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[nil]

I'm not even sure the OP was serious about there being some sort of specialized behavior associated with spiked armor, and if he/she was I'm positive no one else was.  The idea of armor spikes doing damage in some situations more generally is certainly worth discussing, though.

[Dave1004]

Well, exactly. I just thought it'd be useful to have spiked armor. Nobody said you can't wield a weapon, it'd be a bonus. As was said before, a few spikes in well-put places. Shoulders, knees, elbows, one on the head. Not a thousand spikes coating the armor. And, yes, you'd have to use a heavy breastplate or etc.

Thank you for explaining it perfectly, Nil. Sorry for posting yet again on this seemingly horrible idea of mine, but it's a free forums board, right? Nothing wrong with attempting something. Plus, this about it. You have your Dwarf wielding a huge battleaxe, slashing goblins to pieces. Suddenly the axe is knocked from your hand by a seven-foot-tall minotaur! He's closing in, what do you do?

Rush forwards, stab him in the knee with your helmet spike. Then, stab the elbow spike into the side of his leg, and thrash. Nothing is stronger than Dwarven steel, so even if the enemies were in armor, it'd still go through with enough momentum. Plus, all armor has a weak point. Leather behind the knees or under the shoulders for mobility, easy places to stab.

In DF, the spiked armor would be a bonus to wrestling, or whatnot. Hell, you have a BITING skill. How is this any different?

"The helmet spike tears through the left arm, tearing the muscle!"

Sorry for reviving a one day dead topic, but c'mon. It's cool. Seriously, you can eat crocodile eggs in this game, mine through the strongest metal with the cheapest metal pickaxe, and tear the muscle of a finger with an axe.

Lol...

[Phreak]

Good suggestion, even more so for the wrestlers! i loved the battleragers and their bits of orc still stuck on them after a battle XD.  Also Drizzt is slightly better then Thibbledworf Pwent Hmm i haven't kept tabs on any new books for Drizzt in over a year. Maybe i should check?

[Jeoshua]

Correlary to Godwins Law is Drizzt's Law.

Any suggestion given on an online forum that can be traced back to Drizzt, or any Forgotten Realms character, and nowhere else, is immediately considered forfeit.  First person to bring up Drizzt, or another Forgotten Realms Character, loses the argument in which is was brought up.

No, I did not just make up Drizzt's law.

[Phreak]

Ok...But since its just some fake law that some random person made up it holds no reason to stop a suggestion from going into DF. Also what argument? This is a suggestion thread. Should maybe add that spikes are already in but, if on armor(or weapons) adds a bonus to biting/slashing/holding/punching etc. if on the hand armor(gloves/gauntlets)

[catoblepas]

Spiked items doing bonus damage itself sounds like a straightforward and acceptable addition. Where people disagree with the suggestion is the proposal that battlerager-style wrestling and armor/weapons should be a valid option. I don't think anyone is arguing that headbutting someone with a spiked helmet or bashing them with a spiked shield should be more effective then hitting them with a plain helmet or a bare head, but there are a lot of aspects about what works in combat and what doesn't that Salvatore does not understand (one of the reasons for Drizzit's law, I imagine)-a suit of armor like the battleragers are described as wearing would be an extreme hindrance in any 'realistic' combat situation, and would be less effective and more complicated to manufacture then a suit of plate armor and an axe. For those who are interested in this sort of combat, I did post a modding workaround earlier in this thread, which should satisfy that itch. There really isn't any need for battleragers in vanilla DF though.

[Dave1004]

Cat.

You can fight four headed snake elephants made out of smoke.

HOW IS THAT REALISTIC? XD. Plus, Dwarves eat two meals a month. Two.

Do you eat two meals a month?

Also, the "Spiked items doing bonus damage" was what I was aiming for. Doesn't mean you can't send your dwarves out with spiked armor only!

Jeoshua: I've never heard of that :/. I just like reading about a nig-*cough* black person with pointy ears, slashing rapists and tentacle monsters to pieces. It's great fun!

Phreak is right. GO PHREAK!...

Huh. Phreak. I just noticed that.

[Jeoshua]

We want everything we like to be in Vanilla DF.  I, for example, would love steam engines and automatons.  But Toady doesn't want that, so I have to resign myself to modding as much of that as I can into the game, and suggesting improvements to the code-base that would make them possible.  The trick is, the suggestions I make would be applicable to more than just whatever feature I want.

For example, the [NEEDS_POWER] tag would be useful for much more than steampunk inspired devices.

On the other hand, battleragers require a specific item with a specific use... and it doesn't do much else as far as possible features that it could add.

Actually, come to think of it, a more generic implementation of this idea would allow for armored weapons, and weaponized armor.  In a general sense, that's something I would actually like to see.  Beings with magical flame armor that hurts those they are nearby to, spiked shields which could be used to bash enemies, and bladed gauntlets that keep you from getting your fingers chopped off are three ideas that spring easilly to mind.

So: Battleragers as a specific thing, no.  Weaponizable Armor as a general thing, yes.

[catoblepas]

Dave. I'm not sure you read my post completely. The fighting style of the Battleragers is not 'realistic' in the sense that it would be even less effective then sumo wrestling in a combat situation. Hugging and rubbing someone over your spiky, edged armor is an awfully specific form of combat, and there is no real reason to implement it in the game, considering how ineffective it would be in a combat situation against a mundane biped like a human, much less a 'four headed snake elephant made out of smoke' I fully support the implementation of item improvements adding qualities to attacks, but there is no reason to overall the wrestling system to accommodate what amounts to a completely useless form of wrestling from a specific culture in a specific setting that exists nowhere else. Worse still, the proposed changes to the wrestling system would only really benefit this particular form of wrestling, and would not help in any large degree to flesh out combat or DF in general. I support spikes on armor doing damage, but changing the combat system solely to accommodate a single, ineffective form of wrestling is silly, esp considering a solution is already available in the form of modding to those who truly desire battleragers in their game.

[Jeoshua]

Actually, there isn't a way to mod battlerager armor into the game as it stands.  You have [WEAPON]s and [ARMOR].  So either you're protecting yourself, OR you're doing damage with that item.  There is no in-between.

If what's on the table, and ALL that's on the table, is the ability for a piece of armor to do damage to enemies, I support it.

The whole spiky bondage wrestling I could do without, tho.

[IT 000]

Battleragers are in deep space, but certainly the ability to mod armor that has an attack on it would be nice. I have modded in Bracers to my corrosion mod, having a spiked bracer that could do a small amount of EDGE damage instead of a standard shield bash would be nice. Likewise, a spiked/studded glove would be a wanted addition to my mod. It wouldn't require a lot of work, just a bit of reorganizing. If you've ever looked at the raws, you will see that Weapons generally follow the same format as armor, but weapons have attacks, while armor has a defense% token.

[flieroflight]

That wouldn't be an effective combat method. First off you would need to get that close to them. Secondly, you would only shred their kneecaps due to a dwarf's height. Thirdly, you would never be able (short of a catapult) to gain enough force to penetrate armor, lastly, a person's hammer would still be more effective.

A competent wrestler who broke bones for a living would be better then this.

Heck, a dwarf armed with an adamantine warhammer would be better.

then, we need to be able to fire dwarfs from catapults. or elves. or nobles