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[Cthulhu]

Urist, without citing sources you may as well be yelling NOPE NOPE NOPE IM RIGHT YOUR RONG.

[Urist is dead tome]

Urist, without citing sources you may as well be yelling NOPE NOPE NOPE IM RIGHT YOUR RONG.

When was it required?

[hamburgerfan]

So men are free to sign away their lives to the military, but the precious fragile females, they aren't free to make the choice to put their lives at extraordinary risk, for their countries?

That reeks of benevolent sexism.

They can fight better. Its a better decision not sexism.

I think shooting a gun isn't something that men are always better at.

Shooting a gun is not the only task soldiers are required to perform.

[Ochita]

Urist, without citing sources you may as well be yelling NOPE NOPE NOPE IM RIGHT YOUR RONG.

When was it required?

Forever. So all of this could just be your unfounded opinion.

[Cthulhu]

Urist, without citing sources you may as well be yelling NOPE NOPE NOPE IM RIGHT YOUR RONG.

When was it required?

It's not "required," but people are going to listen to what you're saying even less than they already are if you don't.

[Leafsnail]

This theoretically already happened during WWII, though...

Uh... did the US send out female soldiers?  I must confess I've never heard of it.

While the risks accepted by all-male infantry units are fairly even across the board (officers or operators of particularly hated weapons are mistreated in some conflicts), as the enemy is not always so civil and respectful towards women, there needs to be a better reason than simple gender politics to justify their extraordinary endangerment.

In an interview at a bar in downtown Dothan, not far from Fort Rucker, where she graduated last week from the Air Command and Staff College, Major Cornum said the sexual assault in Iraq in that winter of 1991 "ranks as unpleasant; that's all it ranks."

The tanned, pencil-thin doctor, noting that "there's a phenomenal amount of focus on this for the women but not for the men," argued that the abuse suffered by male P.O.W.'s was much worse than what she endured. She mentioned the mistreatment of Maj. Jeffrey S. Tice of the Air Force, who had a tooth explode from its socket when he was tortured with jolts of electricity. The Pentagon has said other P.O.W.'s were beaten with rubber hoses, boards, sticks, leather straps and hammers, shocked with cattle prods, threatened with dismemberment, deprived of food and coerced into making videotapes.

Yeah, clearly we should never have endangered this poor, delicate flower in this way, and men are much safer than women when captured.

[Urist is dead tome]

Urist, without citing sources you may as well be yelling NOPE NOPE NOPE IM RIGHT YOUR RONG.

When was it required?

Forever. So all of this could just be your unfounded opinion.

Fine, I'll cite the sources, but lets try to re-rail this thing.

[Darvi]

I am a better shot than any woman I know, but then again I only know 1 military woman and I've neer seen her shoot.

However, she and my mom could probably kick your ass back into the age of the dinosaurs with ease (I think she went through puberty back then). So much for them being the weaker sex.

[Urist is dead tome]

This theoretically already happened during WWII, though...

Uh... did the US send out female soldiers?  I must confess I've never heard of it.

While the risks accepted by all-male infantry units are fairly even across the board (officers or operators of particularly hated weapons are mistreated in some conflicts), as the enemy is not always so civil and respectful towards women, there needs to be a better reason than simple gender politics to justify their extraordinary endangerment.

In an interview at a bar in downtown Dothan, not far from Fort Rucker, where she graduated last week from the Air Command and Staff College, Major Cornum said the sexual assault in Iraq in that winter of 1991 "ranks as unpleasant; that's all it ranks."

The tanned, pencil-thin doctor, noting that "there's a phenomenal amount of focus on this for the women but not for the men," argued that the abuse suffered by male P.O.W.'s was much worse than what she endured. She mentioned the mistreatment of Maj. Jeffrey S. Tice of the Air Force, who had a tooth explode from its socket when he was tortured with jolts of electricity. The Pentagon has said other P.O.W.'s were beaten with rubber hoses, boards, sticks, leather straps and hammers, shocked with cattle prods, threatened with dismemberment, deprived of food and coerced into making videotapes.

Yeah, clearly we should never have endangered this poor, delicate flower in this way, and men are much safer than women when captured.

Your biggest complaint with the military was the rape issue now you're saying its not that bad?

[Cthulhu]

There's a difference between being raped by your fellow soldiers (A serious problem that needs to be addressed) and being raped as a POW (A risk, but an overblown one)

[Darvi]

And the former's less about being a woman and more about the gys deserving a bullet through their head. Or at least their genital area.

[Taricus]

Those guys aren't worth the bullet. use the knife instead.

[Ochita]

The hands?

[Darvi]

The boot.

[Vector]

This theoretically already happened during WWII, though...

Uh... did the US send out female soldiers?  I must confess I've never heard of it.

Sort of.

WWI and WWII are basically the reason why women are allowed to vote and hold the full range of jobs in the US.


Also, @Nikov: I may be totally wrong, here, but I do have a female relative who was in the Hitler Youth--and from what I've heard about the society of the time, the women were busy doing men's civilian work at home, and dislodging them for the front lines would have been stupid due to killing the support base.  Their job in the ideal society was to make Aryan babies and do housework--and that was basically it.

The evacuation west really didn't work that well.  All I heard was that bombs kept on bombing the shit out of the little farming village in question, and when the Red Army rolled by the only reason why my relative and her family weren't raped with the rest of their community was that they had a prisoner to vouch for them.  Hell, she didn't even know why they were fighting, or who the opposing army was, or anything about the Holocaust.  So... I don't think that the operation and decisions were quite as coherent as you described (based, of course, on solely anecdotal evidence).

I sort of feel like the vast incompetence of Nazi Germany in general should not lead us to assume that they had the correct, or incorrect, idea about women in infantry units.  I don't have the right answer, either, but I don't think we can say their reactions to a perceived need were necessarily rational or good.