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Author Topic: Disappearing elves?  (Read 2187 times)

Golcondio

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Disappearing elves?
« on: March 31, 2011, 06:58:30 am »

I built a drowning depot (water drops in from the roof, manually pumped from an adjacent murky pool, nothing fancy) for my dear elven merchants who angered me by not bringing giant eagles as gifts (actually they did not bring a single animal...), set a dorf happily pumping cleansing blue liquid inside the depot (locked doors of course), and... after drowning on and off for a while (water was not 7/7 everywhere), they just disappeared! With all their stuff, and animals and everything!

Has it ever happened to you?
I'm on version 31.25
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Cotes

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #1 on: March 31, 2011, 07:40:20 am »

Objects pushed around by water pressure sometimes "disappear" - You can't see or interact with them, but the dwarves still can. Just make sure there's enough room in stockpiles and the stuff should become visible again once the dwarves start moving them.
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Well if you remove the [MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE] tag from dwarves I think they have like 2-4 children each time they give birth. And if you get enough mothers up on the pillars you can probably get a good waterfall going.
Ashes are technically fire-safe.

Golcondio

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #2 on: March 31, 2011, 08:14:48 am »

Hmm... I'm pretty sure I did not end up with their wooden crap anywhere in the stockpiles, and there's no trace of the elves or their horses...
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Alastar

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #3 on: March 31, 2011, 08:16:41 am »

Just to clear things up: Pressure works in a rather unintuitive way. Pressurised fluids teleport through orthogonally connected tiles to an empty one up to the same level, this does not move objects. Water movement from depth gradients is what pushes items around and occasionally causes them to get stuck in limbo. So a fully pressurised system will have little movement, to move things you'd just use pressure to dump lots of water somewhere with enough adequate drainage to create constant movement along a depth gradient. This doens't work too well in practice because eventually things get stuck.
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Golcondio

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2011, 10:02:36 am »

Hey thanks a lot for the explaination (it clarifies some doubts I had about pressure...), but unfortunately this does not apply in my case:
- depot completely encircled by walls, therefore a 5x5 room
- water falling from the z-level above the depot, therefore unpressurized
- elves and mules happily drowning inside (water between 6/7 and 7/7 all over)

They just disappeared, with all their possessions...
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Minnakht

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2011, 10:04:54 am »

No idea, then. All I know is that I made a depot encircled by pillars and floodgates, so I could drain it quickly as soon as the elves drowned.

...that pressure thing is pretty cool. I'll have to exploit it in my next drownpot...
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Giant badgers are cruel saddistic balls of fur and hate. Did anyone know they could paint a wall with a single dwarven baby?.... You know what, I made the Giant badgers sound like sane DF players.
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Cotes

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2011, 10:07:36 am »

How does that not apply? The walls do nothing to stop the objects from disappearing and there still is water movement from filling and draining the room. That's all you need.
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Well if you remove the [MULTIPLE_LITTER_RARE] tag from dwarves I think they have like 2-4 children each time they give birth. And if you get enough mothers up on the pillars you can probably get a good waterfall going.
Ashes are technically fire-safe.

Golcondio

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2011, 12:01:41 pm »

I had finished filling the room, and had not started draining it: I was waiting for the treehuggers to drown...
Unless the water "movement" due to the static wave (the room was not completely full at 7/7) can also cause this?
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Sphalerite

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2011, 12:06:48 pm »

I had finished filling the room, and had not started draining it: I was waiting for the treehuggers to drown...
Unless the water "movement" due to the static wave (the room was not completely full at 7/7) can also cause this?
It can.  Any water at less than 7/7 can push objects when sloshing around, and that can trigger the disappearing objects bug.
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Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius --- and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction.

Golcondio

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Re: Disappearing elves?
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2011, 12:44:51 pm »

Thanks a lot, all of you!
Anyway, I decided to abandon the embark (and the worldgen) when I discovered that I was at peace with Goblins...
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