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[jwest23]

The last time I tried, yes.

YMMV.

[Farmerbob]

Can you carve a fortification out of a constructed wall?  I... have never tested this but I assumed it's preposterous!

Yes, lol I can certainly verify this is possible, because that was the only way I knew how to build fortifications where there was not natural rock, lol.

Since it is a two step process, it may be different from fortifications that are built directly from rocks.  The fortification may retain load bearing properties.

Heck there might be varying visual and ranged attack permeability between the two types of fortifications as well.

[khearn]

Well, I just built a diamond shaped bunker with all constructed fortifications and had no problem building a roof on top of it. Fortifications seem to support a roof just fine. So there's no really any need to build walls first. Now I need to get a siege with some trolls to test out whether or not they can deconstruct the windows through the diagonals. I just finished getting rid of a siege, so it may be a little while. Too bad I don't have any captive trolls in stock, just a few goblins.

The human caravan & diplomat just arrived. Too bad I can't put in a request for a few trolls next time they come.

   Keith

[Farmerbob]

Well, I just built a diamond shaped bunker with all constructed fortifications and had no problem building a roof on top of it. Fortifications seem to support a roof just fine. So there's no really any need to build walls first. Now I need to get a siege with some trolls to test out whether or not they can deconstruct the windows through the diagonals. I just finished getting rid of a siege, so it may be a little while. Too bad I don't have any captive trolls in stock, just a few goblins.

The human caravan & diplomat just arrived. Too bad I can't put in a request for a few trolls next time they come.

   Keith

Doesn't dwarven deconstruction follow the same rules as everyone elses?

Try deconstructing with a dwarf, and restrict where the dwarf can access from?

A troll experiment would be good after, but knowing if dwarves and trolls follow the same deconstruction rules would be handy for future !science!

[khearn]

I'm not too sure they do follow the same rules. Dwarves usually get right next to the thing they are deconstructing, but trolls usually stay two spaces away from what I've seen. I think there is a distinct difference between deconstructing and destroying. I used the wrong term in my last post.

I'll still give it a try. I'll just lock the hatch and the only dwarven access will be from outside.  I just don't think it will really tell us anything.

Edit: Bah! just got a stupid ambush. Go away and come back with some trolls, you idiots!

[khearn]

Well, I've had two sieges, and in both cases the trolls ignored my diamond shaped bunkers and headed straight for my fort. In the first siege, they didn't really go near the two bunkers I have built, so I wasn't sure. But the second time, they walked right past one.

So this design seems to be safe from building destroyers:

Code: [Select]

.......
...F...
..FWF..
.FWbWF.
.FWhWF.
..FWF..
...F...
.......

I also had an order to deconstruct one of the windows (with the hatch locked to prevent access from inside) and it's been sitting for almost a year without anyone doing it. So dwarves don't seem to be able to deconstrcut with only diagonal access, either.


[Farmerbob]

Well, I've had two sieges, and in both cases the trolls ignored my diamond shaped bunkers and headed straight for my fort. In the first siege, they didn't really go near the two bunkers I have built, so I wasn't sure. But the second time, they walked right past one.

So this design seems to be safe from building destroyers:

Code: [Select]

.......
...F...
..FWF..
.FWbWF.
.FWhWF.
..FWF..
...F...
.......

I also had an order to deconstruct one of the windows (with the hatch locked to prevent access from inside) and it's been sitting for almost a year without anyone doing it. So dwarves don't seem to be able to deconstrcut with only diagonal access, either.


Good to know !  Good science!

[AutomataKittay]

Well, I've had two sieges, and in both cases the trolls ignored my diamond shaped bunkers and headed straight for my fort. In the first siege, they didn't really go near the two bunkers I have built, so I wasn't sure. But the second time, they walked right past one.

So this design seems to be safe from building destroyers:

Code: [Select]

.......
...F...
..FWF..
.FWbWF.
.FWhWF.
..FWF..
...F...
.......

I also had an order to deconstruct one of the windows (with the hatch locked to prevent access from inside) and it's been sitting for almost a year without anyone doing it. So dwarves don't seem to be able to deconstrcut with only diagonal access, either.


Have there been any proof of building-destroyers working on diagonals? I know dwarves refuses to build proper construction from such slants, they'll put doors up though.

[ignatzami]

In my current fort I have built six of these watchtowers, they work beautifully. I have an artificial canyon carved through my map leading to my fort, with the watchtowers at the entrance to the fort, 20 tiles down the gully, and at the mid-point of the gully. The coverage works great, and combined with a large number of traps I've had no problems with ambushes!

[Girlinhat]

Just to confirm: You can build a wall, carve a fortification from the constructed wall, and build upon it.  The floor created by the converted wall still remains.  All of those worried "But they may not see the ambush through the walls!" can carve their walls.

[loser]

All of those worried "But they may not see the ambush through the walls!" can carve their walls.

Will they not be shot through those fortifications?

Can arrows not move like bishops in addition to the cardinal fashion?

[Girlinhat]

I've not observed them to, and it means the enemy would need to be in a specific location.  I've never seen any ranged soldier intentionally get into firing position.

[loser]

I've not observed them to, and it means the enemy would need to be in a specific location.  I've never seen any ranged soldier intentionally get into firing position.

I'm not convinced the shooter would need to be in an exact location.  Do you not think it would be figured by 'close enough'?

Have you made use of these with only the windows for protection, no corner posts?  I apologize in advance if this was addressed earlier in the thread.

There was a reason for only four windows, not eight, was there not?

[Maklak]

I learned, that in 31.25 one should only put one animal per tower, and preferably male. Even 2 animals in the same spot will get enraged and fight. Now my towers have red walls. Oh well, I'll just wait and see, what prevails. I should also probably order more male dogs from liaison, and train them for hunting (which may or may not sharpen their senses).

Oh, and I have a question. Does quality or material influence visibility? Will I be fine with -green glass window-s ?

[Girlinhat]

The reason for the wall corners (as mentioned in OP) is aesthetics.  In Stonesense, it looked weird with 8 windows, so I threw in walls and a roof.  I wasn't aware you could place fortifications by carving a wall.