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[Itsapaul]

Are there iron ores that aren't in the sedimentary layer, or at least not within chalk/limonite/whatever the other one was?  Lately it seems I either get the perfect spot with something random like sandstone (or obsidian instead of a sedimentary layer), or the above sedimentary flux in like hot weather or with barely any trees or something.  Basically I'm trying to ask can you make steel without trading and without having to have a "noob friendly" spot.

EDIT - Forgot you could find hematite in obsidian.  How often does this usually happen?

[Hans Lemurson]

Preposterously, Hematite is a common sight among the basalt, alunite and obsidian of the fabled "Igneous Extrusive" layers found nearby volcanoes.

Other posters will also be quick to point out the harvestability of "goblinite", the other source of iron.  Iron is never unobtainable.

As for tips on surviving a "flux-less" embark, you can request most of the 5 flux-stones from caravans (Limestone, Marble, Chalk, Dolomite, Calcite.  Memorize these.) and get about 10-15 flux per year.  To supplement this, request Pig Iron (saves 1 flux) and Steel bars( just get the damn stuff) as well.  Also, requesting steel anvils is a good source as you can get several of them per caravan, have a base price of only 300, and melt down to an entire bar of steel.

Combining these, you can manage to produce something like 20-30 steel per year.  With no ready source of flux, Steel should be reserved for weapons or important equipment for important dwarves made only by the best smiths.

[Fellhuhn]

A steel anvil results in one steel bar? Doesn't an anvil only require one steel bar (+ fuel) to be forged? If so, that would be a great way to increase the skill of a dwarf (with a magma forge) without any costs.

[Hans Lemurson]

According to the wiki, the most recent versions of DF (all the ones I've ever played) have multi-bar requirments for many items.  An anvil SHOULD cost 3 bars of metal.  Given that, a return of only one bar is less exploitative.  However, given the current situation, you could train up a blacksmith and a furnace-operator by repeatedly forging and re-melting anvils without any worry of running out of metal.

[rephikul]

dont forget that you can request a plethora of items which have a chance to be made of steel and meltable.

[Hans Lemurson]

dont forget that you can request a plethora of items which have a chance to be made of steel and meltable.

I think that most crafts have a poor melting return, and only a few (toys?) can you actually specify that you want steel.  Furthermore, their price can be quite high if they are of anything other than basic quality and if they have decorations on them.

Me have large amounts of experience working within the limitations of a steel shortage?!!  What would make you think that?

[rephikul]

dont forget that you can request a plethora of items which have a chance to be made of steel and meltable.

I think that most crafts have a poor melting return, and only a few (toys?) can you actually specify that you want steel.  Furthermore, their price can be quite high if they are of anything other than basic quality and if they have decorations on them.

Me have large amounts of experience working within the limitations of a steel shortage?!!  What would make you think that? Were you seeing things you wanted to see?

I didnt say "craft" did I? Many items types have good tendency of showing up made of steel while being relatively cheap themselves. Specifically armors (plate/mail/greaves/legging/shield are best) > Picks > Weapons > Bolts > Trap components.

[Haruspex_Pariah]

Just be careful about attracting the monarch. Being a mountainhome means you can't make requests of the caravan. If you're lucky they might bring random steel items, but that's not something you can count on for a steady supply.

[Alastar]

I don't really consider steel all that important. Other materials are every bit as good for blunt weapons and projectiles. Picks and spears are adequate against comparable-quality armour. Full steel armour requires a lot of labour anyway... may as well muddle through with iron before clownite becomes available. If you adjust your military (less axes - edged weapons with a large contact area need a material advantage), the biggest loss is probably the ability to build outrageously valuable weapon traps that are still useful as such.

[Itsapaul]

Wait, do armors and weapons take >1 bar?  I thought you couldn't melt items down and reforge a million times since you didn't get xp from it somehow.

[Africa]

Keep in mind that bronze isn't half bad, either. Not as good as steel, sure, but view it as somewhat of a challenge.

[NecroRebel]

Wait, do armors and weapons take >1 bar?  I thought you couldn't melt items down and reforge a million times since you didn't get xp from it somehow.

They should take more than one bar for many pieces, as should most forms of furniture. Due to a bug, however, they don't.

Also, you shouldn't be able to melt things down and reforge them a million times due to metal loss, but, due to the same bug, many things you can. Furniture, for instance, currently takes 1 bar to make and returns 1 bar when melted. Armor isn't quite so good, as it takes 1 bar to make and returns .9 at most (breastplate), crafts are even worse at 60% maximum return (goblets), and weapons are worst at 50% return (trap components). When the required-bars-number bug is fixed, furniture will drop to a 1/3 return and armor to a 1/2 return, but that might not happen for a while.

[BuGGaTon]

If you have a magma forge and you want to train your smiths then just churn out a bunch of tin/copper/bronze nonsense.  Then either trade it away, atom smash it or eat it(!)

[Hans Lemurson]

dont forget that you can request a plethora of items which have a chance to be made of steel and meltable.

I think that most crafts have a poor melting return, and only a few (toys?) can you actually specify that you want steel.  Furthermore, their price can be quite high if they are of anything other than basic quality and if they have decorations on them.

Me have large amounts of experience working within the limitations of a steel shortage?!!  What would make you think that? Were you seeing things you wanted to see?

I didnt say "craft" did I? Many items types have good tendency of showing up made of steel while being relatively cheap themselves. Specifically armors (plate/mail/greaves/legging/shield are best) > Picks > Weapons > Bolts > Trap components.

Sorry, my post was confusing. The last line I wrote (which you commented on) was intended as sarcasm.  I know that both armor and weapons are available for request, but I don't think that you can specify which metal the are, and the price for steel armor is often significantly higher than that of an Anvil, and you get a lower yield anyways.  However, since the creation of wealth is rarely an issue, the price of steel goods is rather meaningless.  Steel is essentially priceless in a fluxless embark, since you can't make it except by trading for materials whose supply is greatly limited.

[Lagslayer]

In the absence of steel, I generally rely on blunt weapons, or occasionally crossbows if I am feeling adventurous. Iron or bronze armor will protect against the majority or edge attacks of the same material or less (which is the best goblins will be bringing anyways), and blunt weapons will penetrate it anyways. The little bit of steel I do manage to aquire is reserved for edge weapons.