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[Mindmaker]

@Everyone expecting me to answer their other stuff: PFP

Hmm not even urbandictionary can give me an appropriate meaning for that abbreviation (well some of them would fit, but are X-rated or offensive and I doubt that what he wants to say).

[Toaster]

PFP = Post from Phone.  Note the phone icon at the top left of his post.

[Jim Groovester]

I did say I wanted to hear from everyone, including lazy non-participant Kingmakers, didn't I?

Ottofar, get your ass in here.

Unfortunately, you're not going to get anything bigger out of me, because it was mostly gut feeling.

. . .

That's because I went through everyone's post, and if I felt like they were being townlike, crossed them off. It was a gut-check approach.

Okay, gut feelings. I can buy that, up to a certain point anyway.

What were you looking for when you decided people were town? The three people you mentioned failed somehow, so how did they fail?

And as for two scum picks, I was pretty sure zrk was scum, so who knows? Push me on it. I don't care. Probably you and... I dunno... Native. Good enough for you?

Not really. Why?

Because I figured I'd go with someone I didn't suspect at all due to activity (The irony being that I should've been watching content [I also realize now that he's accused me, but whatever]), and you because, well, I figure if you're scum, you'll be wary of me now, and if you're not, you'll be wary of me anyway.

So your scum picks are basically completely arbitrary at this point.

I'd like to note Pandarsenic's lack of scumhunting has not been brought up, yet Dariush's has. Rant rant rant rant about Pandarsenic.

Just to be clear, you've got all this to say about Pandarsenic, but you don't suspect him. Presumably if you did you would've stated so.

And you're argument for me is... How do I put this to make you sound like like a moron... moronic? I'm your second choice because I lynched town would maybe be an okay answer. Not great, but not horrible. However, because I thought Jokerman-EXE might be scum and him turning up town is stupid. No, think about it: If I felt Dariush, Pandarsenic, and Jokerman-EXE were scum, then if they weren't all scum, I'd be scummy? Well, seeing as there's two scum, I'd like to note the apparent crap in your argument: You conveniently left out Dariush to make that argument sound, because otherwise it makes no sense to begin with. You might as well accuse everyone here for not trusting everyone else but their suspects as scummy.

That's not my argument, but great job trying to make me look like a moron for it.

Here's why I suspect you: You provided no reasons for why you suspected Jokerman-EXE and Pandarsenic. Jokerman-EXE flipping town has nothing to do with it. And I didn't include Dariush because you stated reasons for why you suspected him.

Reasonless suspicions are always scummy. If you say you suspect somebody, you better have the arguments to back it up, otherwise, you're just trying to avoid suspicion by having token ones. Now that I'm getting reasons for your suspicions you're looking better, but you're still not completely cleared.

Please, also note that I was the one after Dariush and has probably supplied you with most of your rhetoric in your argument. I'm the one that pointed out Dariush as not answering questions, and for him failing to go into details. Basically, everything you might be accusing Dariush of can originate to me. But, if you feel I'm scum, how can you trust an argument like that?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

Isn't my beef with Dariush that he only asked questions because he was pressed into it? What does that have to do with you?

And this is a weird way to get me to... not suspect Dariush? I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish with this.

Now, my failty scumhunting? Wasn't almost everyone wrong about Zrk2?

How does that help you? If people were wrong about Zrk2, it wasn't for lack of good reasons to suspect him. Did you have good reason to suspect him? That's the key issue.

You were trying for Ottofar before you apparently started suspecting Zrk2 for no good reason.

The night wasn't as helpful as I hoped it would be, so I'll have to work with what I've got now.

What were you hoping would come out of the night? It strikes me as odd that your scumhunting would depend on who died in the night.

NativeForeigner and Jim, you're accusing me of lack of scumhunting. Pray tell me, what did you learn in the past day?

Are you accusing me of useless scumhunting? Again, how does this help you? Making equivalence between what I've done and what you've done isn't going to work, because I'm not scumhunting uselessly.

Here's what I've learned: webadict isn't quite as full of shit as he previously appeared, but fuck him because it took longer than it should have to get this out. But he's not completely cleared because he's got issues with Pandarsenic but doesn't apparently suspect him, and his scum picks for the today are absolutely atrocious and appear completely arbitrary.

Here's what I've learned about you: You're still pulling desperate scummy moves to avoid getting lynched.

Regarding my top two scumpicks:
I'd like to hear a bit more from webadict before I answer this one.

Not how this works. I want your immediate suspicions because I think they would be revealing. Funny how you didn't bring those out.

So, come on. Let's hear 'em.

[NativeForeigner]

Pandar, Webadict's got a point. You're not providing much more than passive commentary. When are you going to start asking questions? Who are your top scumpicks and what are your cases against them?

Dariush, I wasn't talking about your poor scumhunting, I was talking about your lack of it. People that were wrong about Zrk2 were just that, wrong. The only reason Wuba's any different is because another of his suspects was also town, so that's two for four. Not a very good ratio. Though he had good reasoning to go for Zrk2, it doesn't let him off the hook. Dariush is still top of my list, however. Followed by a bit of a tie between Wuba and Pandar. Pandar because he hasn't really done a whole lot.

As for what I did D1, how about you take a look for yourself? I don't really feel like recapping my D1 for you. You should have been paying attention. What did YOU do D1?

Ottofar where are you? You might be Kingmaker, but you still have to participate.

[Pandarsenic]

NF:

Dariush tried his hardest to get out of actual, er, doing. Of anything. When forced, he asked blanket questions of no real value, only escaping because of Zrk2's behavior.

Wubadict got all high and mighty about how he didn't have to explain because he's king.

He's no longer king.

STORY TIME YAY

As I've said before, he still hasn't explained why - he's just saying "because he did" and WIFOMing relentlessly and going "Have I mentioned how awesome I am?" while looking like a scumbukkit.

Also, I "[haven't] really done a whole lot"? Srsly? At least point out that I was one of the people going after Zrk2 heavily if you're going to accuse me of something.

My commentary is not passive. My commentary is at worst passive-aggressive. I am pointing out that people (Webadicts) are scummy, shortly after posts of his that demonstrate my complaints soundly enough. If you can't tell what my complaint is when I say

Hey Webadict, can you at least give us some cheese with that wine?

Then you aren't looking.

[Ottofar]

Yeah, I've been feeling lazy. Sorry. Anyways.

I'll try and do something when I properly wake up.

[Jim Groovester]

If you weren't a confirmed townie, I would fucking lynch you right now for this bullshit.

Every.

Fucking.

Goddamn.

Game.

[Ottofar]

Yeah. But. Well.

First of all, I'm going to swap Kingmakers every day.

Second of all, everyone. who'd you like to be the king tomorrow, and why. Who would you least like to be the king?

Thirdly,

To start the day off, here's what I want to hear from everybody: Your current top two scum picks, and your reasons why.

I'd throw in Dariush for, well. Pretty much the same reasons as you, and well... Pandar has been somewhat lurky.

[Pandarsenic]

Pandar has been somewhat lurky.

Learn what lurking is and try again.

I'd most like to see myself kinged tomorrow (durr) and least like to see... hmm, I'll say Dariush is a worse option than Wuba... for now.

[Ottofar]

As in I don't remember a lot of him. Same for NF.

[Pandarsenic]

Don't blame others for your own failings.

[Dariush]

Now, my failty scumhunting? Wasn't almost everyone wrong about Zrk2?

How does that help you? If people were wrong about Zrk2, it wasn't for lack of good reasons to suspect him. Did you have good reason to suspect him? That's the key issue.

I picked him for the same reasons as everyone - overall scumminess, falling back on being new, etc. Guts feeling. (I feel that you'll point out that this is bandwagoning...)

You were trying for Ottofar before you apparently started suspecting Zrk2 for no good reason.

How many times must I point out that I wasn't trying for Ottofar?

The night wasn't as helpful as I hoped it would be, so I'll have to work with what I've got now.

What were you hoping would come out of the night? It strikes me as odd that your scumhunting would depend on who died in the night.

It wouldn't depend on who died, but I hoped the death would rather help.

NativeForeigner and Jim, you're accusing me of lack of scumhunting. Pray tell me, what did you learn in the past day?

Here's what I've learned: webadict isn't quite as full of shit as he previously appeared, but fuck him because it took longer than it should have to get this out. But he's not completely cleared because he's got issues with Pandarsenic but doesn't apparently suspect him, and his scum picks for the today are absolutely atrocious and appear completely arbitrary.

Here's what I've learned about you: You're still pulling desperate scummy moves to avoid getting lynched.

So, you have information about two players, neither of which came from the questions and both were passive observations. And I am the one who is accused of lack of hunting. *sigh*

Dariush, I wasn't talking about your poor scumhunting, I was talking about your lack of it. People that were wrong about Zrk2 were just that, wrong. The only reason Wuba's any different is because another of his suspects was also town, so that's two for four. Not a very good ratio. Though he had good reasoning to go for Zrk2, it doesn't let him off the hook. Dariush is still top of my list, however. Followed by a bit of a tie between Wuba and Pandar. Pandar because he hasn't really done a whole lot.

As for what I did D1, how about you take a look for yourself? I don't really feel like recapping my D1 for you. You should have been paying attention. What did YOU do D1?

You didn't really answer my question, did you? I asked what you learned. You answered by pointing out (again) I didn't ask any questions and retelling facts about Zrk2's lynch. Answer the question before asking me the same one.

[webadict]

I'd have to say Dariush because of his previous jumpiness and apparent inability to answer questions coupled with his general lack of effective scumhunting. He choses to complain about other people's tactics rather than apply his own.

Dariush, how do you feel about scumhunting and questioning now that it's D2? Are you still going to be stubborn about it?

Once again, my question's uselessness was because I vastly overestimated the importance of Kingmaker's death. I was looking in the wrong direction. Now, my failty scumhunting? Wasn't almost everyone wrong about Zrk2?

The night wasn't as helpful as I hoped it would be, so I'll have to work with what I've got now.

webadict, how come I SUDDENLY move from being '90% to the gallows' to not even being in your top two pick? And is 'guts feeling' the only justification you're going to give for your suspicion? .
NativeForeigner and Jim, you're accusing me of lack of scumhunting. Pray tell me, what did you learn in the past day?

The last question bugs me the most. The questions I asked turned out to be irrelevant; the questions you asked were random and irrelevant from the start. Of what am I accused except not asking the same random questions? I want to hear everyone's information extracted from D1 without bringing up my lack of questioning.

What are you TALKING about? It's top THREE, and you were, in fact, in them! Why can you not pay a single iota of attention? How many photons must be wasted on your unreceptive eyes?!?

Second question: Yeah, pretty much. It was mostly gut feeling. If you've got a problem with that, then fine. There's not going to be much more I can give you.

Here's my info from D1: You suck, Pandarsenic sucks, and Zrk2 really sucked. I'd like to see you argue that he didn't deserve to be lynched.

Well zrk2 supported one of my previous post and did a mistake in his list, which might strike someone as odd.
Did I look like a potential scumbuddy to you at that time? If yes, why didn't you question me? Or did you wanted to wait and see, if zrk2 flips scum first?

You looked like it, but it was only based on zrk2, and therefore useless without a flip from him.

Hey Webadict, can you at least give us some cheese with that wine?

Yeah, sure. Whatever. No need to point out specific passages for anyone else. Wanna be a little more active in the game? Or do you enjoy making snide comments that pretty much prove you as being a horrendous player? I'd equate you with Org, except he actually has moments of not being useless.

Unfortunately, you're not going to get anything bigger out of me, because it was mostly gut feeling.

. . .

That's because I went through everyone's post, and if I felt like they were being townlike, crossed them off. It was a gut-check approach.

Okay, gut feelings. I can buy that, up to a certain point anyway.

What were you looking for when you decided people were town? The three people you mentioned failed somehow, so how did they fail?

Participation, mostly. Explanations. People trying to play. And then slight intuition.

And as for two scum picks, I was pretty sure zrk was scum, so who knows? Push me on it. I don't care. Probably you and... I dunno... Native. Good enough for you?

Not really. Why?

Because I figured I'd go with someone I didn't suspect at all due to activity (The irony being that I should've been watching content [I also realize now that he's accused me, but whatever]), and you because, well, I figure if you're scum, you'll be wary of me now, and if you're not, you'll be wary of me anyway.

So your scum picks are basically completely arbitrary at this point.

Not really. NativeForeigner has been bugging me, but I'm not sure why. I feel like he's participating more than anyone else, and if he's scum, I wouldn't mind him winning because he's actually trying. I also listed you because... I'm not sure. Maybe you'll lynch me. It'd certainly make my job easier. I guess maybe you don't really need to be suspected, because Pandarsenic is doing such an amazing job at making himself look like complete garbage.

I'd like to note Pandarsenic's lack of scumhunting has not been brought up, yet Dariush's has. Rant rant rant rant about Pandarsenic.

Just to be clear, you've got all this to say about Pandarsenic, but you don't suspect him. Presumably if you did you would've stated so.

No, I suspect him. You were simply asking for two people. Big difference.

And you're argument for me is... How do I put this to make you sound like like a moron... moronic? I'm your second choice because I lynched town would maybe be an okay answer. Not great, but not horrible. However, because I thought Jokerman-EXE might be scum and him turning up town is stupid. No, think about it: If I felt Dariush, Pandarsenic, and Jokerman-EXE were scum, then if they weren't all scum, I'd be scummy? Well, seeing as there's two scum, I'd like to note the apparent crap in your argument: You conveniently left out Dariush to make that argument sound, because otherwise it makes no sense to begin with. You might as well accuse everyone here for not trusting everyone else but their suspects as scummy.

That's not my argument, but great job trying to make me look like a moron for it.

That's NativeForeigner I was talking to... Not you. Not the quoted part to which this is a response to. I even rechecked my post to make sure that it wasn't a postfail. It wasn't.

Here's why I suspect you: You provided no reasons for why you suspected Jokerman-EXE and Pandarsenic. Jokerman-EXE flipping town has nothing to do with it. And I didn't include Dariush because you stated reasons for why you suspected him.

Understandable. Look above for Dariush.

Reasonless suspicions are always scummy. If you say you suspect somebody, you better have the arguments to back it up, otherwise, you're just trying to avoid suspicion by having token ones. Now that I'm getting reasons for your suspicions you're looking better, but you're still not completely cleared.

I could create an argument, but it'd only be WIFOM, and we all know how much Pandarsenic will troll if I post that.

Please, also note that I was the one after Dariush and has probably supplied you with most of your rhetoric in your argument. I'm the one that pointed out Dariush as not answering questions, and for him failing to go into details. Basically, everything you might be accusing Dariush of can originate to me. But, if you feel I'm scum, how can you trust an argument like that?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

Isn't my beef with Dariush that he only asked questions because he was pressed into it? What does that have to do with you?

And this is a weird way to get me to... not suspect Dariush? I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish with this.

... NativeForeigner. Please pay attention. I realize you were quoted inside the NF quote, but it's not directed at you.

Here's what I've learned: webadict isn't quite as full of shit as he previously appeared, but fuck him because it took longer than it should have to get this out. But he's not completely cleared because he's got issues with Pandarsenic but doesn't apparently suspect him, and his scum picks for the today are absolutely atrocious and appear completely arbitrary.

I never said I don't suspect him. You only asked for two people, and I gave you two people. Jumping to conclusions isn't advised.

As I've said before, he still hasn't explained why - he's just saying "because he did" and WIFOMing relentlessly and going "Have I mentioned how awesome I am?" while looking like a scumbukkit.

I have explained. It simply isn't good enough for you. Choose your words better, since the other way is an intentional misrepresentation of the situation.

Also, I "[haven't] really done a whole lot"? Srsly? At least point out that I was one of the people going after Zrk2 heavily if you're going to accuse me of something.

Wow. He really turned out to be scum, didn't he? If you're going to claim to be "doing a lot," then try picking something that benefited the town.

My commentary is not passive. My commentary is at worst passive-aggressive. I am pointing out that people (Webadicts) are scummy, shortly after posts of his that demonstrate my complaints soundly enough. If you can't tell what my complaint is when I say

It is passive, since you're not making an active case against me. You'll simply post - without quotes - about how much WIFOM or some other crap the last post had. It's making no effort to actively engage in a case, and it also makes you active lurk at the same time. So, yeah.

Idiot.

Sorry for any delay. I've been rather busy this week.

[Jim Groovester]

Yeah. But. Well.

_RRRRGGGGHHHH

I don't really care who you make King (but make it Pandarsenic and not Dariush).

I'd most like to see myself kinged tomorrow (durr) and least like to see... hmm, I'll say Dariush is a worse option than Wuba... for now.

WUBA is ineligible for Kingship unless there's no other option, because he was already previously King.

So your scum picks are basically completely arbitrary at this point.

Not really. NativeForeigner has been bugging me, but I'm not sure why. I feel like he's participating more than anyone else, and if he's scum, I wouldn't mind him winning because he's actually trying. I also listed you because... I'm not sure. Maybe you'll lynch me. It'd certainly make my job easier. I guess maybe you don't really need to be suspected, because Pandarsenic is doing such an amazing job at making himself look like complete garbage.

These are still pretty flimsy. You've been working at Pandarsenic, and besides a little bit on NativeForeigner that I somehow thought was addressed to me, you haven't done much for him, and almost nothing aimed at me.

If these are your targets, why aren't you doing more? Or at the very least, trying to do more?

How does that help you? If people were wrong about Zrk2, it wasn't for lack of good reasons to suspect him. Did you have good reason to suspect him? That's the key issue.

I picked him for the same reasons as everyone - overall scumminess, falling back on being new, etc. Guts feeling. (I feel that you'll point out that this is bandwagoning...)

If you did suspect him you never made it clear. This is the only post you made where you it could be interpreted that you suspected Zrk2, but you did not have reasons.

How many times must I point out that I wasn't trying for Ottofar?

But you were!

I just wanted to look at the situation from all possible sides. Now I see that I was wrong about suspecting him.

How is this not an admission that you were trying to get Ottofar lynched?

What were you hoping would come out of the night? It strikes me as odd that your scumhunting would depend on who died in the night.

It wouldn't depend on who died, but I hoped the death would rather help.

How? This doesn't make any sense.

So, you have information about two players, neither of which came from the questions and both were passive observations. And I am the one who is accused of lack of hunting. *sigh*

Don't sigh at me, mister. Everything I learned came directly from questions I asked. These are not passive observations I'm making when I'm hounding your ass down for information.

I'm getting pretty close to making a decision and I'm thinking it's going to be Dariush. I'll wait for the magical mystical disappearing Mindmaker to make an appearance first and explain why he felt he was above giving me immediate suspicions.

[Jim Groovester]

I'm getting pretty close to making a decision and I'm thinking it's going to be Dariush. I'll wait for the magical mystical disappearing Mindmaker to make an appearance first and explain why he felt he was above giving me immediate suspicions.

Actually, since it's the weekend, I'll refrain from making a decision until Monday.