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Author Topic: Bad Fort Design?  (Read 12365 times)

Sarudak

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #30 on: February 23, 2011, 11:05:53 pm »

You know you can just press x on the statue placement menu to expand the statue menu and place exactly the one you want right?
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Girlinhat

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #31 on: February 23, 2011, 11:12:31 pm »

Yeah, but I find it's usually easy to forbid/dump/melt the lame statues.  Like all those ones of a random human dying in year 5 from a random goblin.  I don't care.  Give me statues of bronze colossus and butchered elves!

Johnny Madhouse

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2011, 10:16:46 pm »

That fort was many months ago, when 31 was still pretty new. It took me a little bit to notice all the new features.
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j0nas

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2011, 10:55:53 pm »

I would very much like a neat fractal layout that can incorporate all the features I need, glass pipes with both magma and water, separate of course, with built-in pump stacks for all my magma casting needs, as well as neatly laid out bedrooms, offices and workshops...but putting it all together like that is a lot of work, and then you inevitably screw up and it doesn't end up perfect and it's all for naught...NAUGHT I TELL YOU!

But it seems to me that sooner or later you're going to want larger bedrooms, like 3x3 at the very least, for all dwarves, complete with fancy statues and gem-decorated cabinets.  Because what motivation do dwarves have to come risk life and limb building my crazy shit if the eventual reward is not commensurate to the risk.  These tiny two-square bedrooms with barely even a door just bring a sad tear to my eye on the poor wretches' behalf.
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ext0l

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2011, 11:55:57 pm »

I think fractal layouts are bad for pathing/FPS.

I always stick to long hallways with small rooms branching out. Stockpiles go above or below, with only 1 or 2 staircases to access them.
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Lord Darkstar

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #35 on: March 01, 2011, 05:49:32 pm »

Jonas, are you serious?

Dwarf life back in the mountain home sucks so bad that they are willing to run to your starting hole in the ground--- even if you haven't even made a hole in the ground! Life sucks so bad for them back at hte mountain home that they are willing to live like ELVES or HUMANS wherever you are at in the world. If you give them a bed and let them plunder your food stockpiles and drink stockpiles, they'll stay pretty happy, especially if they can talk with other dwarves.
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learn to give consolations to frustrated people
What is this, a therapy session? We don't need to console someone because they're upset about a fucking video game. Grow a beard, son, and take off those elf ears!

raalph

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #36 on: March 01, 2011, 06:05:54 pm »

I suck at designing my forts. They are just a mine with lots of square rooms in random places.
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j0nas

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #37 on: March 01, 2011, 06:10:06 pm »

Jonas, are you serious?

Dwarf life back in the mountain home sucks so bad that they are willing to run to your starting hole in the ground--- even if you haven't even made a hole in the ground! Life sucks so bad for them back at hte mountain home that they are willing to live like ELVES or HUMANS wherever you are at in the world. If you give them a bed and let them plunder your food stockpiles and drink stockpiles, they'll stay pretty happy, especially if they can talk with other dwarves.
I always thought of it more like dwarves immigrating in hopes of a better life, with promises of abundance and personal wealth far beyond their station.  Why else would a legendary cheeser, known far and wide for his excellent cheese, come to my fort with his only child and pet cat and happily resign the rest of his life hauling stone back and forth and bashing goblins with a copper short sword, even after I kill both his child and pet in unfortunate training room 'accidents'?

Plus it's more fun that way, let's face it, 200 nook and door bedrooms are easily finished within the first season, and then what? ;)
« Last Edit: March 01, 2011, 06:13:50 pm by j0nas »
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Terrahex

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #38 on: March 01, 2011, 06:12:27 pm »

let's face it, until dwarves can pass an alcahol test, we're going to have to continue making bedrooms for "Efficiency" but I doubt the DMV will be issueing dwarves driving licences anytime soon.
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What do you think? Yes? No?

Hyndis

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #39 on: March 01, 2011, 06:34:09 pm »

I rarely actually get around to making bedrooms for my dorfs. They end up sleeping on the floor in a random room I call a dorm. It may have only a single bed. :(
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Brent Not Broken

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #40 on: March 01, 2011, 06:48:10 pm »

I rarely actually get around to making bedrooms for my dorfs. They end up sleeping on the floor in a random room I call a dorm. It may have only a single bed. :(
Just like a real dorm!
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Itnetlolor

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #41 on: March 01, 2011, 07:12:15 pm »

I generally design around a terrain for the surface portions of a fort. I usually also make my gateways 3-wide for wagon access, and when possible, mount floodgates (+mechanisms) on those doors and rig a trap setup nearby or within. It would most likely also have a nearby mini-barracks for defense, and fortifications would be available as well just in case. Factories and farms stay on the sandy/loamy areas. But with clay loam being a resource we can use now, I may have to change up a bit (and also use clay walls or make clay huts for the farming districts (up and down)).

Also if/when possible, I also make a back door with similar setup. I think (Old and maybe New) Wavehandle is one of my better examples of how I plan. Bloodfist (the fort, not the ship) as was just a disaster that eventually got corrected when I, and my dwarves, got around to it.

Eventually I would build Cap Towers (named because they look like mushrooms) around the perimeter, and setup my defense network around it with a sub-barracks between or in the middle of the network.

Of course, before I get around to security networking, I have to get around to claiming my region, IE- building a perimeter wall around the site to funnel everyone from the outside to either the front or back door.

After enough time, I eventually build a bridge system to direct everything to either the front door, or the security trap sector. The back door will be heavily guarded with cap towers and a lesser barracks, and will generally be a source for much fun when sieges come around, unless they don't bust down the doors, and re-route to the front and trap sector, unless I set one up at the back.

With recent 31.xx experience, I may need to work on making separate shaft portals from surface to underground levels 1, 2, and H). The deeper, the more interesting the building, and the more security traps for the beasts that come out (in case my gatekeepers get killed, or the doors bust). I may or may not have separate burrows setup for the individual sectors (also why I use the tomb-like portals which go directly to them; those burrows will be dedicated cavern layers, and treated as separate fortresses, since the separation would be sufficient enough to qualify).

For what it's worth, I think pitting those portals near the barracks would be most suitable. That way, the guards can worry about the back door (most likely not raided as much), and anything that sneaks out of the caverns, or to stand guard from anything that gets past the portals' trap systems and the UG forts themselves.



Regarding Isoforts (Isolated-Fort) (basically, a location like an island where I am guaranteed no contact from the outside or sieges (or is an equally safe location)), I instead build my Isofort with a city-like infrastructure; starting with the underground sewers/subways, and after breaching a(round) aquifers, mine and build the city up. Clay will work wonders with regards to some of the infrastructure, as well as easy materials to gather (unlike stone that requires breaching aquifers (through or around; I depend on DFhack for that issue).
« Last Edit: March 01, 2011, 07:50:22 pm by Itnetlolor »
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Lemunde

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #42 on: March 01, 2011, 07:13:10 pm »

I rarely actually get around to making bedrooms for my dorfs. They end up sleeping on the floor in a random room I call a dorm. It may have only a single bed. :(

I tend to make a few more beds but basically I do the same thing. For me, bedrooms are something that gets added late in the game. My last fortress actually lasted long enough for me to dig out 3x3 rooms for all 50 of my dwarves.
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Hyndis

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #43 on: March 01, 2011, 07:32:25 pm »

Bedrooms are pretty much dead last on my to-do list.

First its getting the main hall dug out. Then defense. Then food/industry/storage. Then refuse/wood storage. Then throne rooms for the baron and the eventual king, then I work on cranking up the industrial output to fully arm and armor my soldiers, and underground tower cap farms to supply wood for steel production, which of course requires me to dig out huge rooms, clear them of stone, and rig up a device to flood and drain them. Doing that requires construction of pump stacks and massive power plants, along with engineering crawlspaces. Since I've breached the caverns by now the caverns will need to be sanitized...

Its very rare I actually get around to making bedrooms. To compensate I cram the dining hall full of artifact furniture.
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ZergSpartan

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Re: Bad Fort Design?
« Reply #44 on: March 02, 2011, 10:33:46 pm »

I challenged myself to a tower-microfort, every z-level was 11x11 with a staircase in the middle. I punched all the way down to the magma sea and decided to start building up. A missplaced floor tile is built. 132 z-levels of fort, animals, and dwarves go tumbling into the magma sea. I have now started to place "Buffer-z's" every few levels since I found out about punch-though!
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"Yeah. My plan was to drop some kittens into the siege, and have my dwarves freefall into battle, landing on top of the kittens. The plan was kinda dumb though because the kittens were standing on grates, and the goblins killed them with arrows just as I was releasing the freefalling dwarves. So the dwarves weren't able to land on kittens and just fell and died."
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