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[MetalSlimeHunt]

I don't think a British defense company would work with Russia. Defense companies always follow the diplomatic line of their parent nation, and the UK is firmly on the US side of the US-Russian power struggle.

A set-up is not impossible at this point. There are no major groups within Syria that either the US or Russia are particularly thrilled about anymore. The government is one big, rolling atrocity armed with sarin, and the rebels are full of foreign and domestic Islamists who will set up an even more repressive regime than Assad's if they take control. Nonetheless, both the US and Russia are involved and it will take time to become uninvolved. Might as well try to leave the other holding the bill (the bill in this case being a mountain of dead noncombatants).

[Owlbread]

"File name: Sirian Issue.eml

Sounds like a nifty false flag operation.

It stinks to high heaven. Sleekit futrets.

Well, isn't this great. I had a very distinct feeling that the people in power didn't give a shit about people so long as they got money, but having a feeling and knowing it are different...

Also, Best Korea threatens south over UN sanctions.

Threats and nuclear weapons. How wonderful...

I've noticed that the international community has been taking a stronger interest in North Korea's antics lately, particularly the Aussies. I have no idea why this is - perhaps because the Australian government is under a lot of fire right now for repatriating North Korean refugees to the country to certain death/imprisonment? I doubt it will come to anything though. Still, when the DPRK goes it is going to go off with a bang.

My description for the situation with the DPRK right now is that it's like the world's infected appendix. It's swelling up and getting more and more painful and eventually it is going to burst - and when it does, it will shower everything around it in pus. When the refugees are pouring over the border and stories of the camps and atrocities start coming out (as in, Imperial Japan level) people are going to be walking around saying "But we didn't know! Why didn't anybody tell us that these things were going on in that country?" but the information has been available for nearly 20 years. God knows how China will deal with it - if they invade and restore order in the DPRK after a regime collapse then we might see some strong confrontations between East and West, at least on the diplomatic level.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Also, Best Korea threatens south over UN sanctions.

Threats and nuclear weapons. How wonderful...

I am less concerned. North Korea possesses less than 10 nukes, has an unreliable launch system, and is surrounded by ABM systems in South Korea, Japan, possibly China, and the United States Seventh Fleet.

[Owlbread]

I am less concerned. North Korea possesses less than 10 nukes, has an unreliable launch system, and is surrounded by ABM systems in South Korea, Japan, possibly China, and the United States Seventh Fleet.

North Korea's threat doesn't lie in its nukes, its threat lies in its instability.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Let them be unstable. They have been a menace to both their own people an the rest of the world. If it takes war to be rid of them, then so be it.

[Owlbread]

Let them be unstable. They have been a menace to both their own people an the rest of the world. If it takes war to be rid of them, then so be it.

War will only lead to further suffering for millions of North Koreans... but they're damned anyway, really. It's just going to change the world forever when it happens. I also believe that the North Koreans must decide their own future anyway, rather than letting us choose for them. By that I mean if we do go to war, the North Korean citizens will decide the future of their country, not an occupying force.

[Scoops Novel]

Remind me why we haven't gone in? Asides from not being bothered, possibly. People aren't completely unaware of atrocities, i suspect.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

It's like pulling off a bandage. There will be short-term suffering and death, have no doubt, but it will avoid further atrocities in the long term.

[Owlbread]

It's like pulling off a bandage. There will be short-term suffering and death, have no doubt, but it will avoid further atrocities in the long term.

But things are going to be terribly uncertain in the future for the DPRK. We will have to work extremely hard to restabilize the new, free North Korea rather than letting it collapse into civil war.

Remind me why we haven't gone in? Asides from not being bothered, possibly. People aren't completely unaware of atrocities, i suspect.

1. No oil/material gain.
2. Confrontation with China (probably diplomatic but would get ugly).
3. North Korea is like a gigantic fortress. Their roads are many lanes in width to allow for tanks and aircraft to move along them, and they also have huge pillars at the sides of the roads with plastic explosives at the bottom that can be detonated to cause them to fall onto the road and block invaders.
4. South Korea may be unable to cope culturally and economically with a reunification. East Germany at least had some resemblance to the West. There is no such thing in the Koreas.

[Karnewarrior]

Well, isn't this great. I had a very distinct feeling that the people in power didn't give a shit about people so long as they got money, but having a feeling and knowing it are different...

Also, Best Korea threatens south over UN sanctions.

Threats and nuclear weapons. How wonderful...

I'm actually kind of worried NK might start something this time.

But the issue won't be taking down NK. Hell, it's already made of paper mache and good hopes. The issue will be China.

China's going to want to keep some sort of North Korea around, preferably a communist North Korea. They want it to be stable, but they like having an Ally that close to keep South Korea occupied. They won't want a unified korea unless it's a communist Korea, whereas the U.S is the exact opposite.

If NK attacks and loses, China and the U.S will be drawing the borders. And it's going to be a struggle. If NK attacks and wins everyone's going to shit enough bricks to build a small city.

[Owlbread]

The North Koreans will also not give up without a fight. We won't be looking at another Iraq here - we'd be looking at a type of war we haven't seen for a long time. Ideally the time to intervene would be during a civil uprising in the country in which there are factions within the military that defect to the rebels and so on, a bit like Syria today.

[Nadaka]

Rebellion against the god king is unlikely.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

But things are going to be terribly uncertain in the future for the DPRK. We will have to work extremely hard to restabilize the new, free North

You need to be able to eat to rebel. North Korea never really got over the 90's famine. Food-wise, conditions there are slightly better there in that they don't need mass graves to get rid of all the famine corpses anymore, but that isn't much of an improvement. Ironically, their instability has kept them stable and will continue to do so once the DPRK falls.

In any case, once the DPRK falls there won't be a North Korea anymore. It is beyond question that South Korea will reabsorb them once their government falls.

China's going to want to keep some sort of North Korea around, preferably a communist North Korea. They want it to be stable, but they like having an Ally that close to keep South Korea occupied. They won't want a unified korea unless it's a communist Korea, whereas the U.S is the exact opposite.

Neither China nor North Korea are communist governments any longer. NK removed all references to communism in their constitution a while ago. Now it's just god-king rhetoric for the Kims. China officially supports "Socialism with Chinese characteristics" and a "Socialist market economy". If you ask the Communist Party of China they'll claim they're still Marxists, but nobody buys that anymore.

As I've said before, China may not be thrilled at the idea of a unified Korea dominated by South Korea, but North Korea isn't good for them either. They're fucking crazy and make China look bad in a period of time where China wants to at least appear squeaky clean in order to expand their power base to match the US. At the end of the day, there is no great way for this to end for China, but I think they'd be willing to at least accept the unified Korea as long as the involved diplomats are skilled.

[Scoops Novel]

Agreed. So it's a matter of time?

[MonkeyHead]

I can honestly see China sending troops in and annexing the region as a new province if the North Korean shit hits the Self Reliant fan. This might be the least objectionable soultion to all parties - no NATO/US combatants lives lost, and China placated by not having lost face.