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[j0nas]

Yeah, I don't think ballista arrows benefit from the weight of the material the same way hammers and maces do.

Those things were ridiculously powerful at some point, regardless of what kind of arrows they used, if I remember correctly. They were toned down a lot for DF2010, but I'm not sure it was a good adjustment, given that a ballista fired at mid-range should be ridiculously powerful, and that the inaccuracy, immobility and the slow production of ammunition already balances them (not to mention siege operators crapping their pants).

I wouldn't say that they were silly powerful, for the amount of work you had to put in to make them even useful, designing your entrances around it and so forth, they were reasonable.  From what I've read in this thread they're just plain useless now. :/

[Cotes]

Yeah, I don't think ballista arrows benefit from the weight of the material the same way hammers and maces do.

Those things were ridiculously powerful at some point, regardless of what kind of arrows they used, if I remember correctly. They were toned down a lot for DF2010, but I'm not sure it was a good adjustment, given that a ballista fired at mid-range should be ridiculously powerful, and that the inaccuracy, immobility and the slow production of ammunition already balances them (not to mention siege operators crapping their pants).

I wouldn't say that they were silly powerful, for the amount of work you had to put in to make them even useful, designing your entrances around it and so forth, they were reasonable.  From what I've read in this thread they're just plain useless now. :/

That's my point. They could kill practically anything on impact but they had other flaws to balance them, and it wasn't unrealistic that they did.

[JimboOmega]

Does anyone know if better weapons material makes better arrows?  I would never waste steel on ballista arrows (oh precious steel!), but has anyone tried that?

Also, is there any way to edit raws or etc. to get my ballistae a little bit better?  I can deal with inaccuracy or ineffectiveness individually, but both together is too much.  I've no raw-editing experience so I have no idea if it's possible.

[rephikul]

Does anyone know if better weapons material makes better arrows?  I would never waste steel on ballista arrows (oh precious steel!), but has anyone tried that?
Yes, better material penetrate better.
Also, is there any way to edit raws or etc. to get my ballistae a little bit better?  I can deal with inaccuracy or ineffectiveness individually, but both together is too much.  I've no raw-editing experience so I have no idea if it's possible.
No It's not possible

If you want to conserve your ammo, raise a bridge at the far end of the firing range so they dont get wasted.

[JimboOmega]

Does anyone know if better weapons material makes better arrows?  I would never waste steel on ballista arrows (oh precious steel!), but has anyone tried that?
Yes, better material penetrate better.

penetration as applies to ballista arrows seems to mean what it bruises - e.g., an arrow hits the lower body and bruises the guts, kidneys, or liver.  I don't really care about bruises; I want to increase fractures (it never seems to deal edged-type damage, like cutting or etc).   The best is when a head hit causes the death fracture, but that seems unaffected by arrow type - in my example a silver masterwork hit the head and only bruised the fat, but I've seen wooden arrows break heads about as well as silver ones.

So in real terms, is steel more effective than silver?  Had I access to steel at my site, I would test it myself, but I do not.

[Triaxx2]

I have yet to have a fort survive to reach Siege weapon stages, but I suspect that a channel 10-11 squares past the battery should keep the operators at their posts.

[blaize9]

hmm every time i use my ballista someone dies 

[BodyGripper]

hmm every time i use my ballista someone dies 

Isn't that the idea?   

[Valkyrie]

I wonder how much of the lack of edge attacking is from the use of silver as your metal test case.  Silver seems to be very low on the materials ladder.  When I use silver swords early on (just for *some* kind of metal weapon) and a swordsdwarf gets attached to one, they seem far less successful in later combat than their iron-, bronze-, and steel-wielding squadmates, even against leather-clad foes.  The silver-swordsdwarves mostly seem to occupy/distract the goblins, keeping them busy until something else can come by for the kill, or until they land a very lucky blow.  Even copper seems to make better swords than silver.  If ballista arrowheads don't gain an advantage from silver's weight, then its poor relative edged-material ranking might be making the gains minimal, even if metal arrowheads *do* have the ability to make a sizable difference.

While Steel is probably unrealistic, it seems premature to writeoff metal arrowheads entirely until tests have been done in Bronze or Iron.

[JimboOmega]

I wonder how much of the lack of edge attacking is from the use of silver as your metal test case.  Silver seems to be very low on the materials ladder.  When I use silver swords early on (just for *some* kind of metal weapon) and a swordsdwarf gets attached to one, they seem far less successful in later combat than their iron-, bronze-, and steel-wielding squadmates, even against leather-clad foes.  The silver-swordsdwarves mostly seem to occupy/distract the goblins, keeping them busy until something else can come by for the kill, or until they land a very lucky blow.  Even copper seems to make better swords than silver.  If ballista arrowheads don't gain an advantage from silver's weight, then its poor relative edged-material ranking might be making the gains minimal, even if metal arrowheads *do* have the ability to make a sizable difference.

While Steel is probably unrealistic, it seems premature to writeoff metal arrowheads entirely until tests have been done in Bronze or Iron.

From what I've seen of ballistae, they do blunt damage - bruises and breaks only.  Hence my partially obscured (now corrected) post about penetration (it seems to affect brusing of internal organs more).   Also, if you are using silver weapons...  you really should be using hammers... not swords.

That said, I'd love to see somebody use steel/iron/bronze ballista arrows, and, assuming they can overcome all the other difficulties and get a hit, I'd like to see how they perform.

Edit: What I mean is, I've never, across dozens of arrows and hundreds of hits, seen them deal bladed damage.  Not even a little tear of the skin.  Always bruise this, bruise that.  If somebody wants to try it with a better metal, do let me know how it goes.

[Korva]

I had some fun with ballistae in one of my older forts when they pretty much broke a (rather weak) siege by themselves thanks to a lucky kill or three -- but you do need that luck, or the "sitting duck" treatment with cage-trapping the squad leader. I'd use them more if the accuracy and the effort investment were rewarded by higher damage. As it is, I decided to stick with weapon trap corridors and good old axedwarves.

[Tirunus]

hmm every time i use my ballista someone dies 

What version do you use?