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[GavJ]

I'm not sure what about the background story makes it "less messed up than it looks." It sounds exactly like what I would imagine... adults venting strong hatred of their enemy and children dutifully mimicking their parents and learning the same opinions in the process.

The reporter insists that nobody who was there spoke with hatred about the Lebanese.

Lol, no, they just WROTE with hatred. Totally different, man! *eyeroll*
And being encouraged by photographers makes it worse IMO, not better... It demonstrates either pride or indifference, versus shame at said hatred.


(Apologies for misidentifying Hamas versus Hezbollah as the target in my earlier post, though. Whatever.)

[GlyphGryph]

"On some basic level, you forfeit your right to be called civilians when you freely elect members of a terrorist organization as statesmen"

Osama Bin Laden, Hamas, or the Wall Street Journal? Which of these would issue the above statement as an argument for intentionally targeting civilians?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Mr. Rosenbaum, a novelist, essayist and professor at the New York University School of Law, is the author, most recently, of "Payback: The Case for Revenge." (Warning: Paywalled)

[burningpet]

Yeah. that's completely disgusting and idiotic.

Lol, no, they just WROTE with hatred. Totally different, man!

No, they wrote, specifically, with love.

Still a thousand time better than sending the kids to blow up themselves or actually training them to kill jews.
https://commentisfreewatch.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/new.jpg

I think that since they only addressed hizbulla leader hassan nasralla, who they have seen on t.v spouting his evilness and desires to kill them, as a way for these kids to coup with thousands of missiles targeted specifically at their heads, that indeed gives a much better context to this whole situation and certainly does not justify idiotic, false claims such as "desire for genocide amonsgt people in control at least"

but still, those israeli kids teachers should have been fired. since we are better.

And i can bring pictures from past years as well, i don't see what does it give though. except serving as a vehicle for terrorists propaganda.

[burningpet]

Muslims are so peaceful at paris. no violent intent what so ever.
http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/2014/07/20/01016-20140720ARTFIG00158-barbes-sarcelles-la-contagion-de-la-violence.php?pagination=4

Really, europe should definitely wake up. give better education, try to deflect immigrants from forming isolated communities and populate them among the native populations, speak with their religious leaders, something to let them know they are french, not soldiers in the ongoing global jihad.

[burningpet]

Another incident involving terrorists using UNRWA ambulance.
http://rotter.net/forum/scoops1/121410.shtml

While they use ambulances and hospitals to defend rocktes and terrorists
IDF build hospitals for the gazan people
http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-4547966,00.html

[Zangi]

Really, europe should definitely wake up. give better education, try to deflect immigrants from forming isolated communities and populate them among the native populations, speak with their religious leaders, something to let them know they are french, not soldiers in the ongoing global jihad.

I don't believe democracies have the powers to force people to integrate.  Well, most modern democracies anyways.  Maybe incentives, but there probably isn't the political will to spend lots of money on convincing such communities to disperse.

It happens all over the place, like the chinatowns in the US, there are even huge even Jewish communities.  Its probably the same in Europe.  How do you implement such a huge policy without looking like you are targeting just the Muslims?
People will see it for what it is.  Further ostracizing the Muslim community.  Not the end result you want.  But, I suppose doing something like this is easier for Israel.  Who puts more care for their fellow Jews.  When you look at past actions taken to keep a certain demographic in the majority...

[burningpet]

How doing something like this puts more care on their fellow jews?

And what steps did israel take to keep its demographic majority in regarding to its arab population? and if so, why is it that 84% of the arabs would prefer to remain under israeli government, even if shifting to palestine or other government would mean they keep the same house, same job and same local authority (city council). israel is not a threat to arabs. israel is something arabs can effortlessly get what other arab countries can't give even with extreme efforts.

[LordSlowpoke]

yeah, if israel cared only about fellow jews these silly ethiopian immigrants - who were and still are jews, in fact - wouldn't come to get their yearly sterilization shots, all voluntary of course

i still haven't heard how it's possible to fuck up like that

[smjjames]

Well, yeah, immigrants did form their areas like Chinatown (which came about because of racism) or Little Italy, but for the most part, immigrants are able to integrate just fine into the US.

Although the article specifies Delta Airlines, I think CNN said on TV said that all US airline flights to Israel have been suspended. Not clear if it's all US airlines though and I'm surprised flights didn't get suspended at an earlier point because those rockets were going all over the place, including Tel Aviv.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/22/travel/israel-flights-suspended/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

[GlyphGryph]

For those few pro-Israel posters (Burningpet and Socks, but this is mostly for Socks), what do you think of people like Naftali Bennett?

Israel has (apparently) rejected another cease-fire:
http://live.aljazeera.com/Event/Gaza_Blog/122263040

More journalists being punished for going against the pro-Israel narrative:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/21/rula-jebreal-msnbc-palestinians-airtime_n_5606673.html?cps=gravity

[Phmcw]

I don't believe democracies have the powers to force people to integrate.  Well, most modern democracies anyways.  Maybe incentives, but there probably isn't the political will to spend lots of money on convincing such communities to disperse.

It happens all over the place, like the chinatowns in the US, there are even huge even Jewish communities.  Its probably the same in Europe.  How do you implement such a huge policy without looking like you are targeting just the Muslims?
People will see it for what it is.  Further ostracizing the Muslim community.  Not the end result you want.  But, I suppose doing something like this is easier for Israel.  Who puts more care for their fellow Jews.  When you look at past actions taken to keep a certain demographic in the majority...

They integrate just fine usually : you don't have a big coherent group of uniform values and culture neither for immigrants nor for the natives. Europe ,and most of the world, is a big mess of peoples with different culture and religions inhabiting countries with more or less arbitrary borders ( and it's twice as true for Belgium).

The problem in this specific case is gross incompetence, malignant profiteering of immigration problems, and blindness motivated by hypocrisy.

The problems of French and in a less extend Belgian immigration are simple. We don't have enough jobs, Americain led world-wide market make our social model unsustainable, and most immigrants have no choice but to live in the cheaper part of town. Now, the left wing part of the government tend to e soft on crime in this area in a misguided attemp to gain votes, and the right wing promised to fight crime (for instance when Sarkozy promised to "wash the crime out of the cité with a power washer") but never actually do anything worthwhile, in part because high crime tend to make peoples voted for them.

So the poorer area tend to concentrate immigration, and thus have high crime. Now, renters and employee in our systems tend to be well protected, you can't fire them or expell them, and thus it's important that you choose in both case someone reliable. Now who won't you take? Yeah someone for the gettho : it's high crime, low education, and you don't want to get twice as much chances to have problems because you cannot fire employee or expel tenant without a ton of trouble (and they don't get any).

So the problem is not to know if you're a migrant. I saw plenty of migrant in college, it's if you have the stigma (way to talk, dress, ...) of the gettho. Hell, first generation migrant don't have any problem most of the time, but no matter if you're migrant or not, if you're from the gettho, your life get 50% harder.

[GlyphGryph]

http://www.timesofisrael.com/dermer-idf-deserves-nobel-peace-prize-for-unimaginable-restraint/

"Some are shamelessly accusing Israel of genocide and would put us in the dock for war crimes. But the truth is that the Israeli Defence Forces should be given the Nobel Peace Prize… a Nobel Peace Prize for fighting with unimaginable restraint."

[burningpet]

LordSlowpoke.

i still haven't heard how it's possible to fuck up like that

Well, you could do much worse. you could take them by force, slave them and kill their babies or the women if they get pregnant.

But, this was indeed outrageous, racist and a lot of heads should be thrown to jail for that.
The same as the order of not receiving blood donations from ethiopians or people who've come/been in africa (they wont accept my blood if i go visit africa for a year. btw, this was done without the ministry of health approval or knowledge).

You should also note that the ethiopians were vastly different to the israeli society. most of them came from remote villages where they never seen electricity or other modern devices and israel had decided they must give them better education, which is simply impossible if they had forced to tend large families (ethiopians get free higher education, opposed to any other immigrators). so its not out of racism against blacks, its because of prejudice against lack of education. it doesn't excuse the action though.

Nobody said israel is perfect, FAR from it, but twisting its imperfections as signs of pure evilness or as means to justify jihadist terrorists, is simply demonizing.

For those few pro-Israel posters (Burningpet and Socks, but this is mostly for Socks), what do you think of people like Naftali Bennett?

Not my cup of tea. not in the economic aspect and not in the security/racism aspect. the thing is that people like him only gain political strength when hamas, a terror organization, gain strength and when obvious peace offers are being stomped by terrorists. he is a man that simply refuse to believe the failed past peace offers could be made again and work this time. to his defense, history and current reality in the middle east actually shows he is quite right in his political opinions. i still refuse believing that palestines can't have their own state and prosper peacefully in it, but i also refuse to believe such a state can exist with hamas at its head, or at least part of its head.

However, i still prefer him to ANY of the current arab leaders in any arab country and i prefer people like him over people like you that support terror organizations that makes their own people a miserable hell.

Because while he has no problem mistreating palestines in exchange for the safety and prosperity of his own people, hamas has no problem mistreating palestines for their own personal political strength and prosper.

[burningpet]

*Ill retract this statement, because while its obviously true, i have no definitive source for it.

[Wolfhunter107]

I'm just going to note here that the only reason that the Palestinians are living in hell is because the pointless blockade. The Palestinian Government offered a cease fire during the negotiations-which was rejected by Israel.