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[Phmcw]

Well, I may be wrong, but I think the three bans had nothing to do with meme or quote piramid, did they?

Actually, it's not that easy to get banned from these forums ; I got a few warning for being too belligerents, justified I think, and that's all. And I post in political/religious thread all the times.

The problem is that I think that toady guidelines are logical, what kind of chart will you make? We'll respect obvious etiquette?

However I'm surprised by who got banned. What the hell happened?

Edit:Ok looked in the sad thread. Oh well...

[Criptfeind]

Well, I may be wrong, but I think the three bans had nothing to do with meme or quote piramid, did they?

In a sense they did.

[soundandfury]

I can't see why. "Watching" posts might not add anything to a topic, but they dont get in the way of discussion either. It's a tool for people who wants to be reminded of something happening in a thread but doesn't want dozens of useless emails if it happens to be a popular one.

I guess that's fair enough.  Probably we should refactor it to instead just be advice - "Before making a 'Watching' post, consider whether you can make a post that adds something to the discussion, thereby getting the 'watching' for free.  Even 'Watching, because this is a good idea', 'Watching, because I really enjoy using this mod', or 'Watching, because I've encountered this bug too' are improvements."
Better?

Don't make it sound like an "us against them". We are the spammers, and even if we aren't, such a mindset does not contribute anything good.

Good point, I could have worded that better.  However, there is an inherent factionalisation which started a long time ago (at least a year) which we cannot pretend doesn't exist.  There has been a 'civil cold war' for quite some time, and while we're playing for a hearts and minds campaign, we need to be careful not to set off open warfare else it'll get very bloody indeed.  (Sorry about the tortured metaphor)

[3]

Get real. We are not going to 'make new rules' here. We are just going to post around and then be surprised when the vast majority that had nothing to do with this thread don't go along with what a small subset of the forums wants to do.

This is a powerless dictatorship pretending to be a democracy. Which I find the idea of such both funny and sad.

You're still fundamentally missing the point.

It doesn't matter if other users decide to go along with the plan, or not. It doesn't matter that what users say or do has no effect on how the forum is moderated or administrated. The point is to basically say "we swear to not make stupid posts with no content (and whatever else this thread adds up to, if anything), so we can do our best to avoid letting this sort of thing happen again", albeit in terms of less... finality.

To be frank, soundandfury, I think your choice of terms (ie "1776") has given Criptfeind (and probably others) completely the wrong idea.

[soundandfury]

Get real. We are not going to 'make new rules' here. We are just going to post around and then be surprised when the vast majority that had nothing to do with this thread don't go along with what a small subset of the forums wants to do.

This is a powerless dictatorship pretending to be a democracy. Which I find the idea of such both funny and sad.

You're still fundamentally missing the point.

It doesn't matter if other users decide to go along with the plan, or not. It doesn't matter that what users say or do has no effect on how the forum is moderated or administrated. The point is to basically say "we swear to not make stupid posts with no content (and whatever else this thread adds up to, if anything), so we can do our best to avoid letting this sort of thing happen again", albeit in terms of less... finality.

To be frank, soundandfury, I think your choice of terms (ie "1776") has given Criptfeind (and probably others) completely the wrong idea.

I think you're right, 3, but I was trying to tie in the fact that a bunch of disgruntled ex-members are setting up a new forum (they are the ones declaring independence, not us).

As for what the point is, as well as what 3 said, there's also an element of saying to the others, "this is all we're asking you to do/stop doing, we think you can do this without having any less fun (unless your intent is in fact to troll, which of course none of you would do)".  Also it'll be harder for them to paint us as joyless Puritans who want to expunge all mention of (insert frivolous topic here), once we've made clear what we actually want.

And, Criptfeind?  "dictatorship pretending to be a democracy"?  I'm afraid I don't understand you, since this is neither.
It's a consensus-driven discussion group, trying to draft a document to represent the views of its members (and create something its members, and those of like mind, can pledge to).  We're not voting on anything, and we're not forcing anything on anyone.

PS: I'm amazed at how much interest this has generated, and how fast it's got started.  There's clearly a lot of feeling about these issues.

[Darvi]

I think you're right, 3, but I was trying to tie in the fact that a bunch of disgruntled ex-members are setting up a new forum (they are the ones declaring independence, not us)

Huh? Waitwhatwhenwherehowwhowhy?

[freeformschooler]

I think you're right, 3, but I was trying to tie in the fact that a bunch of disgruntled ex-members are setting up a new forum (they are the ones declaring independence, not us)

Huh? Waitwhatwhenwherehowwhowhy?

Read the OP, he's not posting it here for fear of man I don't even know.

[Criptfeind]

So, this is basically about complaining about the shit posting and saying that 'I would never do such a thing!'

Or not. I am really geting mixed messages from you two.

[Darvi]

I have a short attention span and have problems with WoT's

So, this is basically about complaining about the shit posting and saying that 'I would never do such a thing!'

Or not. I am really geting mixed messages from you two.

Probably.

[3]

So, this is basically about complaining about the shit posting and saying that 'I would never do such a thing!'

No, this is about making sure we don't shitpost instead of just talk about not shitposting.

[Darvi]

Yeah, except that there's no way that shitposting can be prevented.

[Criptfeind]

Thus leaving the issue unsolved because if you do not shit post already then you are not a issue and if you do shit post my wall my cynicalness tells me you will not stop because of a quickly forgotten thread.

[Darvi]

Exactly. However, if somebody's offended, then instead of making such a thread, they could, oh I dunno... tell people to stop? Has anybody thought of that? Because the only person I remember doing that has been Janet.

[3]

Yeah, except that there's no way that shitposting can be prevented.

Thus leaving the issue unsolved because if you do not shit post already then you are not a issue and if you do shit post my wall my cynicalness tells me you will not stop because of a quickly forgotten thread.

Tip number two: After reading the OP, read the rest of the thread before replying. I already raised that point, and yes, it did occur to me that this sort of thing could turn into precisely the sort of cliquey circlejerk it was concieved to combat. But I think it's better than nothing.

[soundandfury]

Huh? Waitwhatwhenwherehowwhowhy?

Read the OP, he's not posting it here for fear of man I don't even know.

The reason I'm not posting it here is that, given recent events, I'm worried that if I do anything at all in this thread that pisses Toady off, it'll get locked or deleted and I'll get banned.  I imagine linking to the rival independent forums would piss Toady off.

Also, Captain doesn't want me to, and he's running the rival forums (as I understand it).  He's afraid of "forum vigilantes", whatever that means.

Anyway, if you really want to know where they are, ask in IRC.