Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Itsapaul]

Not that I'm really complaining, but is the bug where metal armor and such only take 1 bar to make regardless of how many it's supposed to?  Also, if it is, what's the best thing to make and melt down to train armorsmithing and weaponsmithing?  I saw something about breastplates but figured I'd ask since I never looked into weapons that much; used to have way more steel than I'd ever need.

[Sutremaine]

http://df.magmawiki.com/index.php/Melt

Leggings and trap weapons are best.

eta: Or they should be the best, I'm 99% certain the bar bug is still out there. In that case, breastplates are best for armourers.

[greycat]

All metal objects take 1 bar to create in DF2010.  Whether this is a bug or a feature is debatable.

(Yes, I know, the failure message says "Need 3 bars" or whatever, but you could argue that that part is the bug, not the 1-bar success.)

[Sutremaine]

It's a bug because it makes a whole tag ( [WAFERS] ) into a purely cosmetic change, and not even a customisable one. I have no idea why Toady hasn't fixed it yet.

[FearfulJesuit]

I think that if he fixed it people would riot. I mean, making steel already takes lots of time. If your steel armour sets need tens of bars each...

[Darkweave]

I think that if he fixed it people would riot. I mean, making steel already takes lots of time. If your steel armour sets need tens of bars each...

At present a handful of assorted traps and a squad of 6-10 Dwarfs in bronze/iron armour training from the end of the first year or so is plenty to defend you for the first few years giving you plenty of time to transition to steel. I'd worry that it would put even more people off of the current military system however. Maybe two bars would be more balanced, I don't know. Without digging straight down to the magma sea or embarking on a volcano it would take 210 bars to equip a squad of 10 in full metal. So 280 fuel for iron, or 175 for bronze (if you smelt the two ores in to each set of two bars).

[Sutremaine]

I think that if he fixed it people would riot. I mean, making steel already takes lots of time. If your steel armour sets need tens of bars each...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

So not bothered.

You do need to play smarter if you're using non-metal armour plus whatever the traders and goblins bring, and you need to bring enemies down quickly. The next thing I'll do is to make a shifted checkerboard around the entrance to prevent archers from being able to fire more than 3 tiles in any direction. Let's see a goblin snipe through solid wall...

[Quietust]

If your steel armour sets need tens of bars each...

...then it'd be just like it was back in 0.28.181.40d.

[Nameless Archon]

I have no idea why Toady hasn't fixed it yet.

Fixing it now, before caravans can deliver hundreds of metal bars, is putting the cart before the horse. Fix the wagons, and make sure players can get the resources, and then burden them with the need to get those resources.

It's probably not a lack of ability to fix this issue, but a lack of practical reason to fix it now.

[wuphonsreach]

I think that if he fixed it people would riot. I mean, making steel already takes lots of time. If your steel armour sets need tens of bars each...

It would need to be balanced out with raw ore giving multiple bars per smelt job.

Plus hauling needs an overhaul so that a single dwarf can carry multiple things at once when moving stuff to a stockpile.  (Basically, the "coins" issue.)

[JmzLost]

We made steel armor just fine in 40d, before the 1 bar bug.  When wagons get fixed, expect to see the bar bug fixed as well.  Hauling is a minor issue, I'm more concerned with getting my dwarves to restack items like bolts and tallow.

JMZ

[NecroRebel]

Of course, in 40d, a "full" suit of steel armor was significantly smaller than it is now, and combat wasn't nearly as deadly IIRC, so it wasn't quite as important.

The problem with fixing the 1-bar bug now is that there's not enough metal in most sites anymore, what with the rarer ores than earlier versions. What we need is a better way to get metals from offsite; it isn't just wagons that need fixing (in fact, pack animals now carry more than wagons did in 40d), but trade in general. Fortunately, that seems to be what Toady is spending his efforts on now.

[JmzLost]

A standard suit of armor is still the same.  The difference is you can tell a dwarf to wear what is effectively 3 suits of armor at the same time now.  Combat was just as deadly, but training was easier, and markdwarves were basically unstoppable. 

Mineral scarcity can be adjusted in worldgen, although finding sites rich in iron ore is more difficult since we can't see what the layer stones are.  I'm assuming that wagons will carry even more than pack animals once they're working again, and requesting the same thing at max priority year after year increases how much the traders bring.

I, too, am happy that the caravan/trade/economy system is being worked on, and look forward to the changes the military arc will bring, as well.

JMZ

[darkflagrance]

The breast plate actually protects less than 40d "platemail" did. However, the advent of armor layering makes up for that anyway.

[Ahrimahn]

The breast plate actually protects less than 40d "platemail" did. However, the advent of armor layering makes up for that anyway.

armorlayering isnt new its now just something you order even in boatmurdered they layered their armor