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[Jonathan S. Fox]

Right now, characters can start with rented apartments. This is more of a liability than a benefit, even with first month's rent in the bank, and even though the rent is cheaper than normal. But what if the rent on your starting apartments wasn't just cheaper, but free? That would make those choices pack more of a punch, and it would take away the feeling of burden the apartments add. This would go with a nerf to your starting cash, where you don't get the first month's rent free, though you would get $97 for groceries (except for the gang member story; that one gives you food stores in the safehouse).

[nenjin]

I always thought your starting house was the result of your background choices. It sort of made sense to me a high-end thief is living in a nice place.

If it was done under the hood during background creation, I'd be ok with that.

[kilakan]

maybe a final life choice like writing a manifesto or another one, would end with a 'free' house, or maybe one you own so there is no rent but maybe cheaper mortgage?

[Innominate]

To keep things balanced, we would probably have to have it set up so that fleeing the apartment during a raid resulted in losing the property (which you could re-rent, but not for free).

[Duuvian]

I think he meant that only the first month is free. You could kidnap your landlord and make him a sleeper, I think that gives a free rent.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Currently, the building you start in depends on the last character creation choice. Professional Thief gets a high-end downtown apartment, for example. Under my suggestion, that stays the same, but there's no rent for the apartment. It's a permanent or semi-permanent safehouse, the same as if you successfully intimidated the landlord. I think it would be a reasonable check on this that you could still lose the safehouse if it gets raided (and not fought off); this might even already be the case.

[KaguroDraven]

I like this idea.

[nenjin]

Well I play a lot of professional thief so I never am worrying about rent money. I don't really have anything against it. I didn't know you could intimidate the landlord and live rent free. Think fewer people might figure that out if they already live rent free?

Either way, if it does happen it should probably be explained that their current home is rent free.

[Kay12]

Rented apartments should be powered up in any case. Normal safehouses are easier to defend and have many nice benefits like the Guardian and cameras and so on. And they're actually cheaper in the long run (or even the medium one if we're comparing to DT apts) than the apts.

Also, is there yet a way to cancel the rent without running out of dough?

[EuchreJack]

Also, is there yet a way to cancel the rent without running out of dough?

Get raided and fail to defend.

Seriously, if this bug was fixed, I think there would be no problem with the current starting mechanisms.  I sort of fail to see how free rent is even moderately realistic, as I spend most of my money every month on rent.  Paying rent should probably be optional, in any case, with the landlord waiting a random number of days (sometimes zero, sometimes 7, sometimes more) before eviction.

[Kay12]

Conservative landlords...

EVICTION EXECUTION NOTICE: TWENTY ARMED THUGS HAVE COME TO GET THE APARTMENT BACK

[EuchreJack]

Conservative landlords...

EVICTION EXECUTION NOTICE: TWENTY ARMED THUGS HAVE COME TO GET THE APARTMENT BACK

YES! EJ WANTS!

The squad fighting off the cops who seek to legally evict the LCS!  Awesome!

[Kay12]

Maybe this could be the difference between apartments and other safehouses: apartments are owned by extremely cunning landlords who can, for a price, keep your guys very safe from raids. But that price is very high (3000-5000$ a month maybe), and failure to pay should result in consequences. Also, if you cancel the rent, nothing's going to stop the landlord from revealing your dirty deeds to the coppers.

[Soadreqm]

If that becomes a mechanic, you should be able to just shoot the landlord when you leave. Trying to extort the LCS sounds a bit Conservative to me.

Anyway, I think free housing sounds pretty good to me. Apartments aren't all that great right now, compared to the starting point of first aid you can get.

[Kay12]

The first aid isn't that great either, now that you can go to the university and learn it for a few hundred bucks.