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[Astral]

How does one

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Kill the bastard trying to shoot me and wifey? With a hammer, he always instakills me, and I haven't found any firearms just following the tutorial. I'm out of time at the moment, but I plan on coming back and trying it at different angles.

[x2yzh9]

How does one

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Kill the bastard trying to shoot me and wifey? With a hammer, he always instakills me, and I haven't found any firearms just following the tutorial. I'm out of time at the moment, but I plan on coming back and trying it at different angles.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

As soon as you pull the soup out of the oven, go upstairs to the bedroom w/ kate bathroom, stay away from the window. Wait until he comes upstairs and starts talking to kate, come out and charge kill him.

[Bdthemag]

Do I have to.....

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Set the house on fire to be able to pick up my wife? Because that's the only time I've been able to move her

Yeah, I think that's pretty much the only time you can move her.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Now I'm wondering, does a giant horde of zombies always greet you at the bottom of the stairs when you're dragging your wife out of the spreading inferno? There were so many of them, and they climbed that staircase so fast that I would have mistaken them for the fire brigade had they not all been moaning and wailing like the undead are want to do. I really wish I could have captured a screenshot. I had no chance in hell, but really I guess that's the point of the game.  ... Still, given the situation I would have liked the option to dump my wife and immediately jump out the nearest window. Shards of glass and broken legs be damned, I want the zombies to have to work for their next meal!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Yes because I believe it starts a fire alarm that alerts the zombies, and when more zombies die because of the smell of burned flesh even more zombies arrive.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Does that mean it's worth burning down houses that are a fair distance from yours?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I never actually thought of that, but I believe that the fire can spread.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Oh yes, it spreads. The fire I started made it all the way from my kitchen almost to the street. But it started petering out from there. I can't tell if rain actually affects it or not. It certainly doesn't stop you from burning.

I figured the zombies showing up was some dramatic scripting. If your house is on fire and your wife can't move, why not throw a horde of zombies automatically breaking down your door? Although the fire alarm makes perfect sense.

I just hope at lot of that scripted doom is for alpha demo purposes, and doesn't reflect how things are going to play out in the full game. That stuff makes for a good single or multiple play experience, but I feel like I'm playing an adventure game more than a sandbox game right now, because it's going from option to option, event to event, to see how they expect you to fail and succeed.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I put something in a spoiler tag (hehe)....Is there an ETA on the public demo?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

To continue the talk about the fire thing, it seems that the house only sets on fire in the tutorial. So it seems you can't just set fire to any house.

[nenjin]

Some unfortunate news:

http://projectzomboid.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/sorry-weve-had-to-take-the-game-down/

Not only did someone pirate the game and make it into a standalone executable, they made it with an update button that directly downloads the new version from teh PZ website.

Dick fucking move. The guys at PZ they don't ever bother with worrying about piracy, it happens. But this is different. Most pirated games forgo automatic updates because it's keys get blacklisted, ect....and they upload a stand alone patch for the game.

Since PZ is an indie company, they weren't prepared for higher levels of piracy dickitude. So right now, the pirated version of PZ costs them bandwidth money, and because pirates can repeatedly click the "update" button, they can actually cost the PZ team MORE bandwidth than a customer who bought the game and only downloads updates when they're available.

So long and short, PZ has been taken down. You can still play a cached version of it for the moment. It will be back when they have a more robust security system (they're talking about moving forward on the downloadable client now because of this.)

It just makes me sad that even when indie devs don't fuck people over with stupid crazy DRM, some pirates out there can't let well alone enough. It's not enough they can get the game for free, they've got to literally sap cash from teh PZ company while they do it.

[Rumrusher]

Some unfortunate news:

http://projectzomboid.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/sorry-weve-had-to-take-the-game-down/

Not only did someone pirate the game and make it into a standalone executable, they made it with an update button that directly downloads the new version from teh PZ website.

Dick fucking move. The guys at PZ they don't ever bother with worrying about piracy, it happens. But this is different. Most pirated games forgo automatic updates because it's keys get blacklisted, ect....and they upload a stand alone patch for the game.

Since PZ is an indie company, they weren't prepared for higher levels of piracy dickitude. So right now, the pirated version of PZ costs them bandwidth money, and because pirates can repeatedly click the "update" button, they can actual cost the PZ MORE bandwidth than a customer who bought the game and only downloads updates when they're available.

So long and short, PZ has been taken down. You can still play a cached version of it for the moment. It will be back when they have a more robust security system (they're talking about moving forward on the downloadable client now because of this.)

It just makes me sad that even when indie devs don't fuck people over with stupid crazy DRM, some pirates out there can't let well alone enough. It's not enough they can get the game for free, they've got to literally sap cash from teh PZ company while they do it.

hmm I guess from my rough memory about this game the only flaw was it cost money and I guess these guys doing the same stunt notch doing which was making  people pay for beta testing which some money services hate, I hate this (the paying for beta testing not the fact the money services hate that idea, because who would want to pay to do someone else taxes?)


wait after reading the article I notice a few things.
Free volunteer beta testers hurt the company(?), and they think they can't just go on Donations because fear of people jumping to torrents that "auto update" than paying so they over react and shut down and blame the pirates early.

how I see it is this.
Coder : hey guys look I just made this program that can update the pirated copies of the game for situations where players pay can't get the game and can't update because of the pirated game they have doesn't work woo!
*Meanwhile at PZ Fort*
Urist developer: Olgn come here I heard you got some news for me.
Olgn the PR: look the dorf bucks we get from 'donation' sales are not enough to keep the nobles from kicking us out look the Koblods have tweaked our game to update constantly!
Urist : So ?
Olgn : So!? look this means the people who don't pay can get the game for free and update which drains our servers(other than the normal people who drain the servers any way)!
Urist : you mean? that we paying for beta testing ! Oh No pull the lever!
Olgn : already di...

*your project has crumbled.*

Meanwhile back at the Koblods cave

Coder: I got news my program shut down the game, shoot that sucks. Hey did toady added necromancy and zombies in yet?
Kobold : nah but I read good news on zombie survival squad being flipping huge still we can play survivor crisis z until the developers come back.
Coder: yeah lets all pour Mountain dew for Zombiod the DFzombie game that was screw over by paypal and google.
*all proceed to pour MtnDw on the ground*

[nenjin]

I hate this (the paying for beta testing not the fact the money services hate that idea, because who would want to pay to do someone else taxes?)

Given the price, you either have to be 12 or the cheapest bastard in the world not to pay $5 for the lifetime license to the game. Mount and Blade did the exact same thing. Are you actually saying they've earned pirates sapping their bandwidth because of this?

[Tilla]

Some unfortunate news:

http://projectzomboid.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/sorry-weve-had-to-take-the-game-down/

Not only did someone pirate the game and make it into a standalone executable, they made it with an update button that directly downloads the new version from teh PZ website.

Dick fucking move. The guys at PZ they don't ever bother with worrying about piracy, it happens. But this is different. Most pirated games forgo automatic updates because it's keys get blacklisted, ect....and they upload a stand alone patch for the game.

Since PZ is an indie company, they weren't prepared for higher levels of piracy dickitude. So right now, the pirated version of PZ costs them bandwidth money, and because pirates can repeatedly click the "update" button, they can actual cost the PZ MORE bandwidth than a customer who bought the game and only downloads updates when they're available.

So long and short, PZ has been taken down. You can still play a cached version of it for the moment. It will be back when they have a more robust security system (they're talking about moving forward on the downloadable client now because of this.)

It just makes me sad that even when indie devs don't fuck people over with stupid crazy DRM, some pirates out there can't let well alone enough. It's not enough they can get the game for free, they've got to literally sap cash from teh PZ company while they do it.

hmm I guess from my rough memory about this game the only flaw was it cost money and I guess these guys doing the same stunt notch doing which was making  people pay for beta testing which some money services hate, I hate this (the paying for beta testing not the fact the money services hate that idea, because who would want to pay to do someone else taxes?)

Here's a neat thing: people need money to live. If they had to work other jobs, this game would never get done. They ask for a tiny sum of money to keep their operation afloat so that they can work this game as their full time job - about a dollar per  purchase per team member, before bandwidth fees. How is this any worse than a preorder for any other game?

[Tilla]

Some unfortunate news:

http://projectzomboid.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/sorry-weve-had-to-take-the-game-down/

Not only did someone pirate the game and make it into a standalone executable, they made it with an update button that directly downloads the new version from teh PZ website.

Dick fucking move. The guys at PZ they don't ever bother with worrying about piracy, it happens. But this is different. Most pirated games forgo automatic updates because it's keys get blacklisted, ect....and they upload a stand alone patch for the game.

Since PZ is an indie company, they weren't prepared for higher levels of piracy dickitude. So right now, the pirated version of PZ costs them bandwidth money, and because pirates can repeatedly click the "update" button, they can actual cost the PZ MORE bandwidth than a customer who bought the game and only downloads updates when they're available.

So long and short, PZ has been taken down. You can still play a cached version of it for the moment. It will be back when they have a more robust security system (they're talking about moving forward on the downloadable client now because of this.)

It just makes me sad that even when indie devs don't fuck people over with stupid crazy DRM, some pirates out there can't let well alone enough. It's not enough they can get the game for free, they've got to literally sap cash from teh PZ company while they do it.

hmm I guess from my rough memory about this game the only flaw was it cost money and I guess these guys doing the same stunt notch doing which was making  people pay for beta testing which some money services hate, I hate this (the paying for beta testing not the fact the money services hate that idea, because who would want to pay to do someone else taxes?)


wait after reading the article I notice a few things.
Free volunteer beta testers hurt the company(?), and they think they can't just go on Donations because fear of people jumping to torrents that "auto update" than paying so they over react and shut down and blame the pirates early.

how I see it is this.
Coder : hey guys look I just made this program that can update the pirated copies of the game for situations where players pay can't get the game and can't update because of the pirated game they have doesn't work woo!
*Meanwhile at PZ Fort*
Urist developer: Olgn come here I heard you got some news for me.
Olgn the PR: look the dorf bucks we get from 'donation' sales are not enough to keep the nobles from kicking us out look the Koblods have tweaked our game to update constantly!
Urist : So ?
Olgn : So!? look this means the people who don't pay can get the game for free and update which drains our servers(other than the normal people who drain the servers any way)!
Urist : you mean? that we paying for beta testing ! Oh No pull the lever!
Olgn : already di...

*your project has crumbled.*

Meanwhile back at the Koblods cave

Coder: I got news my program shut down the game, shoot that sucks. Hey did toady added necromancy and zombies in yet?
Kobold : nah but I read good news on zombie survival squad being flipping huge still we can play survivor crisis z until the developers come back.
Coder: yeah lets all pour Mountain dew for Zombiod the DFzombie game that was screw over by paypal and google.
*all proceed to pour MtnDw on the ground*

This post makes no sense. The reason the updater hurts the company is that it downloads the game DIRECTLY from their cloud servers, which costs THEM money for every copy downloaded. Every pirated copy literally costs them money. Learn to read.

[nenjin]

Some unfortunate news:

http://projectzomboid.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/sorry-weve-had-to-take-the-game-down/

Not only did someone pirate the game and make it into a standalone executable, they made it with an update button that directly downloads the new version from teh PZ website.

Dick fucking move. The guys at PZ they don't ever bother with worrying about piracy, it happens. But this is different. Most pirated games forgo automatic updates because it's keys get blacklisted, ect....and they upload a stand alone patch for the game.

Since PZ is an indie company, they weren't prepared for higher levels of piracy dickitude. So right now, the pirated version of PZ costs them bandwidth money, and because pirates can repeatedly click the "update" button, they can actual cost the PZ MORE bandwidth than a customer who bought the game and only downloads updates when they're available.

So long and short, PZ has been taken down. You can still play a cached version of it for the moment. It will be back when they have a more robust security system (they're talking about moving forward on the downloadable client now because of this.)

It just makes me sad that even when indie devs don't fuck people over with stupid crazy DRM, some pirates out there can't let well alone enough. It's not enough they can get the game for free, they've got to literally sap cash from teh PZ company while they do it.

hmm I guess from my rough memory about this game the only flaw was it cost money and I guess these guys doing the same stunt notch doing which was making  people pay for beta testing which some money services hate, I hate this (the paying for beta testing not the fact the money services hate that idea, because who would want to pay to do someone else taxes?)


wait after reading the article I notice a few things.
Free volunteer beta testers hurt the company(?), and they think they can't just go on Donations because fear of people jumping to torrents that "auto update" than paying so they over react and shut down and blame the pirates early.

how I see it is this.
Coder : hey guys look I just made this program that can update the pirated copies of the game for situations where players pay can't get the game and can't update because of the pirated game they have doesn't work woo!
*Meanwhile at PZ Fort*
Urist developer: Olgn come here I heard you got some news for me.
Olgn the PR: look the dorf bucks we get from 'donation' sales are not enough to keep the nobles from kicking us out look the Koblods have tweaked our game to update constantly!
Urist : So ?
Olgn : So!? look this means the people who don't pay can get the game for free and update which drains our servers(other than the normal people who drain the servers any way)!
Urist : you mean? that we paying for beta testing ! Oh No pull the lever!
Olgn : already di...

*your project has crumbled.*

Meanwhile back at the Koblods cave

Coder: I got news my program shut down the game, shoot that sucks. Hey did toady added necromancy and zombies in yet?
Kobold : nah but I read good news on zombie survival squad being flipping huge still we can play survivor crisis z until the developers come back.
Coder: yeah lets all pour Mountain dew for Zombiod the DFzombie game that was screw over by paypal and google.
*all proceed to pour MtnDw on the ground*

Spoken like someone who doesn't have to pay for anything themself. Grade school math tells you why this is hurting them. And any pirate coder worth their salt can extract updates as a standalone file. They did this specifically to screw over the PZ guys. Whoever made the pirated version of PZ is basically flouting the very few codes of ethics pirates adhere to, which is do as little damage as possible.

[Stworca]

Ethical or not, i doubt that anyone expected the game to be pirate-free. Everything was, is and will be pirated. Silly insults and trolling one another won'T change anything.

Now... Pirating alphas or betas is wrong (obviously) when it hurts an indie group, but i'd say that donations are a better idea, mainly because with all the pirating it's possible that the project may crumble.

[nenjin]

They didn't expect the game to be pirate-free. Again, why does everyone seem to over look the fact that it's directly downloading data from their cloud?

Honestly, I had a feeling that something like this was coming when I saw the game was streamed through your browser and secured through Java. It's good this probably happened in some sense since it's a wake up call and they're now working on a stand alone client that doesn't link you to their cloud.

But seriously. Why has this become a discussion about how they're charging to get access to a game that isn't officially released? How has this become about blaming the victim?

I'm not against pirating. But the implication that they should be offering the whole thing for free and just asking for donations makes me want to punch someone. Toady chooses to work like that, not everyone does. If people aren't willing to give up their work for free, they're open to whatever justification someone with no money wants to come up with?

You're right though and I apologize for getting snide with him.

[Rumrusher]

Ethical or not, i doubt that anyone expected the game to be pirate-free. Everything was, is and will be pirated. Silly insults and trolling one another won'T change anything.

Now... Pirating alphas or betas is wrong (obviously) when it hurts an indie group, but i'd say that donations are a better idea, mainly because with all the pirating it's possible that the project may crumble.

Given that pirating just one guy or (a group) who makes a copy of the game they got from the creators and ships it out on a file sharing site cutting the bandwidth cost on downloading it on the original owners making it a semi mirror. The issue(I see) was that the auto updates to the game which pulls from PZ cloud bandwidth on top of the buying. Seems like the solution (other than going back to close doors which they should have from after dropping the tech demo) would be to have the pirate version auto updates through a separate cloud that taps from the original so that the pull isn't that strong(given that it would be just one cpu asking for updates so it can send copies of those updates to other pirated versions than every pirated version asking for updates). That way people can donate(via buying the game or clicking a donation button) if they like the product.
I'm stump on the whole "preordering to play a demo so that you can bug fix so they can drop a public demo later." just seems like "giving a guy money so you can clip his toe nails when the guy was going to allow you to clip his toe nails at a later date."

Oh well hope they pull out of this issue.

[mendonca]

I don't believe they can take donations, as they are doing this for profit. Hence the Dr.oids thing.

The indie stone are actively encouraging people to pirate the game (from a torrent) so people can play offline whilst they figure out this issue.

indiestone have always been VERY open with the subject of piracy, people looking at their decompiled code etc.

Just goes to show what dicks people can be. It only hurts the whole DRM mudbath.

[GlyphGryph]

I know people who use this, well, the standalone executable bit. All of them have bought the game, then grabbed the executable. Maybe thats not the general approach, but I think its an understandable response. The standalone was a lot better than the browser version. It really was.

What's funny is that now these people were the smart ones, since they are now the only ones who can play the game. I fail to see how making the game no longer available is going to encourage people to buy it instead of pirate it, though. Edit: Apparently those who've already bought it can do something to still play it, but it still means no new buyers.

Now if I want to play the game, I HAVE to pirate it. And... thats the only difference?

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what is going on.

Although, I should add I was honestly wondering for the longest time why they made it browser-based, since it didn't need to be and would thus cost them money/bandwidth pretty constantly. Again, though, maybe I'm misunderstanding something here.

[mendonca]

I think it's as simple as the 'update' button that has appeared on a pirated version of the game. That button forces an update from the 'cloud', which means MB and GB taken from the cloud, which means $ for indiestone to pay for the bandwidth used. The browser based model only really assumes a typical player will update once a week or so, as the indiestone publish a new build. The 'update' button means that these updates can be brought about at any point.

So basically, they aren't worried about providing a constant stream of necessary updates as and when, but with the 'update' button a single player could do it every time they play, or worse. They're being cautious, admittedly - but I don't suppose I can blame them - if $GB > $income, they're business doesn't stack up. At least at the minute $GB is minimal, whereas it could potentially be huge.

It's unfortunate, but the 'scalable' cloud distribution seems to be pretty much the only affordable method for them to provide the content for such wildly variable demand.