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[Aqizzar]

So yeah anyway.  Paid pro-Mubarak supporters confirmed, but they mostly retreated.  Gunfire also confirmed.  Some are believed to have been found with paper orders, to knock down anyone holding a camera, especially journalists.  Certainly, both the crowd and the journalists themselves noted how the plainclothes cops and paid guys (which is really a distinction without meaning) seemed to specifically seek out camera crews, even head-bagging a couple local journalists in the middle of the riot.

Live camera shows them totally surrounded.  Its getting ugly.  EDIT: Okay, not really clear who's surrounding who.  And isolated Army elements are moving into the riot areas, not using their weapons certainly, and not visibly coordinated.  They seem to be covering the pro-Mubarak retreat.  Cover-smoke and burning gas fumes are everywhere.

[SalmonGod]

China has had a few riots in the last couple years.  Nothing threatening nation-wide instability, but still notable.  Both were due to corruption of government. 

One was when a local official (I think it was a major head of a province?) raped and killed a young girl, and then had the police try to cover it up (badly).  The family of the girl managed to obtain her body and the local community actually banded together and blockaded the building when police tried to come in and collect it.

The other was when someone really high up ordered melanin added to milk production to cut costs, which caused lots of people permanent organ damage and killed some children.  People naturally started digging up info on wtf was going on, and one government employee publically claimed that there are separate super-healthy food production facilities secretly operated just for feeding high ranking officials.  Several people were executed before that calmed down.

But China is amazing at information control.  Supposedly, very few people under the age of 20 in China are aware of the Tianenman Square Massacre.

[alway]

Pretty steady gunfire in and around Tahrir Square. Various mixed reports as to its origin.

[Sowelu]

Man.  Still paying real close attention to this one.  Can't imagine what my Egyptian coworker must be going through right now (I think he's on vacation right now, but not to Egypt or anything).

Glenn Beck isn't just "far right" politically. He's batshit insane.

Actually, guys, Glenn Beck IS a comedian.  He's a Canadian guy named Alfred Peachous who's been playing the role for quite a few years.  He's well known for his ability to ham up his emotions, like the way he spews all that stuff so glibly, or the crying jags for America that he sometimes goes into on the air because he's just that patriotic.  So while it's scary that so many people believe what he says, you can have faith that he's really* just an actor.



_{*not really}

[Max White]

Pretty steady gunfire in and around Tahrir Square.

Watching it on the news now. Police are hopeless, army is helpless, it's a free for all.

But hey, go the one guy on a camel!

[Puzzlemaker]

First off, China scares me.  Anyone that can control information that well can also provide misinformation quite easily.

Second off, the situation in Egypt is pissing me off.

Tell me if I am wrong about any of these things.

1.  Large amounts of protests hit the streets, overwhelming normal law enforcement.  Police officers dissipate.
2.  The Army plays both sides for awhile, keeping the peace and stopping the protests from getting out of hand while at the same time protecting Mubarak.
3.  After the protests fail to die down after a few empty promises, Mubarak sends in the police force and other security forces in plain clothes, along with hired thugs to disrupt the protests.
4.  The Army fails to keep the two groups separated, and violence erupts.
5.  The Army calls for the protesters to return to their homes, due to how violent the protest has become.

Is anyone else pissed about this?  While admittedly extremely fucking asshollistic, if the army manages to convince everyone to go home using the repertoire it's built up, it would be a pretty epic political move.

Honestly at this point I hope it erupts into full scale civil war.  I know that sounds horrible, but it may be the quickest way to stop the violence, since I believe the anti-government supporters outnumber the government supporters by quite a bit.  Storm the government, take it down, then start the rebuilding process.  Better that then this slow descent into anarchy and generalized damage.

Or maybe I am full of shit.  It's so hard to form valid opinions in a quickly changing situation like this.

[Max White]

Second off, the situation in Egypt is pissing me off.

I'm thinking of breaking out a bottle of cider, sit in front of my tv, and cheer like it is a sporting event.

[Sowelu]

Honestly at this point I hope it erupts into full scale civil war.  I know that sounds horrible, but it may be the quickest way to stop the violence, since I believe the anti-government supporters outnumber the government supporters by quite a bit.  Storm the government, take it down, then start the rebuilding process.  Better that then this slow descent into anarchy and generalized damage.

I was amazed and impressed at how peaceful it was for a while.  I was really hoping it would stay like that, because it could really set a new standard for peaceful revolutions.

[SalmonGod]

Actually, guys, Glenn Beck IS a comedian.  He's a Canadian guy named Alfred Peachous who's been playing the role for quite a few years.  He's well known for his ability to ham up his emotions, like the way he spews all that stuff so glibly, or the crying jags for America that he sometimes goes into on the air because he's just that patriotic.  So while it's scary that so many people believe what he says, you can have faith that he's really* just an actor.



_{*not really}

I had to quote this post with the intention of responding to point out "this page is satire", in order to discover that * wasn't just put there by mistake.  Well done.

[Puzzlemaker]

Honestly at this point I hope it erupts into full scale civil war.  I know that sounds horrible, but it may be the quickest way to stop the violence, since I believe the anti-government supporters outnumber the government supporters by quite a bit.  Storm the government, take it down, then start the rebuilding process.  Better that then this slow descent into anarchy and generalized damage.

I was amazed and impressed at how peaceful it was for a while.  I was really hoping it would stay like that, because it could really set a new standard for peaceful revolutions.

Same.

And then Mubarak started playing dirty.  From the reports, it seems like the government is the one that initiated the violence, and the military is letting it happen.  Arrrg.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Honestly at this point I hope it erupts into full scale civil war.  I know that sounds horrible, but it may be the quickest way to stop the violence, since I believe the anti-government supporters outnumber the government supporters by quite a bit.  Storm the government, take it down, then start the rebuilding process.  Better that then this slow descent into anarchy and generalized damage.

I was amazed and impressed at how peaceful it was for a while.  I was really hoping it would stay like that, because it could really set a new standard for peaceful revolutions.

I think there's still hope for a Velvet Revolution here. It just involves someone throwing Mubarak to the revolutonaries. Well, it would still be peaceful for them, at least. Although it would certainly be a good sign if they got their hands on him and threw him out of the country instead of killing him, as unlikely as that event is.

[Max White]

I think there's still hope for a Velvet Revolution here. It just involves someone throwing Mubarak to the revolutonaries. Well, it would still be peaceful for them, at least. Although it would certainly be a good sign if they got their hands on him and threw him out of the country instead of killing him, as unlikely as that event is.

Or even better, had a 'fair' trial, found him corrupt and guilty by 'da lawz' and threw he's ass in gaol for 500 years or untill dead.

[SalmonGod]

Agent Provocateurs are old news.

But still, a person only has as much power as the number of hands they control.  If they're ignored, they have nothing beyond their own two.  Protestors don't even need to storm and take control of government buildings.  He could sit there in his office and pretend to be supreme ruler of Egypt for the rest of his life for all it would matter, if the people just decided to forget about him and organize their own operations without him.  That's the epitome of peaceful revolution, in my opinion.

Of course, this is impossible if the guy can still get people to act violently on his behalf.  Then it's a matter of pure self-defense... and the purest example of the saying "Government is civil war."

[Max White]

So... People were using traffic cones as helmets to protect themselves from rocks.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Aqizzar]

Brian Williams and Richard Engel live from Egypt, watching a truck try to plow through the anti-government protesters, before it ground to a halt and the was driver pulled out and something bad happened.  Williams: "It's Mad Max down there."

Tahrir square is largely empty save for the burning cars, but screaming, shouting, pounding, and gunfire of all sorts is overpowering the roof-top camera crew's mics.