shrine of Prosperity (prereq: enormous gold goblets)
    -ritual of prosperity (takes gold crafts, produces flux stone)
    -prayer for fortune (no input, can produce brass, black bronze, billon, white gold, any pewter, or nickel silver bars)
    -prayer for celebration (takes empty barrel, can produce booze)

-------
Tier 3

Temple of Fire (hybrid, prereq: iron torchbearer gargoyles, advanced mechanisms, treatise on the effects of gasoline on fire)
    -prayer for industry (no input, can produce fuel or flux)

Temple of Ice

Temple of Light

Temple of Shadow

------
Tier 4

Temple Complex of Destruction

Temple Complex of Creation

------
Tier 5

Grand Altar of Armok

Cathedral of Visthel

Pel's Sanctuary

Halls of Kogut

Vaults of Voruk

Also, expect more concept art over the next few days.

[Zaerosz]

Another question: for the minor metals of the gods, e.g. clouded crystalline, bloodforged, etc.: are we going to be able to upgrade these in any way, e.g. transmute them into major metals of (god)? Because I was rather excited at getting a -clouded crystalline shamshir- until i looked at the stats and realised it would be about as deadly as a pool noodle.

[narhiril]

Another question: for the minor metals of the gods, e.g. clouded crystalline, bloodforged, etc.: are we going to be able to upgrade these in any way, e.g. transmute them into major metals of (god)? Because I was rather excited at getting a -clouded crystalline shamshir- until i looked at the stats and realised it would be about as deadly as a pool noodle.

It's roughly equivalent to a lighter version of iron - a bit better than a pool noodle, but certainly not very useful after a few years or against a stronger enemy.

I had not planned to directly convert these "lesser" weapons to better ones, but the idea behind that is quite doable.  A ritual could turn a clouded crystalline shamshir into, say, a translucent crystalline shamshir (roughly equal to steel), and then a radiant crystalline shamshir (roughly equal to damascus steel).  This is an interesting concept for a new workshop, and I think I'll play around with it.

Oh, and for the record, bloodforged bolts kick ass.  Expect a more direct way to produce them (or something similar) in the future, later tiers.

[Zaerosz]

Are they really as strong as iron? The only stats they actually have are density and material value.

[narhiril]

Are they really as strong as iron? The only stats they actually have are density and material value.

They pull most of their properties from a custom template (I think it's RITUAL_MATERIAL_TEMPLATE, just off the top of my head), which is basically copied from iron.  The values defined under the individual materials are only needed for when they differ from the template (typically color, name, value, and density).

[Pan]

So, narhiril... you're not worried about the limit of custom reactions?

[narhiril]

So, narhiril... you're not worried about the limit of custom reactions?

Based on what I've heard recently... not particularly.  I'll cross that bridge if I ever come to it, but I'm not even sure there's a bridge to be crossed.  While Mephansteras seems to have encountered a legitimate problem, I think, based solely on what he's shared, that it's probably related to him trying to cram too many more reactions into a stock workshop.  If there was a hard cap on custom reactions, it seems odd that we'd just be finding out about it now.  There are dozens of "mix" mods out there, surely someone else would have stumbled on it before while trying to cram dozens of mods together.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I have a hunch that I'm not - and I usually get pretty good hunches.

Development will continue as normal.  There's no sense pausing and dealing with a hypothetical issue until I actually run into it - which may not be for some time, if at all.  Target date is September 4th, but it may be a day or two early if things go more smoothly than anticipated.

Tonight, I'm working on the soap-producing reaction.  I haven't quite gotten it nailed down yet, but I think I'm close.

[Carn]

I love the idea of praying for soap. Filthy, vomit encrusted, half naked dwarves all bowing at an altar amuses me. Also the idea of soap raining from the sky in a vengeful shower. The soap god is an angry god.

This mod is awesome.

[TehNoob]

Narhiril, I'll be playing through a game now to get some screenshots for the main page, if that's OK with you.

[Angus]

Creature request, if that's possible or OK with you.

The Ulbungek (vaguely meaning 'Mule Lizard' in dwarven)
 A grazing, hooved large reptilian creature that looks like a rhino, but has many reptilian features (eyes, a frill on it's neck, forked tongue, tail. The head is entirely lizard (think komodo dragon), and the tail of a lizard. The body is scaled). Males have large horns, and both genders have a tusk on the nose. It is prone to rage, but cannot be war trained because of their obstinacy. They require lots of grazing (same as a cow). It lives in caverns, but some have been domesticated by the dwarves (so make a wild and tamed variety). It has a large horn. It can be milked.

This creature can pretty much remove the need for cows, mules and yaks. (not that they had much use in the first place) I also sketched it a little on Paintbrush.app, I'll upload it if you think this is a good idea.

Iron Grub
 Another grazer. These creatures appear in caverns, and have a very tough hide. (As hard as bronze/copper/a weak metal, and quite valuable) They could be the lowest of the leather tough creatures of the tech tree you mentioned, narhiril. I would request adding in them shooting rocks (like a magma crab), but I recall a mod 'Slimelands' doing the same, making it seem unoriginal.
 

[o_O[WTFace]]

So I noticed weapons and armor still take one bar each to forge.  I think this is fixable if you want to, by multiplying all material sizes of weapons and armor by 150.  At some point materials were changed to make way for partial bar useage, or something, but the raw values were not increased to account for this.  So a breastplate takes 9/150 = 1 bar instead of 450/150 = 3 like it used to.

[Pan]

Narhiril, it would be nice if you could make a noble position that comes along when a Baron does - High Septon (Whoops. Been reading too much SoIaF) Priest. He's purely for flavor, and make him able to command a squad of 3 (Plus himself). I would like my high priest to sacrifice some infidel goblin and voidwalkers   

[narhiril]

Narhiril, it would be nice if you could make a noble position that comes along when a Baron does - High Septon (Whoops. Been reading too much SoIaF) Priest. He's purely for flavor, and make him able to command a squad of 3 (Plus himself). I would like my high priest to sacrifice some infidel goblin and voidwalkers   

It's weird that you mention that, high priest was a position I had actually planned to include with this update.  I hadn't given them squad command, but it's something I could easily do.

So I noticed weapons and armor still take one bar each to forge.  I think this is fixable if you want to, by multiplying all material sizes of weapons and armor by 150.  At some point materials were changed to make way for partial bar useage, or something, but the raw values were not increased to account for this.  So a breastplate takes 9/150 = 1 bar instead of 450/150 = 3 like it used to.

I typically don't touch stock raws unless I have to.  You are free to make this change, but LFR will probably not include it for compatibility purposes.

Creature request, if that's possible or OK with you.

The Ulbungek (vaguely meaning 'Mule Lizard' in dwarven)
 A grazing, hooved large reptilian creature that looks like a rhino, but has many reptilian features (eyes, a frill on it's neck, forked tongue, tail. The head is entirely lizard (think komodo dragon), and the tail of a lizard. The body is scaled). Males have large horns, and both genders have a tusk on the nose. It is prone to rage, but cannot be war trained because of their obstinacy. They require lots of grazing (same as a cow). It lives in caverns, but some have been domesticated by the dwarves (so make a wild and tamed variety). It has a large horn. It can be milked.

This creature can pretty much remove the need for cows, mules and yaks. (not that they had much use in the first place) I also sketched it a little on Paintbrush.app, I'll upload it if you think this is a good idea.

Iron Grub
 Another grazer. These creatures appear in caverns, and have a very tough hide. (As hard as bronze/copper/a weak metal, and quite valuable) They could be the lowest of the leather tough creatures of the tech tree you mentioned, narhiril. I would request adding in them shooting rocks (like a magma crab), but I recall a mod 'Slimelands' doing the same, making it seem unoriginal.
 

I'll happily take a look if you upload it.

[Pan]

It's weird that you mention that, high priest was a position I had actually planned to include with this update.  I hadn't given them squad command, but it's something I could easily do.

Ha! They called me crazy! Those money spent on training telekinesis... worth it!

Anyway, Angus sort had had me thinking about the live stock question - why are we using above ground livestock?

[Carn]

Why use livestock at all? Grazers, that is. Carnivorous animals have no upkeep. Buy yourself a breeding pair of anything that doesn't graze. Bonus points for them being war trainable. Jam all the babies in one cage until they mature. Grazers are worse in every way than war trainable carnivores. They take up space more space, require healthy grass, don't fight enemies.....

Getting giant war trainable animals is pretty much the only reason to trade with elves, besides wood.