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[em312s0n]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOD-LHLUQIo

The game's name is Dwarvesh as if the gameplay isnt enough to suggest its inspired by Dwarf Fortress

do you guys think that df is gonna have some competition?

EDIT:wooops posted in the wrong place... sorry bout that i meant to click "discussion"

[Nadaka]

Its cloned right down to plump helmets and rope reed. That is a little much.

[malimbar04]

Every little quibble that someone has about DF gives dabbling programmers a new idea. I have little doubt that there are dozens of DF clones in various stages of development right now, and a few hundred (or thousand) people that would love to clone it if they knew how. Up that estimate another hundred or thousand times if you include people who haven't heard of DF, but have an almost similar pipe-dream brewing in their heads.

[Nadaka]

I myself have wanted to make a dwarflike. But at some point you have to draw a line and create something new. Borrowing game play is fine, copying the names of everything verbatim is not.

[Knight of Fools]

The extent that he's copied Dwarf Fortress, though...  I think it looks just like DF with graphics and an interface, which is nice, but copying something so blatantly is a little...  Boring and underhanded.  He says he's going to do different stuff, but maybe he should start by actually doing something different.  DF has a lot of cool ideas, but if I were to make a simulation game, I'd go in a different direction - For a variety of reasons, one of them being it's been done before.

I feel like he's taken off to a rocky start by simply copying everything he sees in Dwarf Fortress, with nothing but promises of doing something different.  If he pulls it off, I'm okay with that.  I just feel like not acknowledging DF until someone brings it up in the comments is wrong - It gives the impression he's trying to outshine it and take all the credit.

[rarborman]

Imitation is flatery, but this is just wrong.

As for outshinning df that is imposible, and he should change his game direction promptly.

[Fayrik]

This has to be the laziest thing I've ever seen.
Not only does it mimic Dwarf Fortress in every way,
it's even using Stonesense as a code base.

I'm surprised he managed to rename it, and not come up with a name like "Dwarf Sense".

As for outshinning df that is imposible, and he should change his game direction promptly.

Well, I also see it as impossible to outshine DF. I mean, that program is using a 2d grid. I can't see there being any "Dwarvesh" mega projects.

do you guys think that df is gonna have some competition?

This isn't really competition.
It's a case of IP theft...
And copyright infringement, if it's not released under the Perl/GPL.

Using other people's ideas and code to make your own thing isn't really fantastic, but running off to some secret corner of the internet to claim it's original... That's bad.
Urgh.

[rarborman]

Time to go to war then, inform the toad, prepare the magma and activate the military, then unleash the clowns on them.

[Nadaka]

Fayrik you might be going a little hard on this guy.

1: copyright infringement at this point has most likely not occurred. Distribution is the key in most cases unless stone sense has a "look but don't use/modify" license. The only such license I am aware of is by microsoft.

2: some of the videos actually show 3d multilevel views.

3: This could go somewhere moderately interesting if they guy puts the effort to branch away from a direct clone of DF.

[Fayrik]

Fayrik you might be going a little hard on this guy.

You think?

1: copyright infringement at this point has most likely not occurred. Distribution is the key in most cases unless stone sense has a "look but don't use/modify" license. The only such license I am aware of is by microsoft.

Indeed, Distribution is the key. And I'll admit what I've seen of this has been limited...
But at some stage, he does need to achnoledge the fact he's using Stonesense's code.
I'm yet to see that happen, and am sceptical it will.

2: some of the videos actually show 3d multilevel views.

Okay, so it's not 2d. But it's still lacking a lot of what makes Dwarf Fortress, Dwarf Fortress.
It, for instance, doesn't generate worlds with delicate international diplomacies.

3: This could go somewhere moderately interesting if they guy puts the effort to branch away from a direct clone of DF.

He hasn't attempted to do so thus far.
If the initial intention of making something original isn't there, then what's the point of giving him the chance to slowly remove the direct similarities grudgingly?

[Repulsion]

  Oh wow. If your going to make a clone of DF, at least don't directly copy EVERYTHING. I mean, this game has the exact same 'choose-your-items-for-embark' system, the exact same plants, and some similar other stuff. This almost seems like this guy just wanted to make a graphical DF, without having any new ideas or anything. I mean, if your going to make a DF-type game, at least add some new stuff in before copying stuff from the original game.

[Neonivek]

Its cloned right down to plump helmets and rope reed. That is a little much.

At least he isn't pretending he isn't outright copying Dwarf Fortress like some people.

Though perhaps it will create a new genre onto itself

He did seem to swipe images from other Dwarf Fortress projects. (apperantly with partial permission: He can only use them for demos)

[GTM]

Projects like this are a boon for the genre and the community.  People will find out about these games, play them, and those among them who still yearn for something deeper may be inexorably drawn to DF. 

The only annoying thing is when you hear clueless chumps spouting the whole "maybe this will convince Toady to add/change/update X" - but words are just words so there's no use getting too riled up.

[Soadreqm]

  Oh wow. If your going to make a clone of DF, at least don't directly copy EVERYTHING. I mean, this game has the exact same 'choose-your-items-for-embark' system, the exact same plants, and some similar other stuff. This almost seems like this guy just wanted to make a graphical DF, without having any new ideas or anything. I mean, if your going to make a DF-type game, at least add some new stuff in before copying stuff from the original game.

I think this is the sad part. I mean, making a clone of Dwarf Fortress? Great! The concept of a dwarven fortress simulator (or a fantasy world simulator for the ambitious) is vague enough to accommodate more than one game. But copying everything, down to the plump helmets? That's kind of lame, and veering closer to the "copyright violation" territory. I'm pretty sure that being able to pack your embark wagon with nothing but horse brains should mostly be considered a bug, and the Caravan Arc might actually do something about that. And either way, the long list of animal products you get is absolutely terrible, interface-wise. Why would anyone in their right mind copy that? I guess it could be a coy inside reference or something?

Well, I think it's not actually going to matter, since I believe this guy will give up once he realizes that it took Dr. Adams like six years of working on this thing as his day job to get where the game is now. Heh, did you notice in the video how all the dwarves move one by one? When more spaces to mine became exposed, everyone stopped mining to wait for another dwarf to run to from the entrance to the mine. It was so cute!

[Rose]

1: copyright infringement at this point has most likely not occurred. Distribution is the key in most cases unless stone sense has a "look but don't use/modify" license. The only such license I am aware of is by microsoft.

Indeed, Distribution is the key. And I'll admit what I've seen of this has been limited...
But at some stage, he does need to achnoledge the fact he's using Stonesense's code.
I'm yet to see that happen, and am sceptical it will.

I actually find it rather unlikely that he's using stonesense code at all. he's using the tileset, yes, but only a very small portion of the stonesense code is actually suitable for use in an actual game, as opposed to a visualiser. If you look at the comments, you'll see that he has admitted that he's used the stonesense tiles, along with others, as placeholders, which is pretty standard practice. If he is who I think he is, he's asked permission as well.