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[MetalSlimeHunt]

The story of Dark Souls makes sense to me.

[Alkhemia]

The story of Dark Souls makes sense to me.

Yeah just had to read between the lines. Same with demon souls

[Facekillz058]

Yeah, I haven't gotten past Blighttown and I know pretty much the entire story.

Spoiler: In a nutshell. (click to show/hide)

You are chosen undead. After ringing both bells of awaking, you find out that:You must retrieve the fragments of Gwyn, Lord of Sunlight's soul, and place them in the lordvessel to open the kiln of the first flame, where Gwyn linked the first bonfire. I think. Anyway, fight Gwyn, kill Gwyn, link the fire, good ending, leave, bad ending.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Yeah, I haven't gotten past Blighttown and I know pretty much the entire story.

Spoiler: In a nutshell. (click to show/hide)

You are chosen undead. After ringing both bells of awaking, you find out that:You must retrieve the fragments of Gwyn, Lord of Sunlight's soul, and place them in the lordvessel to open the kiln of the first flame, where Gwyn linked the first bonfire. I think. Anyway, fight Gwyn, kill Gwyn, link the fire, good ending, leave, bad ending.

You don't even know the half of it. Keep looking, and you may yet discover esoteric secrets.

[majikero]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It depends if you consider an eternity burning in the first flame till it goes out again a good end or plunge the world into eternal darkness and rule as it's immortal king.

[Alkhemia]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It depends if you consider an eternity burning in the first flame till it goes out again a good end or plunge the world into eternal darkness and rule as it's immortal king.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

well it seems number 2 is the true ending and 1 will just keep the cycle anew so someone else would just have to do it

[Sordid]

The story of Dark Souls makes sense to me.

Yeah just had to read between the lines. Same with demon souls

Okay, here's how the story goes: You're a zombie that's thrown in prison because people don't like zombies. You get out, a giant crow comes out of nowhere and picks you up for no reason and carries you somewhere. Once there, a nameless guy tells you that if you ring two bells, something will happen. That's literally what he says. So you do that and then a weird talking snake thing tells you to get something called a "Lordvessel", whatever the balls that is. That doesn't make any bloody sense! I know what the story is, but only because I read it on the wiki. The game tells you nothing at all. Worst of all, it doesn't tell you why you're doing what you're doing. Why don't I just bugger off to a pub? Hell if I know. The protagonist has no stake in what's going on.
Oh, and as for the one choice you get to make in this so-called role-playing game? The game didn't even tell me it existed. Frampt tells me to get the Lordvessel, I do so, he takes me down the hole to place the damn thing on the other damn thing. At that point I had not met Kaathe yet, the game didn't even give the slightest hint that the next step in the story is actually optional and I can choose to do something different. And of course once you place the damn thing, the other damn snake won't be there. So had I not read the wiki and just played the game, I'd never even know there was a choice you can make!
There are games that have a unique style of storytelling and there are games that just have bad storytelling, and IMO DS is firmly within the latter category.
 

[majikero]

It's not really bad storytelling, more like realistic. You really have no idea if Frampt is saying the truth. Will you blindly follow what the snake says because "it's the story"?

I like it because your never give the whole picture.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Okay, here's how the story goes: You're a zombie that's thrown in prison because people don't like zombies.

The Undead are not exactly zombies, but yeah.

You get out, a giant crow comes out of nowhere and picks you up for no reason and carries you somewhere.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Crows and black feathers are a symbol of Velka, Godess of Sin.

So you do that and then a weird talking snake thing tells you to get something called a "Lordvessel", whatever the balls that is. That doesn't make any bloody sense! I know what the story is, but only because I read it on the wiki.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The Lordvessel is the vessel that can contain the Lord Souls. Hence the name.

The game tells you nothing at all.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

It tells you a lot of things, just not in a direct fashion and not completely. A lot of relevant information is hidden in item descriptions, for example.

Also, Frampt quite explicitly tells you that you're supposed to be Lord Gwyn's replacement.

Worst of all, it doesn't tell you why you're doing what you're doing. Why don't I just bugger off to a pub? Hell if I know.

Because everyone outside of Lordran hates the Undead and tries to either kill them or take them to asylums. Plus you're immortal and slowly going insane, do you really have anything better to do?

Oh, and as for the one choice you get to make in this so-called role-playing game? The game didn't even tell me it existed. Frampt tells me to get the Lordvessel, I do so, he takes me down the hole to place the damn thing on the other damn thing. At that point I had not met Kaathe yet, the game didn't even give the slightest hint that the next step in the story is actually optional and I can choose to do something different. Had I not read the wiki and just played the game, I'd never even know there was a choice you can make!

Firstly, a roleplaying game does not necessarily have to have choices. Secondly,

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Frampt obviously wants to make you think you have to link the fire. He's lying to you. He's manipulating you to maintain the Age of Fire. If he tells you "go burn in a firey pit until you go crazy so the gods can keep ruling over humans, or don't, I guess", that would be stupid.

The Souls games make you work to understand the story, and that isn't a bad thing. It creates an immersive atmosphere to be constantly examining the implications of everything you do and see. You have to pay attention, and if you don't, that isn't the game's fault.

[Haschel]

I found the story to be pretty refreshing when every other RPG has NPCs explaining every facet of the existing world as if they were born yesterday (which is actually accurate from a player's perspective). I simply can't relate to a character that needs every minor detail explained to them before they can function in the world. Exploring, discovery, and feeling like you actually progressed and worked towards some self-understanding of the world is incredibly fulfilling to me.

[nenjin]

To me the story delivery is very Japanese, in that it implies more than it says and has no problems leaving you wondering exactly what the truth is. I really enjoyed the style, personally, compared to your average RPG that has NPCs speech at you constantly to set the scene.

[Alkhemia]

In the end though kicking monster butt is the true story and reward.
which reminds me I need to do a fist run.

[Sordid]

Okay, I'm not going to respond to every point everyone's made, because they all seem broadly similar. So just the highlights:

You really have no idea if Frampt is saying the truth. Will you blindly follow what the snake says because "it's the story"?

No, I'll blindly follow it because the game's story has been strictly linear up to this point and it didn't give me a single hint at the fact that there's another option.

I like it because your never give the whole picture.

I don't like it because you're never given even a fraction of the picture. A game that does this kind of storytelling really well is Shadow of the Colossus. You know next to nothing, all you get is "she's dead, he wants her back, a powerful being offers to resurrect her if he kills some monsters, so off he goes". You get the essentials without any fluff. In DS you get lots of fluff in item descriptions and such but you're never given the essentials. It's the wrong way around.

Firstly, a roleplaying game does not necessarily have to have choices.

I guess you and I have a different definition of role-playing, then.

Secondly,

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Frampt obviously wants to make you think you have to link the fire. He's lying to you. He's manipulating you to maintain the Age of Fire. If he tells you "go burn in a firey pit until you go crazy so the gods can keep ruling over humans, or don't, I guess", that would be stupid.

Yes, that would be stupid. But I never said I wanted such a thing, I never complained about an NPC being deceitful.

The Souls games make you work to understand the story, and that isn't a bad thing. It creates an immersive atmosphere to be constantly examining the implications of everything you do and see. You have to pay attention, and if you don't, that isn't the game's fault.

If I don't pay attention, it's because I don't care. And if the game can't make me care, that is absolutely its fault. That's the difference between good storytelling and bad storytelling.

In the end though kicking monster butt is the true story and reward.

Yep. That's what I play the game for. If I have to read the story, I might as well just do it on the wiki. It's a lot easier that way.

[Haschel]

It's a fair enough position to have. Dark Souls and Demon Souls have many qualities that really depend on personal taste to enjoy- the combat, the difficulty, and the story simply aren't tailored for the largest possible demographic to enjoy. I think that's one of the things I respect the most about what From Software is doing though; they know what type of artistic direction they want and they embraced it for all it's faults. Their attention to detail when it came to the combat mechanics is definitely what allowed them to have the success they've had so far, but I'm hoping they'll try and maintain the same level of improvement they showed when moving from Demon's to Dark souls. Yeah, some of the changes didn't go over well with everyone, but the fact that they actually put the effort into trying new themes and mechanics while maintaining a certain level of quality is pretty awesome to me.

[ukulele]

I wont the game for the first time about a month ago, and i must admit, the whole talk about super dificulty sounds more like a widely spread rumor. In my opinion it is hard but i think everyperson can win it giving it more or less time, and you know if everyone can do it then its not that hard.