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[Urist is dead tome]

Use of non-FMJ is illegal for war.

[chaoticag]

Enforced by the UN though, and the UN has about as much to back it's policies as the US gives it, since not that many countries provide nearly as much backing. Not to say the UN is useless, given the extensive research they have done into social problems, but it has a lousy enforcement ability.

[Nikov]

Oh. Well if we'd rather have people using the least dangerous weapons possible when they go on shooting sprees we'd better hand out legally registered machine guns. Only two murders by them since 1934, one of which was by a police officer. 240,000 of them in the US, you know.

Anyhow yeah. Insurgents use Warsaw Pact military surplus, so yes, they use FMJ. The legality of using FMJ in wartime is determined by the Geneva Convention, not the UN. The UN doesn't have a thing to do with the matter, although most Geneva signatories are in the UN. Terrorists decidely do not abide by the Geneva Convention (surprise surprise) which is why they hide behind civilians, don't wear uniforms and use religious buildings for military purposes. WWII snipers in church towers was a breach of convention and both sides were content enough to punish violators directly with HE tank shells (returning fire from an otherwise protected site is legal under the GC), much to the ruin of countless buildings. However every time there's a sniper in a minaret...

I'm ranting.

Anyhow Afghan insurgents are more dangerous with old bolt action Lee Enfields than with AK-74s. Their AK's are corroded old pieces of junk and most don't realize the lever can even go to semi-automatic. Thus they do not aim, thus they do not hit, thus they do not kill. Quite frankly when 30 soldiers with semi-automatic carbines can fight off 200 guys with fully automatic AK's, PKMs, numerous RPG tubes and pre-infiltrating so close they opened with hand grenades, with the good guys in shallow foxholes with no air support for the first thirty minutes and no crew-served weapons after the first five something is seriously flawed with this irrational fear of fully automatic weapons in the hands of untrained crazies.

I just referenced Wanat in a gun control debate. I knew I didn't read a 271 page Pentagon report for nothing!
 

[Sir Pseudonymous]

A fully automatic weapon has exactly no purpose aside from sweeping a room or firing into a tightly packed crowd. And any weapon with penetrating power is useless for home defense, especially one that's just spraying bullets every which way, since a stray round could easily fly right through your wall, and into your neighbor's house.

Spraying on full auto, as you make a point of, is a terrible way to actually hit your target. So why would you support the proliferation of fully automatic weapons?

[Johnfalcon99977]

Then you go see the police, explain that Paris has somehow been invaded by some elk that keep startling the haulers, and give them a certificate that you know your way around a rifle. They then check that you aren't timecube creator, that you haven't make post on the internet about shooting your school, and that your second home isn't the prison. You get a permit, are allowed to grab your tasty 12 gauge to hunt and you may spill some elk brain around.

About that..... Its illegal to shoot animals in cities. Thats animal controls job. _{Damned PEDA}

And also, you are trained to use the gun, but what if said person gets a mental illness or goes insane AFTER he buys the gun. They can't go to his house and take it away, and if they try, they will most likely get shot, and now you have more dead people from guns.

Guns, I like guns, I want guns, I am planning to get my CHL soon.  I am inheriting some more guns from my father.  Hooray for guns.  I like guns for hunting, and guns for home defense, and guns for blowing the shit outta stuff.  I loved my gun rifle(smirk) in the Army.  I like knowing I have been trained to hit a man-sized target at 300 meters without a scope.  I like the fact that my father taught me about gun safety and about respecting guns at an early age.  I like that fact that I live in a country where my right to own a gun is protected (for now).  I love the feeling of knowing I just made a bad-ass shot.  I like to clean my gun rifle (smirk).  I like that fact that a friend bought a reloader.  Thats right, we are re-using our brass.  I like that.  Were motherfucking recycling bitches!  Booyaa, I like recycling and protecting the planet, with my guns.   


"This is my rifle, this is my gun.  This is for killing and this is for fun."
-Full Metal Jacket........sweet

This is the picture of a totally consertive gun manic. Totally mindless of the many many dangers of guns. How would YOU like it if someone broke into your home and shot all of your family to death with a gun? THAT HE GOT AT A STORE?

People can forge doctuments and steal guns from the shops. As long as there is a single gun for sale legally in the US, people WILL BE KILLED.

A fully automatic weapon has exactly no purpose aside from sweeping a room or firing into a tightly packed crowd. And any weapon with penetrating power is useless for home defense, especially one that's just spraying bullets every which way, since a stray round could easily fly right through your wall, and into your neighbor's house.

Spraying on full auto, as you make a point of, is a terrible way to actually hit your target. So why would you support the proliferation of fully automatic weapons?

I highly agree with this. Kudos to you.

Edit: This thread got 7 pages in a single day XD

Just shows how passtionate people are about the subject.

[Nikov]

Why hand out fully automatic weapons? I dunno. Ask Switzerland.

[Sergius]

My father and the people he hunted

OMG.

The most dangerous prey...

[Nikov]

Wow, your dad hunted VC in the delta with a shortbow? That takes balls, man.

[Il Palazzo]

Why hand out fully automatic weapons? I dunno. Ask Switzerland.

Switzerland does have a good reason, though. It's part of how their army works.

[Grakelin]

My father and the people he hunted

OMG.

The most dangerous prey...

That's it, read the words one by one and sound them out so you can understand them all.

[Megaman]

Anyone who believes giving people the right to bear arms would increase homicide rates is not thinking deep enough. A firearm would be easier to detect when fired, while, say, a kitchen knife, is capable of a fairly silent kill. If you have a criminal record you can't buy a gun legally, anyway. I'd accept civilian models with burst-fire at most, but those crazy NRA types are probably going too far with full auto. Also I go to the firing range on occasion, and they are quite recreational devices if used properly.

[Fayrik]

Wow, your dad hunted VC in the delta with a shortbow? That takes balls, man.

Okay, that's it. I'm temporarily hijacking this thread to talk about Bows... On topic.

So yeah, while you're talking about guns in America.. It's actually legal to own a bow, over here in England.
(I mean, it's technically legal to own a gun over here, you just need a licence...And, some paperwork on all your ammunition purchases and uses.)

...Damnit, now I wanna get into archery. Curse you Americans, and your weapons for all policies. </scarasm>

[Nikov]

Wait, you've not been practicing with your longbow for three hours every Sunday? Are you sure you should be admitting an offense punishable by beheading on a forum your feudal lord may well frequent?

More seriously, I highly recommend it. Archery is good for your upper body strength and like any martial art (including marksmanship) improves self-discipline. If you're not batshit insane, of course. I used to go absolutely Zen when qualifying for my Sharpshooter 2nd Class.

[KaguroDraven]

About guns. I think people should be allowed to own them, within reason. To be honest I'm good with the laws America has about guns now. They are dangerous though, there have been atleast 3 kids in my own town who didn't realise their parents gun was loaded, and in one case was too young to know what a gun WAS, who shot someone on accident. But that's the parent's faults for leaveing the gun someplace their kid get to.

About bows. I like them, I like archer, but I prefer swords and other more melee focused weapons, especially the spear, my favorate weapon ever.

[Megaman]

Children should be educated about firearms from early on so they do not do anything stupidious with a weapon.