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[Moosey]

Between the neck and the ear?

But seriously, I'm severely confused about what nobles can exist right now.  A big source of this confusion is the old bug of the liaison not being willing to talk about forming a Barony until the caravan completely leaves.  The wiki claims that this bug was fixed in 31.17, but I can attest that it still happens to me in 31.19 (not upgrading to .21 yet due to active long-life fort).

There seems to be similar confusion about the other nobles that a Barony should attract.  Some wiki pages seem to infer that the arrival of a Dungeon Master can never happen, and other pages say it can.  I also hear people on the forums talking about the Hammerer and Tax Collector that come with the economy, but I haven't seen any of that since the halcyon days of 40d.

So what's the deal?  You who have DMs and economies, how did you get them?

[Girlinhat]

I'm pretty sure that everyone who claims to have these is using an older version, or a modified version.  You can mod the requirements, to make a noble appear when you want, and that's where most hacked DM's come from.

[ThrowerOfStones]

*shrug* They come fine for me unmodded, and have since they were supposedly fixed.

[Warped]

My leader was updated to a duchess at some point without me noticing (I did have 4-5 sieges to deal with at the time). And I didn't have to wait until the merchants left.

She did die to melancholy when I removed her bedroom, office and dining room furniture to replace rock with silver and brass. On a happy note her Royal Mausoleum was perfected well before she passed.

Now I only have a mayor again. Stupid impatient nobles.

[Moosey]

Phweeee.  So is it just me?  Are nobles completely broken for anyone else?

[Nopkar]

several years on a vanilla fort and I never had nobles arrive...I dunno.

[agatharchides]

I have had no troubles with mayors, barons or duchies. Never seen a Hammerer or Dungeon Master since 40d.

[Malakai Makaisson]

I've only ever got up to a mayor and he was annoying enough.

About as useful as a catflap in an elephant house.

[PopeRichardCorey]

In .19, I had no problems whatsoever with Barons; My current fort (which won't crumble, damnit, I want to make a world with pandamans) is all the way up to a Duchy.  (It's also got 196 dwarves and is still getting about 10 fps, which is bewildering, honestly.)

Dungeon Masters definitely aren't showing up, at least not most of the time.  Maybe Hammerers will if you have a Captain of the Guard and some Royal Guardsmen?  I would call him Snoopy.

[FuzzyZergling]

I've never gotten a non-appointable noble, ever.

[ral]

I've gotten barons, counts, dukes, but no dungeon master.

I suspect people who haven't gotten barons, at least, aren't making any offerings to their civilization leaders.

[Valkyrie]

I'd stopped at .13, and returned in .19.  I know I'd gotten the 'the caravan needs to leave successfully for Barony speech' bug plenty originally, but in .19 I've had no issues in the two new forts I've run - the liason happily offers me the option while the traders are still at the depot (haven't tried with the caravan dead, though), and it becomes official as soon as the Liason makes it off the map alive.  Promotion to a county and a duchy is just an extra screen near the start of the Liason conversation for that year, mentioning the impending change, and it happens as soon as the Liason makes it off the map alive - there's no 'choice' or 'acceptance' involved, mere notification by the Liason.

I haven't seen a Dungeon Master or a Hammerer in a long time, since when they were generally labelled 'bugged'.  I'd tried various voodoo in pre-.13 versions to get a Dungeon Master with no success, and haven't seen one yet in .19 or .21 either.

In the earlier (pre-.13) versions, I've gotten the monarchs as well.  They were generally widows/widowers of a nearly-dead civilization, however, so they came with virtually nothing for an entourage.  Last time I had a for large enough for a Mayor was during the multiple-mayors bug, so I got too many of that noble, rather than too few :p

The main two abnormalities of my forts are small size (~40 dwarves usually; my two .19 forts have had ~35 dwarves) and no Justice system (I never appoint a Captain of the Guard, so that whole side of things never kicks in aside from Nobles being unhappy about delayed punishments).  The only mod was a change to the goblin civ, lowering their min population for sieges so I could still be besieged with such small forts.

So, essentially, in my experience the appointed nobility (expedition leader, etc), the promoted nobility (barony and beyond), and the monarch works fine, but the Dungeon Master, Hammerer, and Tax Collector seem unacquireable in vanilla at this point.

[arkhometha]

Between the neck and the ear?

But seriously, I'm severely confused about what nobles can exist right now.  A big source of this confusion is the old bug of the liaison not being willing to talk about forming a Barony until the caravan completely leaves.  The wiki claims that this bug was fixed in 31.17, but I can attest that it still happens to me in 31.19 (not upgrading to .21 yet due to active long-life fort).

There seems to be similar confusion about the other nobles that a Barony should attract.  Some wiki pages seem to infer that the arrival of a Dungeon Master can never happen, and other pages say it can.  I also hear people on the forums talking about the Hammerer and Tax Collector that come with the economy, but I haven't seen any of that since the halcyon days of 40d.

So what's the deal?  You who have DMs and economies, how did you get them?

In my old .18 fort, the nobles just came after the caravan completely leaved, so the bug was still on. Didn't test on .19 or .21, though.
No sign of hammerer or DM in .18, and I got to dukedom and to the HFS.
Unmodded DF, too.