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[Cthulhu]

So let's say both homosexuality and intolerance are genetically identified and curable. 

If we cure intolerance entirely, people would be okay with things like murder and rape.  If we cure it partially, what metric do we use to determine what's to be cured and not cured?

Also, because I don't like people getting hung up on this kind of thing to the detriment of the argument, when I use the word "cure" in the context of this discussion, I am not implying that the thing being "cured" is a disease or somehow wrong.

Yes, so lets not much around with anyone DNA.

Yeah, pretty much what I was getting at, lets not much around with anyone DNA.

[Criptfeind]

Other then mine.

I wish to be the god king flying baboon of man kind

[Eagleon]

But if something is genetic (the crux of this argument being whether or not its actually genetic, and what that entails), you can't really argue that modifying their genes removes any "choice" they may have in the matter. And frankly, I'd support it - there are hands down perfectly logical reasons to want to be heterosexual over homosexual if you are concerned about maximizing their opportunity, because you would in fact be giving your child MORE choice, simply by virtue of allowing them the opportunity to actually have a baby with their partner that is equal parts "theirs".

Homosexuals can still reproduce. They aren't infertile, and a lot of them do want to raise children. This is a common misconception - in reality (not that this should or would ever happen), a completely homosexual society would adapt with artificial insemination (with mutual cooperation between couples, or even polyamory) and still thrive, because those that refuse to consider this won't raise children. Why do you think so many people want kids? It's not that they're not annoying inconsiderate bastards for the first couple of years, it's that we've "bred" our cultures (and possibly our genes) to tolerate it.

[Max White]

I wish to be the god king flying baboon of man kind

So you can understand how somebody just coming back into the conversation would wonder just what the hell had happened.

[Leafsnail]

Yes, so lets not much around with anyone DNA.

I'd disagree.  There are some genetic conditions that we should definitely look into curing (I don't think anyone would want to be born with CF).

The thing is... homosexuality is probably only influenced by genes anyway.  And by a huge range of different genes.  Otherwise the heritability element would be obvious.

[Criptfeind]

Yes, so lets not much around with anyone DNA.

I'd disagree.  There are some genetic conditions that we should definitely look into curing (I don't think anyone would want to be born with CF).

Out of context is out of context.

[Leafsnail]

I was just making a clarification.  I wasn't trying to attack you or anything.

[Criptfeind]

Eh. I am most likely over sensitive on such matters.

I would say taking things out of context is one of the biggest root issues in the U.S at least (can not say for other countries)

So... Sorry I jumped at you.

[Vector]

I'm happy today because this thread wasn't locked in my absence, and we are continuing to discuss like mature human beings.

I love you guys.  Even the ones I disagree with.

[Ochita]

We love you too Vector

ForumxVector 4 EVAR

Now that we had that out of the way...

Why do people need something like physical proof that you are gay? Seriously, if you say it, and if you mean it, true friends should know about it...

[Vector]

I think it's like the "Asperger's problem."  There's no way to prove it, it's a great way to get attention (as evinced by celebrities), and it's scandalous.

Furthermore, I don't really think some sort of idealized "true friend" exists.  There's always a chance of defection or choice to disbelieve, and I guess "coming out" is one of the ways in which friendship is tested--but we never know if a friend rings true or not.

[G-Flex]

But if something is genetic (the crux of this argument being whether or not its actually genetic, and what that entails), you can't really argue that modifying their genes removes any "choice" they may have in the matter. And frankly, I'd support it - there are hands down perfectly logical reasons to want to be heterosexual over homosexual if you are concerned about maximizing their opportunity, because you would in fact be giving your child MORE choice, simply by virtue of allowing them the opportunity to actually have a baby with their partner that is equal parts "theirs".

The idea that binary sexual orientation gives anyone a realistic amount of "choice" makes me laugh, as do the ideas that we'd be better off with less diversity, or that sexual orientation, even if genetic, is controlled by some easily toggled mechanism.


Also: In case anybody decides to try for the "homosexuality isn't evolutionarily advantageous because it lowers your chance of having kids" line, reexamine how evolution works in a social species, and consider the fact that something that is detrimental to an individual's chance of reproduction can still be advantageous to the group, which is, in a social species, a large portion of what actually matters (e.g. red-green colorblindness).

[Earthquake Damage]

Furthermore, I don't really think some sort of idealized "true friend" exists.  There's always a chance of defection or choice to disbelieve, and I guess "coming out" is one of the ways in which friendship is tested--but we never know if a friend rings true or not.

I'd say "true friend", much like "true love", is a fictional construct.  "Friend" is a label, subjectively applied, not an objective trait.  Also, relationships are not static.  There are no unbreakable bonds we can use to differentiate "true friend" from "friend", assuming that's the qualifier.  Unbroken does not imply unbreakable, but even transient things can have value.

[Vector]

Yeah, that's precisely what I meant, but said far more eloquently.  Thank you.

[Askot Bokbondeler]

hey guys, got an idea, lets cure black while we're curing gay