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Author Topic: War in the Pacific: AE PBEM - July 1st 1942  (Read 93643 times)

Journier

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Japan having created some of the carrier doctrine, and from what I read understanding that it would be the future of naval combat built battleships up until 1942 then converted another battleship finally to a carrier (which was promptly sunk 1 day after launching for its maiden voyage by a sub iirc?)

Somewhat idiotic, but the idea is the old naval officers that had more pull with politicians, fought against a carrier based fleet, and instead fought to have the production of more battleships. The Old Guard always fucks the military. Fighting the last war.  >:(

Japan could have had quite a nice carrier fleet if the yamato and such were designed as CARRIERS from the start, a true 70,000 ton carrier woulda been amazing in 1942. Or multiple 30,000+ ton ones, either or. 4 extra fleet carrier ships by 1943 or 1944? 2 extra by mid 1942.... Quite a bit more airpower they coulda had at various battles where they neglected to scout :/

And as usual i end my post with a question for Erkki the god of war in the pacific.

Erkkii, do you invade empty islands around java with full squads of infantry, (this seems highly annoying to me since they lose like 25%+ of their strength drowning while unloading on an empty undefended island each time). I havent trained any of my infantry to do this since it takes 1 turn to land and 1 turn to deliberate attack.

Someone reccomended that i load a tf with a small infantry squad, then send each ship to capture an island like that more easily and simply.... still really annoying since theres no divide group button for fleets (ie divide into groups of 2 ships or something.)
« Last Edit: April 05, 2011, 10:40:50 pm by Journier »
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Erkki

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Caution, it may be a trap for you.

Wasnt a trap, April 18th;

...and G4Ms went in again, 1 x 250kg bomb penetrated Enterprise's deck again. She was left burning, raid is done again tomorrow in hopes of finishing her off.

25 B-17s, 8 B-25s and 16 B-26s raid Darwin. They destroy 10 planes on the ground, hit the airfield facilities pretty well, and shoot down 1 Zero. Zeroes manage to shoot down 6 B-26s though it wasnt all one sided. The heavy AAA guided by 5 radars doesnt even scratch the reasonably low flying heavy bombers.

In 13 days the first Ki-45 rolls out of the factory. I will probably send first available units to New Britain, as I hate those bombers that the elite Zero pilots cant touch. 1 x 20mm cannon and 2 heavy machine guns is not exactly what I would call heavy armament, but at least they are mounted in the nose and the plane is fast and armoured.

I dont understand why the Allies dont fly in Burma, they might lose planes 1:1 and currently I can outproduce Ki-43s and Zeroes, but every lost plane is a lost elite pilot for Japan, and those I would not allow to survive to fly better fighters later. And each time escorting a bomber strike failed, they would get 20-30 Jap bombers, with equal elite pilots, killed for virtually no losses of their own. He thinks that losing 2 puny Blenheims out of 60, against 50 Ki-43s, is "unsustainable loss rate" or something.

I heard that the Zero also had tons of propaganda behind it as being the best fighter ever that no allied fighter could match. And the leadership started to believe their own lies and why replace the best thing ever?

I doubt they were that idiotic to be like that, although, er, it's an interesting possibility. Can't confirm it myself though.

In any case, just curious, does the game reflect the change in the Allies' tactics when it comes to aerial fighting? Initially, the Allies adopted the similar tactic of dogfighting as the Japanese, but they then switched to the dive-bombing... er, fighting(?), tactic later on, using their superior speed. I mean, that created a rather large drastic change in air superiority from what I know.

Speed is already the most important single quality. The USN doctrine change was not due to just finding out a better tactic(Zero outturns, outruns, out-accelerates and outclimbs the Wildcat), but due to converting to the much heavier F6F. USN simply guided its pilots somewhat along the lines: "Do not try to outturn a Zero for more than 90 degrees. Do not try to outclimb a Zero. Do not scissor a Zero other than to gain separation to outrun or outdive it. Do not follow Zero if it evades by Split-S-ing)". Your plane's performance in relative to the enemy's tells you the doctrine and tactics, not the other way around. Speed is the factor that all fighter manufacturers tried to improve the most during the war, as speed is life, and can be exchanged to altitude, which is options.  ;)

The Focke-Wulf Fw 190 had the same advantages over Spitfire as F6F has over Zero: speed, high speed elevator authority, rate of roll especially at high speeds, dive. Despite Luftwaffe pilots fighting against incredible numerical superiority, Fw 190 scored more than 10:1 against Spitfire V, and 1,5 to 2:1 against later marks, around 3:1 against first mark IXs. By American records F6F did somewhere around 15:1 against the Japanese(though usually F6Fs were in tactical advantage, had more numbers and better trained pilots), probably actually closer to 5-6:1 if kamikazes and non-fighter kills are counted out. Part of the more equal results is probably because they were operated from carriers, damaged planes usually suffered more at landing, were ditched in the sea, pilot bailed out over fleet and rescued, or the never reached home because of long flying distances.

Erkkii, do you invade empty islands around java with full squads of infantry, (this seems highly annoying to me since they lose like 25%+ of their strength drowning while unloading on an empty undefended island each time). I havent trained any of my infantry to do this since it takes 1 turn to land and 1 turn to deliberate attack.

Someone reccomended that i load a tf with a small infantry squad, then send each ship to capture an island like that more easily and simply.... still really annoying since theres no divide group button for fleets (ie divide into groups of 2 ships or something.)

Yeah I read that. I'll just secure the islands with airfields and/or ports now, all the small ones will be left for paratroopers or I dont bother at all with them. If the Allies want to occupy and build up one, let them do! Its just a prisoner camp as they cant build any of them into a big air field overnight, and carriers can freely slaughter supply efforts, if not even the initial effort. I actually hope him to try that with one of the small islands left between New Guinea and Timor.  :)
« Last Edit: April 06, 2011, 01:51:22 am by Erkki »
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Erkki

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April 19th

China: Sinyang is Japanese controlled again! This clears the railway to the semi-closed Japanese pocket in the middle, and frees up a lot of Army strength to be used elsewhere within 2 weeks...

B-17s visit Rabaul, again. This time only 7 planes are lost on the ground, in the air, 1 Zero is lost for a B-25 and a B-17E, with lots more damaged. I hate the über-4Es.
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Journier

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Hey Erkki...

do you expand the light industry in chinese cities near the shore etc? to increase supply production for china?

It seems like its a good idea to add a few 100 extra light industry to chinese theater so you dont have to ship supplies over much later on. Ive been doing it but i dont know if its really making a dent in the supplies required after 2 years in my game.....

Nice job on retaking Sinyang!
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Erkki

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Hey Erkki...

do you expand the light industry in chinese cities near the shore etc? to increase supply production for china?

It seems like its a good idea to add a few 100 extra light industry to chinese theater so you dont have to ship supplies over much later on. Ive been doing it but i dont know if its really making a dent in the supplies required after 2 years in my game.....

Nice job on retaking Sinyang!

Dont think I will. 15 resources for 1 supply is bad trade when heavy does it 1-1. Expansion and repairs mean you need to hold over 1000 turns to get any gain. I repair them, never expand... cheaper to bring supplies from Japan.

April 20th

Blenheims strike Koepang invsion force, all 6 shot down by Zeroes.
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Sheb

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Can we have a map of the Chinese theater?
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Journier

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its too bad the game cant have nice blown up maps you can use to set up strategies for.

If any game needed one, this one does.
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Erkki

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Can we have a map of the Chinese theater?

The situation in China is such that I wouldnt want to give a map yet... Theres some confusion on whos flanking whom and where. Chinese push in the south but I dont think they have the supply, we are about to cut China half in the NW sector, separating them from their oil fields and resource areas. About even in the middle.

its too bad the game cant have nice blown up maps you can use to set up strategies for.

If any game needed one, this one does.

There are some, even ones you can replace the in-game map with(with nice base sizes etc so you dont need to mouse over), but yeah...

Havent updated for 4 days. April 24th now.

China: as above.

DEI: Koepang and some smaller islands invaded. 36,000 troops at Koepang should be enough to take whole of Timor. Allied air forces did try to interrupt but Zeroes shot them all down, about 20 bombers.  :)

Other fronts have been pretty silent.. Except I sent Carrier Division II to the Indian Ocean. They caught 2 transports that were probably unloading supplies at Diego Garcia, and are now returning to Singapore.

edit: in the meanwhile, on the East front... Or oops, wrong year. And game. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0Js90JQpU8
« Last Edit: April 08, 2011, 08:08:36 am by Erkki »
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Journier

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when you mentioned east front i figured you were about to post an image from a war in the east game  :P
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Erkki

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when you mentioned east front i figured you were about to post an image from a war in the east game  :P

A bit surprisingly the first time I am yet to get a "music sucks" comment.  :P
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Zrk2

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I fixed that.

How do you predict China will unfold? Sounds like you should be able to clean up the north and leave them without the resources to continue fighting.
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He's just keeping up with the Cardassians.

Erkki

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I fixed that.

How do you predict China will unfold? Sounds like you should be able to clean up the north and leave them without the resources to continue fighting.

I predict a 2-year trench war, but we will try to advance as far as possible before that...

April 25th, 26th.

China:

Major Chinese pocket in the middle cut in half and thrown back. Chinese casualties exceed 25k, ours much lighter at approx 7k. Air force flies daily, mauling Chinese forces in clear terrain for maximum effect. In the North, we have penetrated through the Chinese lines, and are threatening their supply lines essential for not just army but industry and economy. In the South, we are making a flanking attack to the coast...

Effects of all 3 attacks will be seen in a few weeks. These have so far progressed much better than direct trusts, possibly because the Chinese lack aerial reconnaissance.


Burma:

The air war has began again. During 2 days, over 100 Blenheim sorties are flown against Japanese airfields for nearly 0 effect, and IJAAF has actively sought combat with the RAF - the USAAF units seem to have disappeared. G4M strike today catches 6 transport ships at Rangoon: every one of them receives a torpedo, some 2. Plane losses for 2 days are 20 Ki-43s(15 directly in combat), 4 A6M2s (3) and 1 G4M. Allied losses have been approximately 35 Hurricanes, 10 Blenheims and 2 Wellingtons. I'm not sure why the Hurricanes seem to do much worse than before... Perhaps all the good pilots have been killed some time ago, and we now meet just fresh replacement greentags?

The British-Indian armies tried to attack going around Moulmein in the jungle for a month now. Today, a Japanese attack at the flank of their trust pushed 2 battalions back over River Kwai, cutting off about 2 regiments of Brits that are already engaged with more Japanese units.

As the Brits dont want to come over the river, they'll have to go around... and their supply lines through from Rangoon are now 120 miles of paved road, about 1000 of dirt road and about 200 more of thick jungle. I dont think the troops at the front get even water...

In the meanwhile, Moulmein is being fortified.

DEI: 30,000 troops at Koepang. Ground campaign at Java still goes on. No progress, but the enemy numbers are dropping while we are maintaining our strength. Almost all the tiny islands from Java to Timor have been invaded, too.

South Pacific: Nothing new here. Exactly 9 B-17s visit Rabaul every night, always hitting the runway with 2 bombs. Filling them is good morning exercise to the troops...
« Last Edit: April 08, 2011, 05:37:52 pm by Erkki »
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inteuniso

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Just commenting that you have made some AMAZING gains in just 3 months. Keep on keeping on!
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Lol scratch that I'm building a marijuana factory.

Journier

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id just like to say, I dont know why i ever bother to ground attack with my airforce.

My lightly trained in ground attack carrier fleet, 250 fighters/ 200 dive bombers, and 200 torpedo bombers, just decided to do a ground attack all together.....

and i figured you know 700+ fighters/dive bombers and torpedo bombers would kill alot of people when they attack an island...

Allies invaded Truk  with 5000+ troops and i assembled my whole carrier force to go train up by completely destroying them via air...........

I killed 5 enemy soldiers in 1 day sigh.

700/800 aircraft in fleet all set to ground attack 11000 feet, 5 kills.. and i lost 1 dive bomber, and got 14 dmged! fuuuuuu

and this goes with saying, Helen's 80+ attacking an airfield at around 11000 feet also suck even with 70 skill usually 1/4 are dmged without doing much dmg at all.
(and why the hell the game even puts turreted guns on the helen or any japanese bomber, i have no idea, ive never seen one even damage an allied fighter ever ever ever, while the gods of the air AKA b-17's and up smoke all my shit. lol.

But then i compare this to naval bombing, and my other helens are like little ship snipers killing transports all over, and my navy bombers are even better. Ground attacking with airforce is so dissapointing, unless im doing something wrong with the altitude. ive tried low and high, low seems to just get you ridiculously dmged, for little gain in killing accuracy, high... lowers casualties somewhat but they still occur. (helens flying at max height still getting dmged somehow in china, arghhghgh)
« Last Edit: April 09, 2011, 01:59:10 am by Journier »
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Erkki

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id just like to say, I dont know why i ever bother to ground attack with my airforce.

My lightly trained in ground attack carrier fleet, 250 fighters/ 200 dive bombers, and 200 torpedo bombers, just decided to do a ground attack all together.....

and i figured you know 700+ fighters/dive bombers and torpedo bombers would kill alot of people when they attack an island...

Allies invaded Truk  with 5000+ troops and i assembled my whole carrier force to go train up by completely destroying them via air...........

I killed 5 enemy soldiers in 1 day sigh.

700/800 aircraft in fleet all set to ground attack 11000 feet, 5 kills.. and i lost 1 dive bomber, and got 14 dmged! fuuuuuu

and this goes with saying, Helen's 80+ attacking an airfield at around 11000 feet also suck even with 70 skill usually 1/4 are dmged without doing much dmg at all.
(and why the hell the game even puts turreted guns on the helen or any japanese bomber, i have no idea, ive never seen one even damage an allied fighter ever ever ever, while the gods of the air AKA b-17's and up smoke all my shit. lol.

But then i compare this to naval bombing, and my other helens are like little ship snipers killing transports all over, and my navy bombers are even better. Ground attacking with airforce is so dissapointing, unless im doing something wrong with the altitude. ive tried low and high, low seems to just get you ridiculously dmged, for little gain in killing accuracy, high... lowers casualties somewhat but they still occur. (helens flying at max height still getting dmged somehow in china, arghhghgh)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tarawa

A month of aerial bombardments and 24 hours of fire from multiple battleships and a dozen cruisers --> defenders untouched, every single radio and electric lamp broken.

EDIT: yeah, those atolls, either coral or especially volcanic(like Peleliu) were tough in real life as well. Especially if enforced with steel and concrete... The Americans might have brought an engineer regiment or 2 with them, just a week might be enough to raise forts to 3.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2011, 02:57:41 am by Erkki »
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