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[Realmfighter]

1812 was entirely your fault.

Shut up you fool.

[Urist is dead tome]

I hereby agree with Johnfalcon99977.

[Neonivek]

they would've came over here and made us all slaves

Ok, I can officially say that this is educational propaganda.

Germany and Japan could barely keep the war up when they were winning, in fact Japan was much more aware of their limitations then Germany was, there is no way either of them would have crossed the ocean to take on the United States and Canada.

I can understand why you think this way. History of World War II is taught in such a way that the allies seemed like the underdog, rather then the other way around, where the Axis were evil supermen.

The fact of the matter is that really while they shot under par doing much better then anyone could have predicted... They didn't have the ability to hold domain over the lands they took, and their own institutions were bleeding them out all on their own.

In fact it is doubtful the USA's involvement in World War II would have changed the outcome other then Russia's counter attack and altering the beliefs of Japan.

IF Germany took over Europe, they would have lost Europe.

Heck while Pearl Harbor was actually rather pointless in the grand scheme of things, ignoring that it was a catalyst to involve America sooner. That was why America was caught by surprise. Better yet Japan had to expand a lot of resources to do it.

[Nikov]

Not to mention suicide. Honestly using suicide-inclusive figures in these debates is rather poor form. I think we can all agree a guy who's going to off himself has plenty of options.

Falcon is right, Japan never seriously entertained invading American soil other than the very sparsely populated Aleutian islands because Yamamoto feared "a rifle behind every blade of grass". And almost our entire ground force was militia in 1812. Its why we didn't do very well, granted, but a 'nation at arms' is a terrifying prospect for any conquerer.

And 1812 was totally the fault of the country that went around stealing our ships and their crews. Invading Canada... we got a little carried away.

[Megaman]

Russia was the real stake to the heart of Germany, being assigned to the Eastern Front was a death sentence. Several historians agree Russia could have defeated Germany on it's own. Also I agree with Nikov on the suicide part, just jump off that skyscraper over yonder.

[Leafsnail]

Germany and Japan could barely keep the war up when they were winning, in fact Japan was much more aware of their limitations then Germany was, there is no way either of them would have crossed the ocean to take on the United States and Canada.

So why did they... cross the ocean and take on the United States?  And Canada was involved from basically the start of the war anyway.

IF Germany took over Europe, they would have lost Europe.

They basically did.  The allies had zero prescence in mainland Europe until Sicily was invaded years later.

[Neonivek]

Invading Canada... we got a little carried away

Well at the time the USA honestly believed that Canada was pretty much ripe for the future ownership of the USA. Plus Canada was nowhere close to what it is today.

So why did they... cross the ocean and take on the United States?

Personally I have no idea. Logically it was a bad move on any account and Japan benefited more from the USA's aggressive uninvolvement then.

My guess was that it was a hold over from older war strategies (Which WW1 and WW2 were ripe with). Striking first to instill fear in the opponent causing them to panic. It just didn't work

They basically did

They were seriously bleeding out because of it. The worst enemy of the Germans seemed to be German policy in the end.

[Leafsnail]

Personally I have no idea. Logically it was a bad move on any account and Japan benefited more from the USA's aggressive uninvolvement then.

My guess was that it was a hold over from older war strategies. Striking first to instill fear in the opponent causing them to panic. It just didn't work

Completely agreed on both counts.  But I would say that the fact that they did it shows that they were willing to take on the US.

They were seriously bleeding out because of it. The worst enemy of the Germans seemed to be German policy in the end.

I dunno, it was quite a struggle getting it all back, even with the US on board...

[Johnfalcon99977]

Ok, I can officially say that this is educational propaganda.

I would like to point out that the Nazi thought they were the master race and thought everyone else was inferior. They didn't just enslave and kill Jewish people, they did the same the same thing to gays, Disabled people, Slavs, Gyispes, and POWs. IF they had won, they would've came over here in a heart-beat and made everyone of us there slaves.

Germany and Japan could barely keep the war up when they were winning, in fact Japan was much more aware of their limitations then Germany was, there is no way either of them would have crossed the ocean to take on the United States and Canada.

They did. In fact, I believe they had already started sending spy planes, and the west coast was perparing for an attack at any moment. They had a lot more islands they you think, there domain streched to the islands in the Bering Strait! If they ever had built enough firepower and planes they would've done it instantly. The Japs didn't care for people who died, only results. (They had a strong belief in Honor so if a thousand guys died they would only care if they died with honor.)

I can understand why you think this way. History of World War II is taught in such a way that the allies seemed like the underdog, rather then the other way around, where the Axis were evil supermen.

I do not believe this, its the other way around. The allies were a strong force, taking on a a strong enemy.

The fact of the matter is that really while they shot under par doing much better then anyone could have predicted... They didn't have the ability to hold domain over the lands they took, and their own institutions were bleeding them out all on their own.

They had a powerful police-state. People had very little freedom and any rebelous people were instantly shot down.

IF Germany took over Europe, they would have lost Europe.

Hitler wanted the world. He was an insane madman who wanted power. Rarely do Insane dictators stop at continets (Which thankly never happened (For the most part))

[Megaman]

Actually, Hitler tried to only take Europe, and thought that future generations would continue his mad quest.

[Neonivek]

it shows that they were willing to take on the US

Their goal was to take China (or rather part of China) and use their resources to fuel a war with the USA

They just didn't succeed.

I dunno, it was quite a struggle getting it all back

Well it is harder to attack then defend and Germany built an infrastructure that would make it hard to take it back. Though they were already pretty much finished off by then and a lot of the struggle was just taking it slowly.

they did the same the same thing to gays, Disabled people, Slavs, Gyispes, and POWs

I find this interesting in the aspect that everyone else hated them too (and for some still do!). Though as for "Master Race" I think your getting confused... Though it hardly matters because EVERYONE thought they were the amazing and that the enemy was EVIL!

The allies were a strong force, taking on a a strong enemy

The allies were much stronger then the Axis. Were it less of a surprise the Allies wouldn't have even lost France.

They did. In fact, I believe they had already started sending spy planes, and the west coast was perparing for an attack at any moment. They had a lot more islands they you think, there domain streched to the islands in the Bering Strait! If they ever had built enough firepower and planes they would've done it instantly

Actually I am well aware of the resources Japan had, it was why the USA was involved. Also Spyplanes were common all over. The problem is they had little way to get these resources especially as they were fought off the coast.

The Japs didn't care for people who died, only results

They also weren't stupid. That is why they took the war to China instead of the USA exclusively.

Hitler wanted the world. He was an insane madman who wanted power. Rarely do Insane dictators stop at continets

Hitler's insanity and power hunger was actually one of the largest reasons he couldn't have won.

Actually, Hitler tried to only take Europe, and thought that future generations would continue his mad quest

That would be strictly impossible though without altering the terms.

UHhh... What was this topic about again?

[Megaman]

Gun rights. Lets restart the topic with the Hello Kitty AR

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Neonivek]

I am impressed by how much a coat of paint can make something look like plastic.

[Eugenitor]

This is "gun rights", not "gun horribly wrongs".

[Megaman]

What? The Hello Kitty AR is the best gun right ever.