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[IronyOwl]

I would like to point out that I haven't voted for anyone, so I'm still failing to see how you're thinking I'm "pushing for the easy lynch" here. I asked two players for their reasoning for voting each other; the day that becomes scummy is the day that I stop playing Mafia.

As Toaster has mentioned, this is because you're waiting to see which is easier. For you to claim not to see this reasoning is either disingenuous or overly defensive. Panicky, even.

Moreover, you made a point of them being in the lead on votes; if this wasn't to insinuate that one of them was going down, why mention it? Combined with explicitly stating that you have no case on either, and never mentioning that you have or ever had an opinion on either, it seems pretty clear that your sole interest in them is their lynchability.

I'm also more than a little peeved that you have the gall to tell me how I'm playing the game. Don't reflect your tactics on me.

Now, since you're going to continue to be obtuse morons, I'm going to wait until one of the two answers my questions, because otherwise I'm going to continue to get annoyed by your lack of common sense. If you have a legitimate question instead of a copy/paste job of Toaster, or if you think I've actually done something legitimately scummy instead of simply trying to find a reason to vote someone to appear active, then please, feel free to get my attention.

More defensiveness. "Stop telling me what I'm doing, in fact YOU'RE the one doing that!" followed by "This is stupid and you're stupid and we're done here and I'm going to keep doing what I've been doing but I'm still reasonable and town."

[NativeForeigner]

Native, who would your scumbuddy be? How would you play this game today?

Heh, I've been missing a few questions lately, whoops. Probably because my answer to these are always the same. My scumbuddy would be whomever Wuba assigns me and I would play the game like a townie, by hunting, remaining as active as possible, and implicating townies who slipped.

TolyK: What makes you think you come off as scummy?

Jokerman: What exactly were you trying to accomplish by pitting the two most suspected against each other?

[webadict]

Vote Count
------------------------
Akhier the Dragon hearted -
Darvi - TolyK, lordnincompoop, Tyberix,
Jokerman-EXE - Toaster, IronyOwl,
Pandarsenic -
Tyberix -
TolyK - Ottofar, Darvi,
Toaster -
NativeForeigner -
Jack A T -
SaintDraze - NativeForeigner,
lordnincompoop -
Bdthemag -
IronyOwl -
Ottofar -
SniHjen -

Not Voting - Akhier the Dragon hearted, Jokerman-EXE, Pandarsenic, SaintDraze, Bdthemag, SniHjen, Jack A T,

8 To Hammer. Night Ends Thursday 9 PM Central.

SaintDraze has been prodded.

[Jack A T]

Jack A T, that sounds a bit circular. What is your take on the "dogs, fight!" situation, personally?

Okay.  Here goes:
I feel that asking for you and Darvi's cases on each other is a good idea, generally.  The way Jokerman asked for their cases, however, feels slightly off to me: "Hey, you two have the most votes!  What are your cases against each other?"  His defensiveness when called on it doesn't look good either.  I don't understand why he kept on pointing out that you and Darvi were tied for the most votes.  Finally, I don't like how his case against IronyOwl/Toaster includes such a large "and you're being obtuse morons and such" part.

I also found Toaster's sudden switch from you to Jokerman, and the wording involved, off, which is why I asked him about it.  I find his answer satisfying, though.

IronyOwl doesn't seem to be copying Toaster's argument so much as collaborating with Toaster: they're expanding each others' points, and adding the occasional new one.

At the moment, I'm leaning towards Jokerman being scum, but I'd prefer to have more evidence overall.  It feels a bit early to go for the final voting of the day, with one person having not even posted yet and far too many barely doing anything.

TolyK: What part of my post sounded a bit circular?  How/why?

[TolyK]

Jack A T: It's mostly gut feeling that it could go off in a bad direction, but here is some:

Toaster:
*quote*
I find this post rather interesting.  You were one of the people voting for TolyK.  Does this mean that Jokerman's actions both convinced you that he's probably scum and convinced you that both Darvi and TolyK are probably town?  Or am I reading too deeply into "trying to push through a mislynch"?

Reading too deeply is not good  it could lead to WIFOM
Also, as I found out on practice, logic is not the best way  too many possibilities, and in BYOR/bastard that is even worse 

[Jack A T]

Jack A T: It's mostly gut feeling that it could go off in a bad direction, but here is some:

Toaster:
*quote*
I find this post rather interesting.  You were one of the people voting for TolyK.  Does this mean that Jokerman's actions both convinced you that he's probably scum and convinced you that both Darvi and TolyK are probably town?  Or am I reading too deeply into "trying to push through a mislynch"?

Reading too deeply is not good  it could lead to WIFOM
Also, as I found out on practice, logic is not the best way  too many possibilities, and in BYOR/bastard that is even worse 

This is useful information, yes, but you didn't exactly answer my question.  You specifically used the word "circular" to describe my post.  How is that circular?

[Pandarsenic]

TolyK

[SniHjen]

Hmm...

I got a towny feel for darvi, and a negative feel for TolyK.

This isn't hard.

Vote TolyK

[TolyK]

Jack A T: It's mostly gut feeling that it could go off in a bad direction, but here is some:

Toaster:
*quote*
I find this post rather interesting.  You were one of the people voting for TolyK.  Does this mean that Jokerman's actions both convinced you that he's probably scum and convinced you that both Darvi and TolyK are probably town?  Or am I reading too deeply into "trying to push through a mislynch"?

Reading too deeply is not good  it could lead to WIFOM
Also, as I found out on practice, logic is not the best way  too many possibilities, and in BYOR/bastard that is even worse 

This is useful information, yes, but you didn't exactly answer my question.  You specifically used the word "circular" to describe my post.  How is that circular?

WIFOM - circular reference.

TolyK

Your point being? If you're so eager to get someone lynched, at least supply some reasoning.
I remember you didn't want to hammer me, but still wanted to vote, can you supply any reasons that others haven't mentioned?

Hmm...
I got a towny feel for darvi, and a negative feel for TolyK.
This isn't hard.
Vote TolyK

same thing to you.

[Toaster]

Pandar:

TolyK

This is not a well reasoned vote.


SniHjen:

Hmm...

I got a towny feel for darvi, and a negative feel for TolyK.

This isn't hard.

Vote TolyK

Honestly?  This one is worse.  You've jumped headfirst into an "either-or" situation.  You should be more careful about blindly following your scumbuddy Jokerman.

[Pandarsenic]

Pandar:

TolyK

This is not a well reasoned vote.

Wrong.

[Tyberix]

snip

WIFOM - circular reference.

Could you stop throwing definitions as answers ? If you want to use that in your defense then okay do it ,but point out why...


SaintDraze, Akhier, Bdthemag : You have not yet placed your vote, why ? Who are yours prime suspects ?

Jokerman: Suppose you have two suspects and you're as sure as you can they're scum. Would you attack just one or both of them ?

[Toaster]

Pandar:

Pandar:

TolyK

This is not a well reasoned vote.

Wrong.

Ok, I'll grant that it might be.  However, unless you tell us those reasons, nobody gives a shit.

[lordnincompoop]

I have no idea what the hell is going on here, but none of it seems to be proper scumhunting.

I'm getting the feeling that Hacenten's a Jester, but since everyone's got their heads up their rears I dunno anymore.

I haven't seen a great deal of activity (and in some cases none at all) from SaintDraze, Bdthemag, Tyberix, Akhier TDH and Ottofar (though he always lurks) Tragic, really.

Akhier, I'm having difficulty reading your posts formatted like that. If you could stop with that for this game I'd appreciate it.

erm... try and read the thread... I'm sure I come up as scummy, and darvi does some strange stuff too.
also, how would you know that you're not on his radar?

another thing: I'm not sure that name-calling is good for your reputation...

Calling yourself scum is never good for your case.

LNCP, what do you think so far in the game? Should we pay any attention to the names of roles, or will that lead to circular thinking (WIFOM I think it's called?)/incorrect "info filter"?

There are def. people here that are acting suspicious. The two main suspects I have are Hacenten and you, TolyK. Hacenten seems to be just faffing around and following people's leads instead of actually scumhunting, and you're acting unusually asinine, on top of not even having any suspects yet. Do you, or are you just going to keep fucking around?

I think that yeah, we should consider the role names. But since they're just names, I don't think we should be giving them too much water for now.

Pandar:

TolyK

This is not a well reasoned vote.

Wrong.

No, you are. Even if you provided reasons sum them up for a vote.

Hmm...

I got a towny feel for darvi, and a negative feel for TolyK.

This isn't hard.

Vote TolyK

And why the hell are you just following his lead?

I haven't seen a whit of reasoning about why you think any of this, and why we should care. Should we?

Because honestly, you're a lot more visible than your targets are right now.

[Toaster]

LNCP:  One question:  Who is Hacenten?