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Author Topic: How to deal with aggressive dogs?  (Read 18449 times)

Nospherat

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How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« on: April 07, 2011, 08:00:45 am »

Long story short:
This stinkin' city is swarming with stray dogs. They are highly territorial, they are organised in packs.
They are defended by retarded old ladies who love the rotten mutts, enough to supply water and a bit of food, yet not enough to actually take them home.

As such, going home after 10PM is a rather... interesting experience.
Authorities won't do a damn thing about it. As a matter of fact, defending yourself and killing a few dogs will most likely land you in jail.
Why?
'Cause that's how we roll in here. I have no better explanation. 'Nuff of that.

Question:
-It is night, you are surrounded by 10-12 dogs. They are closing in, and in about 20-30 seconds they will switch from barking to a coordinated attack. You will get overrun, forced to the ground and seriously bitten. Actually you have a good chance of dying there. If not, best case scenario is permanent disfigurement. 
What do you do to prevent this?

Thanks to the retarded laws in this ... circus of a country, firearms are not allowed.
Thus, please suggest some kind of device that would be effective and easy to use by anyone (for instance, my wife), yet still be non-lethal.

inb4 "magma"
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Muz

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2011, 08:14:22 am »

Pepper spray. Excellent range, easy to use, very legal, doesn't kill.
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Angel Of Death

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2011, 08:14:28 am »

I think there's a device that emits an extremely loud noise only heard by certain animals. Cat's and dogs included.

Apparantly, my father borrowed one off of someone and used it on his cat when he scratched up the couch.
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Blargityblarg

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2011, 08:15:38 am »

Are you sure these dogs are actually a threat? You, and I mean no offense by this, sound to me as though your hypothetical question is very much that; hypothetical. Have you actually any experience with these dogs attacking people, have you heard any anecdotes? Do you see beggars going about their daily business covered in bite marks?

That said, your best bet is probably some kind of chemical deterrent (i.e. mace, bluh bluh, I'm not sure how well it works on dogs if at all, but whatever.)

Honestly, if these dogs are living in a city and being fed by people, they know that people are generally not a good thing to attack, and if they do attack people, then why would it still be illegal to remove some? I think you're blowing the threat well out of proportion here, though I may very well be wrong.

fakeedit: I spent so long trying to word this post in a way other than 'harden the fuck up' that Muz ninja'd the actual answer I gave to your question.
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Nospherat

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2011, 08:30:37 am »

Quote
Are you sure these dogs are actually a threat?
http://inpascani.ro/ce-parere-ai-ar-trebui-sa-dispara-maidanezii/
http://www.sibiul.ro/stiri-locale/omorat-de-caini-in-calduri/21617/
http://stiri.botosani.ro/stire/18398/SOCANT:+Botosanean+omorat+de+caini!.html
http://www.presaonline.com/stiri/social/copil-omorat-de-o-haita-de-caini-vagabonzi-243346.html

^ 30 seconds of google, without actually trying hard to get results. Just, you know, one search.

I get attacked by dogs, on my way home pretty much every night. So far I did not get bitten, just by massive amounts of luck and the fact that... well.. I'm a big fellow.
My wife, on the other hand, was already bitten twice.

Quote
then why would it still be illegal to remove some?
Ahahahahaha.... right. As said, that's how we roll in this place. That's how things are. No further questions about this, please.

Quote
I think there's a device that emits an extremely loud noise only heard by certain animals
Worthless. Tried that. It's supposed to stop fat pets from chewing shoes, not ravenous territorial beasts.

Quote
Pepper spray. Excellent range, easy to use, very legal, doesn't kill.
Already in my "Every Day Carry" bag.
Sometimes is simply not enough, though. It runs out of charges pretty fast. And I'd like to hear about other options before hauling a "riot size" 5 liter pepper spray every day of my life.

Thank you for your help so far.
Maybe someone has more experience with this.

EDIT:
I did try to ask around on local forums, sadly this nation is not exactly famous for its IQ level.
Katanas, full auto weapons and karate lessons were quickly suggested... and those were the most coherent answers.
I'm just a mild mannered wimpy IT tech. I've not the time or skills for ninja lessons and assorted weaponry.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 08:37:16 am by Nospherat »
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Phmcw

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2011, 08:36:30 am »

Romanian, he?
Can't you have an alarm pistol? The noise should get them to flee.
Alternatively strong Firecracker maybe. Never tested either, just giving some idea.
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Blargityblarg

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2011, 08:37:33 am »

Quote
Are you sure these dogs are actually a threat?
http://inpascani.ro/ce-parere-ai-ar-trebui-sa-dispara-maidanezii/
http://www.sibiul.ro/stiri-locale/omorat-de-caini-in-calduri/21617/
http://stiri.botosani.ro/stire/18398/SOCANT:+Botosanean+omorat+de+caini!.html
http://www.presaonline.com/stiri/social/copil-omorat-de-o-haita-de-caini-vagabonzi-243346.html

^ 30 seconds of google, without actually trying hard to get results. Just, you know, one search.

I get attacked by dogs, on my way home pretty much every night. So far I did not get bitten, just by massive amounts of luck and the fact that... well.. I'm a big fellow.
My wife, on the other hand, was already bitten twice.

It helps to speak Romanian and to know that Romania is the relevant country.

My advice, given that the dogs actually are threat, might not be all that helpful; Get in a car, or public transport, instead of walking through a city filled with feral dogs in the middle of the night. Up until they get smart and bring a coathanger or a bus ticket, your incidences of being attacked fall sharply. Of course, this might not be possible, in which case, good luck, and don't carry bacon around with you.
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Phmcw

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2011, 08:43:25 am »

Given how bad are things, and if you're a bit wealthy, there is concealed weapon permit available in Romania. Even a small calibre handgun can repel a dog.

Edit :You can modify an airsoft gun to make it more powerful and load it with steel balls, if it's legal. Not enought to kill the dog, or someone, but will get it running in the other way, fast.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 08:47:38 am by Phmcw »
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Nospherat

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2011, 08:46:41 am »

Yeh. A bit of google translate would hint that those are 4 articles about random folks getting killed by dogs. There's a lot more where those came from. Anyways.

-Firecrackers. Tried. Actually tried what would be the rough equivalent of a M-90. Some of them dispersed for a second and then started charging again. I just managed to piss them off.
Besides, fumbling with firecrackers and lighters is not that efficient.

-Public transportation
Yup, effective, to a point. However, most of these dogs are actually roaming the small streets that are not covered by public transportation.

Quote
Given how bad are things, and if you're a bit wealthy, there is concealed weapon permit available in Romania. Even a small calibre handgun can repel a dog.
*sigh* yeah, eventually that's what I'll try to get.
However, as said, shooting at (towards, in the general direction of, not actually killing) a dog quickly brings you into the 5'o clock news and then suddenly and abruptly lands you in jail.

The "self-defence" law around here is borderline hilarious.
If you are attacked, let's say by a burglar, in your own house, and he's just using his fists, if you shoot him, you're in trouble.
You response must match the scale of the aggressor's attack. It does not matter if you are a scared, frail old lady and he's a friggin towering behemoth. You must punch him to death. Or ... free "go to jail" card.

If I were to extrapolate this to my problem, the stray dogs, I do have a faint feeling that by law, I am only allowed to bite back. Not sure about that, I'll have to double-check tho.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 08:52:59 am by Nospherat »
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DJ

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2011, 08:52:18 am »

Get 5 rottweilers and don't go anywhere without them.

But seriously, I would consider a massive poison campaign if I were you. I doubt the authorities will manage to track you down, or even bother to do so.

I personally have been in these situations a couple of times, but it was 3-4 dogs at most. With such low numbers they don't dare to charge if you have your back against a wall and stand your ground (though they will mock charge), but I don't think this would work against a dozen dogs because their collective courage increases with every additional pack member.

One thing that might scare them off is fire, most animals are afraid of it. Spraycan + lighter are a cheap way to make scary looking flames.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 08:56:20 am by DJ »
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Phmcw

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2011, 09:05:27 am »

Dunno, Belgian, here, and Belgium is pretty strict regarding what is self defence, too, but being attacked by a pack dog seems pretty self-defencey. Anyway http://www.shop-gun.fr/replique-arme-de-poing/381-steyr-m9-a1-co2.html 2 joules, a lot of balls, hurt like hells, silent, try it yourself first, but that should deter a dog. Use steel balls if allowed for maximum effectives. Take care to know what is legal or not though.
 
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Angel Of Death

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2011, 09:05:56 am »

One thing that might scare them off is fire, most animals are afraid of it. Spraycan + lighter are a cheap way to make scary looking flames.
It has a chance of setting you on fire if you mess up. It's dangerous, but if dogs are really such a problem you may have no choice.
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Mindmaker

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2011, 09:14:35 am »

That sounds terrifying  :-\
I'm terribly afraid of dogs.

My uncle in Poland uses a pistol with blank ammunition, to scare off packs up to 3.
No idea how well it works for bigger groups.
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Nospherat

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2011, 09:27:12 am »

Well, that's that, I guess. I'll get an expandable baton as a side-arm for when I run out of pepper spray.
I'll be watching this, just in case someone else has a brilliant solution that was not listed, so far.


-airsoft weapons.
I am a rather hard-core airsofter myself, and as such, I know them well.
They are legal but only during airsoft games, and on airsoft "grounds".
As a hilarious turn of events, shooting someone with an airsoft pistol on the street, can get you into a heap more trouble than shooting the same person with a self-defence pistol. Since the airsoft pistol is specifically not a self-defence weapon.


Thanks for your answers.

A little bit of trivia now, optional reading.

A few years ago we started a massive campaign to clean the streets and get rid of the dogs. Before we could even do anything the enviro-crazies (elves, it's always the elves) at the Vier Pfoten Foundation (german: "four paws") chained themselves to fences and got into other environmental insane protests.
Pretty soon we have switched from "kill the dogs" to "sterilize and release".

People grumbled that sterilizing the dogs won't do shit, since well... we're not in danger of being fucked by the dogs. Our problem is slightly different.

Anyways, we started seeing dogs with those "marking" earrings get back to the streets. Pretty soon we noticed that the so-called sterilized dogs started a dogsplosion.
Obviously, the med and vet students in charge of sterilizing the dogs did exactly what a good Romanian will always do: anything but their jobs.
And thus, we have tons of fertile dogs, with pretty earrings, running around the streets, eating people and children.

Our proud fort's nobles won't do shit about this. You see, apparently killing dogs is greatly displeasing Mother Europe. And since we're so desperate to be part of Mother Europe, we don't dare do anything that may fluster her.

-If I were to poison my retarded old neighbor that keeps feeding the beasts, I'll probably get a slap on my wrist, and get out on probation after just a tad of same-sex relations in prison.

-If I were to poison all the dogs in my neighborhood, I will quickly ascend to the title of Madman, I will be portrayed as a menace to society, I will be the subject to a special news bulletin that will last an hour, psychologists will be invited to discuss my behavior, and all this will be turned into a "SEE? WE SAVE COUNTRY! WE GOOD! VOTE FOR US!" case while I'll rot in the dungeons.

These are not hypothetical scenarios. They have more or less happened before.

*shrug*
That's how the media behaves, that's how the *snorts and giggles* "LAW ENFORCEMENT" works around here.
That's how we roll.
*cue in rap music*

Oh yeah, before someone asks:
I'm a dog person. I have a dog, and a cat. I have nothing against dogs. But, by all means, if you love dogs, get them in your own apartment, keep them in your own backyard. This "sort-of feeding, sort-of caring" hordes of stray dogs that you old farts are doing, is simply retarded. And dangerous.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2011, 09:37:18 am by Nospherat »
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Phmcw

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Re: How to deal with aggressive dogs?
« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2011, 09:48:09 am »

Agreed. Now, http://www.paintballguns.co.za/security-and-self-defence.html Paintball-like peperball laucher may do the tricks. Concealable to booth and definitely dedicated self defence weapon.
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