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[Darvi]

Since I'm not scum, And I know that Pan is too clever at scum hunting to be alive so he has to be scum... And scum would have been king if darvi was scum we would have already lost if he was...
and your confirmed townie... So that only leaves Jack...

That relies on the information that you are town. I agree on Pandar with you there, but we don't know if you're scum or not. WIFOM.

At the end of the day, I think we have a 50/50 chance of winning here. I'm pretty sure SaintDraze is scum, because he gets defensive when called scum, he's blackmailing (By saying that if we lynch him, we'll not help town), "my actions will help the town win", he quicklynched AND he "isn't afraid of... Lylols" Meaning that he doesn't care that we're on the brink if losing.

Who doesn't get defensive when they're called scum? I sure as hell know you and Painiac did, and you're towny as hell. But yeah, his arguments were horrible

So, we have a choice, Panda, or Jack?

Pretty much, but I'd like to wait until Pandar posts before making my opinions public.

[Darvi]

Bluh, BBCode hates me.

[SaintDraze]

I'd say I would be willing to be lynched to prove it but This is a misslynch and lose situation...

[Darvi]

No, this is pretty much lynch or lose.

[Supercharazad]

I'd say I would be willing to be lynched to prove it but This is a misslynch and lose situation...

The, "I give up and don't care if I'm lynched" typically comes as a scumtell...

[SaintDraze]

No, If My lynching will bring info I am happy to die for town to win.

[Darvi]

Generally, not lynching somebody during Mylo is useful, as it makes the pool of suspects smaller. However, killing yourself off isn't, unless you can make a no-lynch situation with your vote and otherwise would die. Also, it means losing one potential scumhunter.

[Pandarsenic]

Right, see, here's the problem.
1) Nobody has any real reasons I'm scum
2) Jack A T and SaintDraze were both too hesitant to look enthusiastic, thus leading to (in order):
Me: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2004021#msg2004021
SaintDraze: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2004855#msg2004855 (A post consisting mostly of lying or misconstruing my meanings in obvious, contrived ways)
Jack A T: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2005110#msg2005110 (A post that somehow manages to contain unwillingness to strongly commit to the other two players being scum)

Now, in http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2004021#msg2004021 you see how a townie would react: the realization that, with 2 of 5 players clear and 1 of 5 being ME, the other two must be scum.

However, SaintDraze and Jack A T never reached that epiphany this day because THEY ALREADY KNEW THEY WERE SCUM.

A NL would be retarded, they would shoot Darviac. Then (best case scenario), Supercharazad would crown me, I execute either scum, and the remaining scum shoots either town player to bring it to 1:1 for a scum win. Also, a mislynch would result in a town loss (obviously), and SaintDraze is trying to get Darviac to do something that will cause a town loss.

No, If My lynching will bring info I am happy to die for town to win.

If he were town he would realize the problem with saying this.

As-is, I think everyone can agree SaintDraze should die.

What will then follow:

Jack A T shoots one of Supercharazad and Darviac. Otherwise, he's shot me, leaving himself with two confirmed townies.
If he shoots supchar, then either Darviac or me becomes Kingmaker. If I become Kingmaker, I will of course immediately crown Darviac, since he's confirmed town. It is then up to Darviac whether to shoot me or Jack A T and determine the fate of the town.
If he shoots Darviac, supchar has already stated he intends to crown me so town wins if he does that.

Thus, the game can go three ways:
Darviac hangs Jack A T or SaintDraze, the remaining scum shoots supchar, and Darviac then chooses to crown me / hang the remaining scum when I crown him. Town win.

Darviac hangs Jack A T or SaintDraze, the remaining scum shoots supchar, and Darviac then chooses to crown the scum / hang me when I crown him. Town loss.

Darviac hangs me. Scum majority achieved, town loss.

[Darvi]

Now, in http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2004021#msg2004021 you see how a townie would react: the realization that, with 2 of 5 players clear and 1 of 5 being ME, the other two must be scum.

However, SaintDraze and Jack A T never reached that epiphany this day because THEY ALREADY KNEW THEY WERE SCUM.

Either that or they know better than to spread wine.

A NL would be retarded, they would shoot Darviac.

Agreed.

No, If My lynching will bring info I am happy to die for town to win.

If he were town he would realize the problem with saying this.

Yeah, suicide ain't the problem.

As-is, I think everyone can agree SaintDraze should die.

Saint would heavily disagree with ya.

What will then follow:

Jack A T shoots one of Supercharazad and Darviac. Otherwise, he's shot me, leaving himself with two confirmed townies.
If he shoots supchar, then either Darviac or me becomes Kingmaker. If I become Kingmaker, I will of course immediately crown Darviac, since he's confirmed town. It is then up to Darviac whether to shoot me or Jack A T and determine the fate of the town.
If he shoots Darviac, supchar has already stated he intends to crown me so town wins if he does that.

*nods*

Thus, the game can go three ways:
Darviac hangs Jack A T or SaintDraze, the remaining scum shoots supchar, and Darviac then chooses to crown me / hang the remaining scum when I crown him. Town win.

Darviac hangs Jack A T or SaintDraze, the remaining scum shoots supchar, and Darviac then chooses to crown the scum / hang me when I crown him. Town loss.

Darviac hangs me. Scum majority achieved, town loss.
Well, I'll sleep over it, it's currently half past 3 in the morning. I'll announce my thoughts next afternoon ('cause I won't be awake before then)

[Darvi]

Yeah, suicide ain't the problem.Solution.

Man, I really need some sleep.

[Darvi]

Also, fucked up the quoting -_-

[Jack A T]

Right, see, here's the problem.
1) Nobody has any real reasons I'm scum

And what do you consider a "real" reason?  Because obviously listing what I saw as scummy actions of yours means that I don't have any real reasons.

Jack A T: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2005110#msg2005110 (A post that somehow manages to contain unwillingness to strongly commit to the other two players being scum)

Please clarify.

However, SaintDraze and Jack A T never reached that epiphany this day because THEY ALREADY KNEW THEY WERE SCUM.

Because explaining that to Supercharazad surely proves that I didn't realize that, right?  At the very start of the day, I was being cautious, with the whole "Darviac is obvious scum" thing.  (Kingmaker 2 had a guaranteed scum win situation with a scum king on the last day, and it didn't end until the lynch.  Seriously, it happened.)  Besides, I was about to go to sleep.  The next day, I woke up, noticed that scum hadn't won yet, and thus searched for incriminating evidence against you and Saint.

As-is, I think everyone can agree SaintDraze should die.

Yes.  Yes.  Yes.  Heck, he seems to be rather willing to agree with that, somehow.


Oh, and hey, Supercharazad, are you still using random.org to choose a king, or are you going to choose one yourself?

[Darvi]

Oh, and hey, Supercharazad, are you still using random.org to choose a king, or are you going to choose one yourself?

I hope not.

Also, I've long since made up my mind. Since the day started in fact. Just needed your posts for verification. And now I'm leaving you guys hanging with all the suspense *hurhurhur*
He who guesses my scumpicks first will get a cookie (hint: how did everybody act, and why did they behave the way they did?)

Anyways, Im off to  bed now *Zzzz*.

[Pandarsenic]

Right, see, here's the problem.
1) Nobody has any real reasons I'm scum

And what do you consider a "real" reason?  Because obviously listing what I saw as scummy actions of yours means that I don't have any real reasons.

Jack A T: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2005110#msg2005110 (A post that somehow manages to contain unwillingness to strongly commit to the other two players being scum)

Please clarify.

However, SaintDraze and Jack A T never reached that epiphany this day because THEY ALREADY KNEW THEY WERE SCUM.

Because explaining that to Supercharazad surely proves that I didn't realize that, right?  At the very start of the day, I was being cautious, with the whole "Darviac is obvious scum" thing.  (Kingmaker 2 had a guaranteed scum win situation with a scum king on the last day, and it didn't end until the lynch.  Seriously, it happened.)  Besides, I was about to go to sleep.  The next day, I woke up, noticed that scum hadn't won yet, and thus searched for incriminating evidence against you and Saint.

As-is, I think everyone can agree SaintDraze should die.

Yes.  Yes.  Yes.  Heck, he seems to be rather willing to agree with that, somehow.


Oh, and hey, Supercharazad, are you still using random.org to choose a king, or are you going to choose one yourself?

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=76609.msg2005110#msg2005110

"Pandarsenic is harder to recognize.  Day 1, he was pushing for a confirmed townie lynch all day, but said confirmed town was Supercharazad, so meh."

Blatant falsehood. I didn't PUSH for it, I didn't largely SUPPORT it, but I left the possibility open as a potential emergency measure. If this statement were true, it would be a real reason.

"Janus?  Pandar doesn't seem to care too much about who is in town.  He does, however, seem to be encouraging a quicklynch, slightly."

I confused the names of Janus (not in this game) and Leafsnail (is in this game). Not proof. Also, not encouraging quicklynch as I made abundantly clear later.

Neither Jokerman nor Darvi made any real contribution on Day 2. I stand by what I said.

[Jack A T]

"Pandarsenic is harder to recognize.  Day 1, he was pushing for a confirmed townie lynch all day, but said confirmed town was Supercharazad, so meh."

Blatant falsehood. I didn't PUSH for it, I didn't largely SUPPORT it, but I left the possibility open as a potential emergency measure. If this statement were true, it would be a real reason.

...

Honestly, I'm at the point where I would accept Native lynching supercharazad as a perfectly pro-town action: a calculated sacrifice of a useless confirmed townie for a chance to confirm someone who'll do something pro-town. At all. Ever.

You want to know why I'm town? It's simple.

NO SCUM WOULD WANT YOU DEAD.

If I were scum, I would buddy you and agree with you and make nice with you and NOT WANT TO RIP YOUR FUCKING SPINE OUT AND SHOVE IT DOWN YOUR THROAT or at least make some effort not to rule myself out as a King choice by, say, informing the Kingmaker that the first thing I'll do if he kings me not-at-Lylo is execute him.

Everything you've said in this entire game has been a waste of time, supercharazad, and whoever is not on your team will reap the benefits of that until you stop being a retard and grow a fucking cerebral cortex.

Yep, you most certainly did not support a Supercharazad lynch.  I guarantee that.  It is clearly obvious from these posts where you state that it would be best for Supercharazad to live and not die and not have his spine ripped out and shoved down his throat.  Yep. 

However, it does seem I missed one of your posts that supports your argument here.  One that happens to give me another argument against you, to be exact.

Native: You were entirely too eager to lynch supercharazad. It wasn't something I wanted to do, but it was something I felt we should be prepared to if we had to. You should, if anything, have been turning your eye and your hammer to Painiac. But you didn't.

Why?

Because yes, asking whether the townies had any objections to lynching the confirmed townie who was recognized as a hazard to the town was overenthusiastic.  Especially compared to spine-ripping throat-cramming stuff.  And because spine-ripping throat-cramming stuff isn't actually wanting to kill Supercharazad.  Totally different.

"Janus?  Pandar doesn't seem to care too much about who is in town.  He does, however, seem to be encouraging a quicklynch, slightly."

I confused the names of Janus (not in this game) and Leafsnail (is in this game). Not proof. Also, not encouraging quicklynch as I made abundantly clear later.

First: Proof, no.  Evidence, yes, albeit extremely minor.  It was a quickly written "hi guys these two are scum town wins bye" post.  The Janus mistake showed that best.  How could someone rather experienced forget the name of a player central to their theory that quickly after gathering evidence?

Second: Abundant clarity:

I would be sorely disappointed if you merely went along with what I said instead of drawing your own conclusions. However, that said, who among us does NOT find Native's behavior scummy?

One line about how the king should form his own opinions after everyone tells him about how rushing is stupid, followed by saying "However, Native's scummy!".  So, uh...yeah.