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Author Topic: Egypt and the world and Libya - Now without Ukraine!  (Read 372388 times)

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4665 on: November 06, 2013, 03:25:08 pm »

It's not impossible. I imagine Russia would prefer Hamas to Fatah.
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Sergarr

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4666 on: November 06, 2013, 06:19:13 pm »

That's Russia though. Putin's underlings regularly assassinate their enemies in broad daylight (including with gunfire) and nobody gives a shit. It's one of the few places in the world that massive conspiracy theories seem quite likely sometimes.
I'd like to see the sources for this statement.
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Owlbread

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4668 on: November 06, 2013, 07:38:09 pm »

I think he has exactly that. Several of them.
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Bouchart

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4669 on: November 06, 2013, 08:46:35 pm »

I don't see Russia having much interest in the Isreal-Palestinian conflict.  If anything they are pro-Palestinian given that Russia is an arms dealer and that they have a general anti-Semitic history.

Back when Arafat died, there were all sorts of rumors circulating that he died of AIDS.  If I remember correctly, Arafat was taken to France for medical care in his last days and that in France there's no requirement for a doctor to list a cause of death on a death certificate.
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Guardian G.I.

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4670 on: November 07, 2013, 09:37:31 am »

I'd like to see the sources for this statement.

Gladly. I apologise, these are nearly all Wikipedia articles because their Russian sources are broken. Atayev's wikipedia article has been removed.

Movladi Baisarov, shot dead in the street
Ruslan Yamadayev, shot ten times in a car near the Moscow White House.
Sulim Yamadayev, blown up with a bomb in Dubai with his brother.
Musa Atayev, shot dead walking out of his house in Istanbul.
Anna Politkovskaya, famous journalist, shot dead in her apartment in Moscow
Umar Israilov, shot dead in Vienna in front of a crowd of people in 2009.
Maksharip Aushev, ambushed in his car and shot.
Magomed Yevloyev, shot in the temple while in police custody.
Natalia Estemirova, journalist, abducted and found with bullet wounds in her head and chest in the woods

If you want a more exhaustive, less "Caucasian" list take a look here:

List of journalists killed in Russia
The majority of these people were not enemies of Putin. They were enemies of Ramzan Kadyrov, the leader of Chechnya, which reportedly has links with Chechen organized crime and generally operates independently from the Russian federal government. Putin is fine with him because he's (relatively) loyal.
Russian opposition and Westerners sympathetic to them tend to blame Putin for their assassinations, despite the fact that Putin cannot effectively control the Chechen government and all the people working for the Chechen government.
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this means that a donation of 30 dollars to a developer that did not deliver would equal 4.769*10^-14 hitlers stolen from you
that's like half a femtohitler
and that is terrible
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4671 on: November 07, 2013, 09:41:46 am »

Considering Putin used to work for the KGB, one of who's main activities has been assassination, I don't think it's that far out there to believe Putin has people assassinated.
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burningpet

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4672 on: November 07, 2013, 10:15:28 am »

I don't see Russia having much interest in the Isreal-Palestinian conflict.  If anything they are pro-Palestinian given that Russia is an arms dealer and that they have a general anti-Semitic history.

Back when Arafat died, there were all sorts of rumors circulating that he died of AIDS.  If I remember correctly, Arafat was taken to France for medical care in his last days and that in France there's no requirement for a doctor to list a cause of death on a death certificate.

Did anyone really believe that poisoning bs? its just an al-jazeera rating bait. take that claim to any half decent chemist and ask him what he thinks of it.
Plus, israel didn't need to kill arafat.
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GlyphGryph

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4673 on: November 07, 2013, 11:01:40 am »

The majority of these people were not enemies of Putin. They were enemies of Ramzan Kadyrov, the leader of Chechnya, which reportedly has links with Chechen organized crime and generally operates independently from the Russian federal government. Putin is fine with him because he's (relatively) loyal.
Russian opposition and Westerners sympathetic to them tend to blame Putin for their assassinations, despite the fact that Putin cannot effectively control the Chechen government and all the people working for the Chechen government.

That was exactly the claim that was made, though:
Putin's underlings regularly assassinate their enemies in broad daylight (including with gunfire) and nobody gives a shit.

Unless you're arguing that Kadyrov shouldn't be considered an underling, I guess?
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Another

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4674 on: November 07, 2013, 11:02:52 am »

Considering Putin used to work for the KGB, one of who's main activities has been assassination, I don't think it's that far out there to believe Putin has people assassinated.
Now this is exactly like what it it would be to say that CIA's main activity has been assassination.

Please apply paranoia and conspiracy theories consistently to all cases.

That is not to say that Putin had not ever ordered some known terrorists drone striked    black helicopter navy sealed    extraordinary renditioned for life without a trial killed on foreign soil.
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10ebbor10

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4675 on: November 07, 2013, 11:06:35 am »

It's an independent Swiss study, reported in several major newspapers. Do note however, that at this point the only thing they're saying is that they found unusually high traces of Polonium in his bones*. They can't confirm that was what killed him, but it's unlikely that it got there by accident. It's not that impossible however, as 18 times higher than normal still isn't a high dose, and not really noticeable nor harmful. (Note that Polonium has a half life of 138 days, indicating at a far higher dose at the moment it entered his body)

Also, radioactive materials falls under particle physics. No Chemical reactions of any kind going on there.

*18 times higher than normal.


Considering Putin used to work for the KGB, one of who's main activities has been assassination, I don't think it's that far out there to believe Putin has people assassinated.
Actually, IIRC, the favorite way for the KGB to deal with insurgents was to have them treated for psychological problems they might or might not have.
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4676 on: November 07, 2013, 12:36:42 pm »

Considering Putin used to work for the KGB, one of who's main activities has been assassination, I don't think it's that far out there to believe Putin has people assassinated.
Now this is exactly like what it it would be to say that CIA's main activity has been assassination.
Considering that it is one of the CIA's main activities, I'm not really seeing the problem here. The only meaningful difference is that the KGB was more than willing to kill Russians, while the CIA generally does not murder Americans.

And it isn't a conspiracy theory. They've more or less admitted to it. It also isn't even counting the times they hired third-parties to do the actual killing.
Considering Putin used to work for the KGB, one of who's main activities has been assassination, I don't think it's that far out there to believe Putin has people assassinated.
Actually, IIRC, the favorite way for the KGB to deal with insurgents was to have them treated for psychological problems they might or might not have.
I only know of that happening while Stalin was alive. Not to say that it didn't happen otherwise, but I'm not familiar with it.
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Owlbread

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4677 on: November 07, 2013, 02:41:33 pm »

The majority of these people were not enemies of Putin. They were enemies of Ramzan Kadyrov, the leader of Chechnya, which reportedly has links with Chechen organized crime and generally operates independently from the Russian federal government. Putin is fine with him because he's (relatively) loyal.
Russian opposition and Westerners sympathetic to them tend to blame Putin for their assassinations, despite the fact that Putin cannot effectively control the Chechen government and all the people working for the Chechen government.

That was exactly the claim that was made, though:
Putin's underlings regularly assassinate their enemies in broad daylight (including with gunfire) and nobody gives a shit.

Unless you're arguing that Kadyrov shouldn't be considered an underling, I guess?

He is very much an underling of Putin because everything he owns, all his wealth and his grip on Chechnya is down to honest Russian taxpayer's money pouring into his greedy, corrupt, Fascist pockets. It works both ways though in that Putin does need someone like Kadyrov controlling the province, but in my opinion Kadyrov needs Putin more than Putin needs him. Kadyrov is outwardly loyal to Putin to a fault, even removing his title of "President" and replacing it with "Leader", explaining that Russia only needed one President.

I've argued before that as soon as Putin leaves power, as will happen eventually (all it takes is one big corruption scandal that he can't slither out of), then the Chechen money will dry up and Kadyrov's grip will slip once again, especially if he begins abusing his people even more and becomes more greedy. The only thing protecting Chechnya is, we hope, war fatigue, but give it 10-20 years of Kadyrov's face plastered all over the walls and extrajudicial executions, enforced Islamic law and all the rest of it, maybe young people will be less likely to put up with it.

There are a number on that list however who were not assassinated by Kadyrov or the Kadyrovtsy.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 02:45:36 pm by Owlbread »
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Egypt and the world and Libya
« Reply #4678 on: November 07, 2013, 02:58:37 pm »

I don't see Russia having much interest in the Isreal-Palestinian conflict.  If anything they are pro-Palestinian given that Russia is an arms dealer and that they have a general anti-Semitic history.
Russia is anti-zionist, not anti-semitic. Putin enjoys the support of many Jewish groups from having supported them, and indeed did not look forward to the emigration of many of Russia's Jews [funnily enough to Israel]. What most immediately comes to mind is the Russian Jewish Orthodoxy arguing against Western Jewish groups over Putin's censorship against homosexuals. On the other hand everything they could do to weaken Israel would help Palestine and Iran out and so by proxy help Russia out.

Sheb

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« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 05:08:18 pm by Sheb »
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