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[dirty foot]

I just got my first forgotten beast. I've never fought one before, and I only just recently figured out how to train my military (lol, I know, I know). Here's the thing though, it's below my fortress, in the vast caverns below. I have an irrigation system set up connected to a river, and I'm thinking about flooding the whole cavern by punching a whole down to it and leading the river into it.

Firstly, is this awesome enough? I assume I'm going to probably kill everything down in that cavern by doing this, which would be nice, because I'd like to get my hands on some of the ore/gems I see down there.

Secondly, if this is pretty dwarfish of me to do...will the water ever go away? Also, will it wash away all that sexy cave spider web?

[agatharchides]

Water will flow off the edge of the cavern, so you will have to totally wall it in in order to flood it. It would be a pretty massive undertaking, to say the least. Because of the sheer scale it would be pretty awesome, but would be really hard on your framerate.
 m
EDIT: Also, Forgotten beasts can usually fly, so if you make a hole to let in the river be very careful he doesn't just fly out of it. I'm not sure if they have to breathe either, so they might not drown at all.

[dirty foot]

Water will flow off the edge of the cavern, so you will have to totally wall it in in order to flood it. It would be a pretty massive undertaking, to say the least. Because of the sheer scale it would be pretty awesome, but would be really hard on your framerate.
 m
EDIT: Also, Forgotten beasts can usually fly, so if you make a hole to let in the river be very careful he doesn't just fly out of it. I'm not sure if they have to breathe either, so they might not drown at all.

Okay, that's not good news. I have holes all over the place down there. I assumed he couldn't fly because it's been some time since he showed up. Do they immediately attack, or do they wait a bit?

I do have a panic room with a lever attached to the switch though. I'm not seeing any immediate run-off positions. I think I'll try and post pics of all the fun once it's completed.

[Psieye]

I don't know if all FBs are immune to drowning but I know some are.

[dirty foot]

I don't know if all FBs are immune to drowning but I know some are.

Hmm.

Are we at a point of coding-sophistication in the game where rushing water can push people/creatures around and/or slam them into things?

[Urist Da Vinci]

I don't know if all FBs are immune to drowning but I know some are.

Are we at a point of coding-sophistication in the game where rushing water can push people/creatures around and/or slam them into things?

1. All FB are AMPHIBIOUS, so they won't drown in water. SOME are vulnerable to magma.
2. Water can push lightweight items and creatures around, but FB are too heavy. Anything elephant-size or heavier is too heavy to be pushed by water.
3. Water never "slams" things into things, but it can push critters off cliffs, and they fall to their deaths.

[dirty foot]

I don't know if all FBs are immune to drowning but I know some are.

Are we at a point of coding-sophistication in the game where rushing water can push people/creatures around and/or slam them into things?

1. All FB are AMPHIBIOUS, so they won't drown in water. SOME are vulnerable to magma.
2. Water can push lightweight items and creatures around, but FB are too heavy. Anything elephant-size or heavier is too heavy to be pushed by water.
3. Water never "slams" things into things, but it can push critters off cliffs, and they fall to their deaths.

I can respect that all FB are amphibious. But it seems a bit weird that large items cannot be moved. Cars can very easily be taken for a ride with barely 2 feet of water. I realize some of the larger creatures in the game are much bigger than a car, but the river water I was about to dump down there moves quite fast, and seems quite deep. Also, water in this game should slam into things. I chipped a tooth once from being hit by a 4 foot wave.

Btw, not trying to seem argumentative with you. I think I'm just forming some contentions for a suggestion in the development section. Water should be a more versatile weapon in this game, especially considering how difficult it can be to rein in sometimes.

[Psieye]

Welcome to Dwarf physics - it's not the same as our physics. Given water at sufficiently high pressure is simply teleported around instead of having active flow, this explains why large creatures cannot be moved by water - there IS no flow of water anymore in the code. Coding shortcuts (it really saves our FPS) create quirks in Dwarf physics.

[dirty foot]

Welcome to Dwarf physics - it's not the same as our physics. Given water at sufficiently high pressure is simply teleported around instead of having active flow, this explains why large creatures cannot be moved by water - there IS no flow of water anymore in the code. Coding shortcuts (it really saves our FPS) create quirks in Dwarf physics.

That's too bad.

I hope it gets changed.

As an update, I found the FB. He was right next the the outflow area. I couldn't see him for some reason until he was hit with water. He started backing away from it, but it might just be a random decision. Also, it seems that every new spot the water hits a bend, monkey blood is put on the walls. That's weird, huh?

[Girlinhat]

That's normal.  Blood runs off the water and onto the walls.  For all we know, one of your dwarves bathed in the river, and that blood is now flowing down.  Water acts strangely with blood and other contaminants, and I've actually seen blood travel upstream during a pump experiment.

I think water can push big FB/Titan/etc.  Not very well, but it can happen easily enough.  The trick is to actually get them into the flow.  The way water works, when you have 3 layers of 7/7 water, and open a hatch at the bottom, the lower levels don't move, but the upper levels teleport down to the bottom.  So, instead of pathfinding HxWxD water flows, it only has to path HxW for the top-most layer.  Once that water hits flat ground, it then splits itself into smaller 1/7 or deeper over multiple tiles.  This split water is a flow, and will push things.

So, water under pressure doesn't move anything, but free-flowing water does.  This does put a very real limit on the flow force, as it can only ever flow as fast as it naturally spreads out.  Still fast enough to push a FB off a cliff if timed right, but not fast enough to fling cows 20 tiles off wall segments.

[Triaxx2]

In short, you can do it, you just need enough of it.

[Girlinhat]

No, in fact.  If you add more water it starts to negate the effect.  The trick is placing it so that it doesn't get too much pressure, or equalizing the pressure, or precise placement of pumps.

[Urist Da Vinci]

Also, it is easier to push something off a 1-tile-wide catwalk, using water dropped from above, and into a 50-z-level-deep pit.

[Triaxx2]

I meant you'll need more flow. Such as generated by two repeater activated hatches dropping in opposing order. 1-2 1-2 1-2.

[Girlinhat]

Actually, you'll probably have more luck with a pressure equalizing grid and a constant flow.  Like so:

Code: [Select]

.......
+++++++
W+W+W+W
+W+W+W+
+++++++
PPPPPPPPumps push from the south, drawing from some reservoir.  Or have the water flow down naturally.  The water pushes up against the diagonal pattern, which cancels pressure and feeds water through the grid about as fast as you can, which then pushes things off the walkway and into the pit at the top.  For security, you can fill in the checkerboard with alternative fortification and walls, and the back side (closer to the pumps) can be filled in with floodgates to shut off the flow without shutting off the source.