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Author Topic: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)  (Read 49978 times)

bluephoenix

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #105 on: March 09, 2011, 06:59:37 pm »

Hmm, there was some ascii game in its alpha stage called infinity if I remember correctly, it even had its own thread on here but I can't find it not even when I search for it for some reason.
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fqllve

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #106 on: March 09, 2011, 07:15:27 pm »

Have you tried the Elite series?
If that's not satisfying enough, then I suppose you'll have to wait for Infinity(meaning the upcoming MMO game, not the waiting time).
Holy crap, Infinity looks awesome! I don't think I've been this excited about a game ever. Thank you!
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Robsoie

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #107 on: March 09, 2011, 08:11:50 pm »

If you're looking for a game in the same genre as Frontier Elite 2 or Frontier: First Encounter instead of a simulator like Orbiter, you can try the open source game " Pioneer "
http://pioneerspacesim.net/

It's basically a recreation of Elite2/Elite3 and feature some planet with impressive generated terrain.
It's not feature complete yet, but you can enjoy exploring.
you can see a video of the latest version of it :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-SrAMFvOLE
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bluephoenix

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #108 on: March 10, 2011, 03:27:16 am »

How good are everyones skills? As in: Can you get to orbit and back, can you get to the moon and back, can you get to different planets?
I myself have played orbiter for a long time but can only get to the moon and back since I only tried getting somewhere else twice and failed.
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Nistenf

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #109 on: March 10, 2011, 09:53:25 am »

I can go to Orbit or a Station and back, though I have problems landing where I want. I can go to the Moon and back. I can go to other planets but in a bad way, I don't know how to set up the escape manouvre. The mid course corrections and everything else I do well
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bluephoenix

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #110 on: March 10, 2011, 05:48:58 pm »

I allways manage to sync my orbit with the other planets, but I allways end up way above or below it but in the orbit MFD it says I should be very close to it.
Also, I have no problem getting to orbit, docking and landing where I want.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2011, 06:03:26 pm by bluephoenix »
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Nistenf

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #111 on: March 13, 2011, 02:25:37 pm »

How do you calculate when to do the deorbit burn?
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bluephoenix

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #112 on: March 13, 2011, 06:13:05 pm »

I don't really calculate I allway guess when to do all the different burns :P (yes please tell me what I should do)
but suprisingly I allways to get to the moon or close to the other planets that way I think I am just good at guessing :P .
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Robsoie

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #113 on: March 13, 2011, 09:16:54 pm »

To reach other planets, i use TransX.
It is much easier than it looks, it is just like a de-orbiting and re-entry a question of pracice.

An example, i'll use the XR-2 and i want to get to Mars.

By default, the XR-2 has only a fuel capacity to get to ISS or at most the Moon.

So before getting a Mars trip, we need to use bigger reserves.
You need to edit the XR-2 properties in the file named
XR2RavenstarPrefs.cfg
located in the config folder of your Orbiter directory.

so in this file (each entries are described), look for
Code: [Select]
MainFuelISP=2and change it to
Code: [Select]
MainFuelISP=5that the explanation said to be enough for a trip to Mars.

Now the XR serie simulate oxygen being consummed by the crew, and Mars is not exactly close enough for a default setting (by default the XR-2 has enough oxygen for 14 days)
So change
Code: [Select]
LOXLoadout=1into
Code: [Select]
LOXLoadout=7enough oxygen to spend 3 years in space (should take much less to get to Mars)

Of course, after those changes your XR-2 will be a -very- lot heavier, so don't attempt a re-entry with your fuel and O2 cargo load at their fullest ;)

In the Orbiter launcher, in the module tab make sure transX is activated (it is not by default)

Load the "Docked at ISS" scenario from the XR-2 entries.
By default in this scenario the XR-2 is not full of fuel and O2, so you need to fill them.
It's good you're docked at ISS because you can get fuel from the station.
Open the Fuel Hatch and the LOX Hatch
Once they're open, click on the external supply line button corresponding to MAIN, APU and LOX.
Once they're full they unclick themselves.
Now close the Fuel and LOX hatches

Undock from ISS

Put the APU online, close the Nose Cone and bring the APU offline again.

Use the Align Plane MFD
Press TGT -> Celestial Bodies -> More Celestial Bodies and select Mars

Wait until you (P in the MFD) are +/- coming near position DN use the to Orbit Normal+ autopilot, and when "ENGAGE THRUST ORBIT NORMAL +" flashing indicator happen, just burn, you'll see RInc being lowered.
When KILL THRUST appear again, stop burning.

Wait until you're going for position AN , use Orbit Normal - autopilot, wait until "ENGAGE THRUST ORBIT NORMAL -" appear and BURN.
Etc...etc.. until you get the RInc as close as possible to 0 (remember you can use the Translation RCS numpad6 and numpad9 to fine tune), it will mean you're now moving in Orbit while being on the same orbital plane as Mars.

Now use the TransX MFD
By default we're on Stage 1.
There's no target at the Select Target Planets/Moons
Click on the button ++ to the right until Escape is selected, the stage 1 of our Mars travel will be to actually escape Earth Orbit.


Once done, click on the button FWD to bring us to Stage 2.
Again by default nothing is selected, so click ++ until Mars is displayed.
the inner blue circle is Earth Orbit
the outer blue circle is Mars Orbit

Click the VW button to change the "Select Target Planets/Moons" to  Eject Date
click Var to browse until you have Prograde Vel (velocity) in which we'll setup our prograde autopilot planning
By clicking ++ we add some prograde speed in the plan and with -- we lower it.
The increments are set to "Coarse" for tuning , we can lower the size of the increments by ADJ+ or ADJ- button for finer tuning, but for the prograde plan, let it to Coarse.


I increase until my planned trajectory (the yellow growing circle) cut Mars orbit.
It happens there :


Notice the Cl. App (rough) at 7.43G , it means that at this trajectory, our closest approach would throw us at 7.43 millions of kilometers from it !
Ouch, not really close we would just be lost so far from Mars it would not be very funny.

But notice that we have set only the prograde speed, meaning that's for immediate departure, something that would be rather silly considering where is Mars.

Now press VAR until you are on Eject Date.

Press ++ to change our eject date for the future until you see the Cl. App. decreasing.
Do not get too much more than Coarse increment.
At some point the Cl. App would increase again, get back (-- key) at your lowest Cl. App. and increase the increment from Coarse to Medium or Fine, we need to find the best date possible for the closest encounter.

For my best eject date for my plan, i found it to be there :


It would throw us at +/- 4 millions of kilometers from Mars, that's better, if we like being lost in space.
So continue to increase the date until your yellow bar catch the white bar. A bit like that :


Go back to Prograde Vel and again make it so the Cl. App got lowered, fine tune the result for best Cl. App.
Not bad, we're at 836.000 km from Mars.

Now press Var until you see "Ch Plane Vel." and fine tune to lower the Cl. App. again.
Not too bad, we're closer, 320.000 km

Play again with the prograde/eject date/ch plane vel to make the lowest Cl. App possible.
In the end a very good 21000 km from Mars (very close) for my eject date that will be
MJD 52029.1081 and we're currently at MJD 51984.7563
MJD is for Modified Julian Day
According to this website
http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/cgi-bin/Tools/xTime/xTime.pl
it means my current day is 16 March 2001
And the eject date for my planning will be  30 April 2001
Well, good that Orbiter comes with accelerated time ;)

Note it's important to know that this is only the plan, reality will be different, and that's why we'll certainly a correction once or twice during the travel to Mars.

Press FWD to see the Stage 3 of our plan, in the center it's Mars and in green our planned trajectory :


Now remove any autopilot (high accelerated time + autopilot is an extremely bad idea in Orbiter) and max accelerate time until you're reaching MJD 52028, be very very very carefull to not miss and overshoot MJD 52029 or you'll be very sorry.

Now look at your Stage 3 in the TransX MFD , press BCK 2 times to get back to Stage 1


Notice the "Begin Burn" that the count until we should start burning like crazy.
Important, remember the word prograde we have used so far, it because when you will start your escape burn, you will need to be in PROGRADE autopilot.

When you will have burned well enough, the Stage1 MFD will change, you can't miss it , you're not in Orbit anymore


Note the planned trajectory in yellow, and the real one in green, that's already a bit different isn't it, and it will get worse (and so will need corrections)
Click FWD to see Stage 2, again in yellow the plan and in green our real.
That's rather big as a difference. But don't worry (too much).



Wait and wait and ... when you far from Earth, the Stage 1 MFD will change into this automatically :

So we'll miss Mars by 89 millions of kilometers, Robsoie you're the worst pilot ever ! :D

But that's great as it's time for our first correction.
Press VW until you see "Manoeuvre Mode" that is OFF, click on ++ to set it to ON
Press VAR until you see the familiar Prograde Vel , press VAR again until you see Man. Date
Click ++ a bit to set a date for a few hours ahead, so you have time to setup the remnant of your correction planning.
We're at 52038 (9 May), so let's put this to 52039 (10 May) with a very fine tunning when pressing ++
Press VAR (or -VR) until you get back to Prograde Vel and use ++ until you get the closest approach at its lowest

Not bad, missing Mars from 89 millions of km , we get to 1.7 millions of miss.

Press VAR and get to Ch Plane Vel and fine tune to lower this number.
Play again with , don't hesitate to increase a bit the date of our maneouver, if it help to lower the distance we'll get , but keep enough time for setting up your correction.
You can play with Outward Vel too.

After making what i could, my correction plan
38000 kilometers, that's very good (remember plan and reality may not be the same anyways, we will very certainly a correction in mid flight.

Now press VW until you see this :

With the Rotation RCS (and the give some slight press of a Rotation RCS following immediately by a Killrot to help you fine tuning), put the crosshair roughly in the middle of it.
Notice the "Begin Burn" to help us now when we will start burning again to make the correction.


Do not engage any autopilot now and wait until you're ready to burn.
IMPORTANT, before burning make sure the crosshair will be roughly at the center, it will have drifted while you're waiting.

The goal during this burn will be to lower the "Delta V" to ideally 0
When you're done, press VW until you're back at the prograde/plane vel change and press VAR until you see Manoeuver ON, turn it to OFF by pressing ++


My correction was very good as it put me at 340.000 kilometers from Mars, far from the 38.000 planned, but the next correction in mid flight will certainly make it much much better.

Time to sleep, be sure you've got no autopilot engaged and go to Max acceleration time and wait a while, look at the MFD to see when you're +/- at mid flight.

And set the Manoeuver again to ON and do the exact same as we just did for another correction, because the estimated closest approach will never cease to increase due to the various gravity force applied on us by the whole cosmic floaters ;)

In the end of the flight, don't hesitate to make another correction before Mars.


At the end of my 2nd correction( i waited only for a few days, far far from the mid flight, after i turn Manoeuver to oo, i'm planned to 66.000 km from Mars, not the best possible, but that's much better than before (you can press FWD to see Stage 3 and look where your Orbit lead you in comparison to Mars)
See this point :
Yes it's Mars.

The encounter is planned at MJD 52345 (12 March 2002) and we're at MJD 52074 (14 June 2001), so back to max acceleration, follow your trajectory and the Mars one (you can see the Earth orbit too) until your encounter to decide when to do correction and when to wait.
Important again, never use any autopilot during a max acceleration time.

After my last correction, not too far from Mars, i'm flying good with a +/- close approach of 15000 kilometers.
Time to keep on Stage 3 when you're close to Mars (look at your planned encounter date and your current date)
You'll have to use the Retrograde Autopilot and burn to build the orbit once you're in position.

Sadly it's where the game crashed on me, guess the XR2 built-in checks, scripts and functions do not like max acceleration and planets proximities and can conflicts with Orbiter own checks, scripts and functions.
It's not the first time the XR2 crash on me, even the very recent latest version from a few days ago, in such conditions.

I should have used the more stable stock Deltaglider for this little tutorial, less built-in functions but never crashed anywhere.

But in Stage 3 you should be able to see your approach to Mars, and once near, go into retrograde position and burn until you have finished building an orbit.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2011, 09:22:18 pm by Robsoie »
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Fayrik

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #114 on: March 13, 2011, 10:39:33 pm »

I've been reading this topic for awhile, but delayed trying this out till a little while ago.

But man, this is hard to understand.
I've been trying to get synced orbits going with the Delta Glider, but I can barely get a stable orbit going. Still no idea how to sync with the ISS.

...But I believe this has a multiplayer function, does it not? Would anyone be interested in trying it out?
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bluephoenix

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #115 on: March 14, 2011, 01:05:19 am »

Massive post
Wow, thanks I will try it out as soon as I can.

I've been reading this topic for awhile, but delayed trying this out till a little while ago.

But man, this is hard to understand.
I've been trying to get synced orbits going with the Delta Glider, but I can barely get a stable orbit going. Still no idea how to sync with the ISS.

...But I believe this has a multiplayer function, does it not? Would anyone be interested in trying it out?
The multiplayer function is still in development and I can't connect to it because of my router and its firewall and all that but if you have questions I am sure me and everyone else here will answer them.

To get a stable orbit, simply do a prograde burn when you are at your apoapsis and watch the orbit MFD to see when your orbit is stable.
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Carrion

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #116 on: March 14, 2011, 04:24:42 am »

Yeah, like bluephoenix said, at the apoapsis (the highest point in your orbit) do a prograde (use the autopilot, it will basically face you the way that your velocity vector is taking you--this is marked by the circle with a cross through it) burn and watch your Orbit MFD.  I find it helpful to change your projection mode to 'ship' in the Orbit MFD.  You can do this by pressing the PRJ button in the top right.  This will show the shape of your orbit.  To get a stable orbit, do the prograde burn until the eccentricity (labled Ecc in the MFD list) is 0.00 or less. 

I can't offer any help on docking with the ISS.

Robsoie: Thank you again for your wealth of knowledge.  I have been taking a break from Orbiter but will be sure to use your tutorial when I try to make it to the Mars and/or the moon.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 04:28:33 am by Carrion »
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Robsoie

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #117 on: March 14, 2011, 08:33:30 am »

Don't worry about the length of the tutorial, it's just that i try to describe what i do, adding more words.
In practice it is not complicated and does not take long to establish your correction and flight plans.

Addendum to the tutorial.
I remade my flight with the XR2, and again crashed once i was in the vicinity of Mars. As usual, the .log are useless as they do not report anything that went wrong or even recorded a crash occuring.

But this time, before going near my goal, i actually used a F4 -> Quicksave that actually allowed me to retry from before it crashed.
I was a bit surprised when i loaded that quicksave, as the colors of the lines were not all green, but each had the correct color display, like in older transx versions.

Anyways, this time it worked and didn't crash once i got to Mars, so here's the ending of the tutorial.

When your XR2 will be near enough to Mars, the Stage 2 screen of the TransX MFD will transform into the Stage 3 screen automatically :


Unless you really forgot to make corrections during flight or you have been very very bad at it ;) you should be good.
The line in green is your real trajectory, in the center of the MFD, it's Mars
Waiting a bit


Mars in the center, the long line in green is my trajectory and the line that start from Mars and cut my trajectory is indicating my own position on my projected trajectory.
This help you to decide when to do your retrograde burn.

We're not that far from Mars anymore at that point :


Ok, now should be a good time to start our retrograde burn, fortunately i have some fuel left for it.


Going to Retrograde autopilot, and start burning while watching the transx MFD to see the orbit building itself.


Not the best orbit ever, but finally we're there, we're in orbit around Mars

(that's not a high res version of the Mars texture, it's just the normal one)

I was left with a bit less than 10% of fuel at that point, not sure if it's normal or if i mismanaged it, but that's why you needed to edit the XR-2 config as there's no way you could have reached Mars with the stock settings.

For the oxygen, i had a bit more than 70% left, so you could certainly lower the setting in the config file without a problem.

Oh and 10% main fuel left certainly mean that unless there's a fuel station somewhere around, there's no going back to Earth :D
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 08:43:15 am by Robsoie »
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Fayrik

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #118 on: April 04, 2011, 10:46:05 pm »

Today, I downloaded the level 10 textures for Mars and Earth. I figured I may as well give them a go. By this point, I've already taken a few nice pictures of Earth, Venus. Mostly Saturn and it's moons.
So, then I have Orbiter with level 10 textures, and I figure I may as well go out and take a look at them.
Earth is great. It still has a few lines where textures meet and such, but it does look like you're in a spaceship flying over google earth or something!
So, with Earth scoped out, I cheated my way to Mars (I've made the flight before, it takes forever).
I got a bit distracted here, since the Martian decent has killed me more than a couple of times, so I figured I'd give it another go. (With heat turned off, I'm building up slowly!) I land at Olympus, and it's all cool. When I take off again, my initial orbit passes strait over the Northern Pole... Unfortunately, the LOD failed me a bit, but even with a bit of blur in the weirdest places, I managed to take a screenshot that still made me gawp.
The 1.5MB file is here. I figured it would be better in a link.
And yes, the LOD ruins it. But what I'd do to get a similar screenshot where the LOD hadn't decided to kick in for all but a slice of the planet...
(And there I was wondering if running the XR2 in a skin would make any difference for this session! Ha.)
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Robsoie

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Re: Orbiter (free space flight simulator)
« Reply #119 on: June 14, 2011, 08:13:18 pm »


Somewhere over Argentina, making an attempt to re-entry to Wideawake International, looks like it will be a night landing.



Everything looks good in the controls, the re-entry should go rather smoothly.



Leaving South America behind, we're now over the Atlantic.



A look from afar to south of Brazil and Uruguay, that's the last lights we'll see for a while.



Somewhere in the middle of Atlantic, the XR-2 is going in contact with the atmosphere.



We're always good according to the instruments, just a little pitch change from time to time to realign with Wideawake International our projected landing target.



That's the XR-2 burning in the atmosphere, being strongly slowed down by it, no worry our trajectory was good, the angle was good, and the heat shield is doing exactly what it is supposed to be doing, the temperature will not reach dangerous level at any time.



And finally at several dozen of kilometers, we see the lights of Wideawake International.

I really love that sim.
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