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[nenjin]

History channel seriously needs to run just one giant documentary, where they tie: secret societies, ancient aliens, the drug and alcohol business, biker gangs, prison life, the history of sex, the apocalypse, deadly solar flares, WWII and Nazis all into one seamless thread.

Then they can just run that straight up until "the end."

That said, all I watched the last few days was the special with all Nazi home footage. /sheepish

[Solifuge]

But seeing as how the Mayans couldn't even predict the end of their own civilization, they're no smarter than we are...

This is a slightly asinine thing to say. As the inheritors of Olmec astronomical and mathematical expertise, the Mayan calendar took into account things that the rest of the world wouldn't pick up on for a long time... and it is fractionally more accurate than the calendar we're still using today. They also had the concept of zero long before it hit the "western" world (zero was represented as a glyph of an empty mussel shell), and had Cortez not destroyed the Codices that recorded Mesoamerican History (thus allowing he and the rest of Christendom to properly subjugate and manifest some destiny at them), we'd have far fuller records of their history and achievements. Instead, all we have is what we can infer from archaeological evidence, and the oral tradition that continues among some descendants of the Maya.

The only cycle I've heard the long-count calendar correlated to was the "wobble" of the Earth, a phenomenon known as procession/precision (not sure which; this is coming from NPR). As I understand it, it represents a subtle shift in the pitch of the Earth that takes about 5000 years to complete. I need to do some legwork regarding this, since I've cited it frequently, but never properly corroborated it.

[nenjin]

And it's crazy to think about raw human potential when you realize they figured out that tilt thing probably with a stick buried in the ground and observing it in relation to a fixed point in the sky for about 80 years.

I think the truth about a lot of that ancient mysterious "how the fuck did they do that" stuff is just that ancient people possessed a determination to complete projects that we've lost as technology as had made our lives easier. Give us 3,000,000 tons of cement, 20,000 tons of rebar, and a half dozen dump trucks, and we'll build highways that would have blown the ancient's minds. Ask us to do something half as big with just our bare hands and stone tools? Forgetabouit.

[Soadreqm]

But seeing as how the Mayans couldn't even predict the end of their own civilization, they're no smarter than we are...

This is a slightly asinine thing to say. As the inheritors of Olmec astronomical and mathematical expertise, the Mayan calendar took into account things that the rest of the world wouldn't pick up on for a long time... and it is fractionally more accurate than the calendar we're still using today. They also had the concept of zero long before it hit the "western" world (zero was represented as a glyph of an empty mussel shell), and had Cortez not destroyed the Codices that recorded Mesoamerican History (thus allowing he and the rest of Christendom to properly subjugate and manifest some destiny at them), we'd have far fuller records of their history and achievements. Instead, all we have is what we can infer from archaeological evidence, and the oral tradition that continues among some descendants of the Maya.

That doesn't really make them smarter than we are, though. Despite what Asimov would have you believe, being good at maths doesn't let you predict the future. Basically everyone had a zero before it hit the western world. It traveled its way from India to the Middle East before reaching Europe. That doesn't make the Hindu or Muslim end-of-the-world myths any more correct.

In any way, a quick skim of the Wikipedia article confirms the doomsday prediction as completely silly. Mayan calendar isn't even ending in any appreciable sense. Just another one of the 400-year periods. The thirteenth, to be exact. Since the Mayans counted in base 20, it'll be another seven of those before the ancient Mayan supercomputers glitch up and the giant hovering Battle Temples rise from the ground to bathe the world in nuclear fire.

[Grakelin]

Uh, pretty sure my own quick skim of Wikipedia proved that their Doomsday predictions were true.

Troll harder, fail researcher.

[Solifuge]

I wasn't aware that we were seeing who was smarter. I'm just saying that implying that they were idiots was asinine and ignorant. They also don't have a doomsday prophecy; I believe that's just people slapping their own interpretation on the Mayan measurement of a Precisional Cycle.

On an unrelated note, the people from hundreds of years ago are no less intelligent than those of today; we've just had more time to develop a better understanding of the world. Don't mistake cultural discoveries and modern science for personal intelligence; they're not the same thing.

[The Worst Gamer]

Imagine if a person from another civilization took a look at a Western calendar.

It ends on the 31st of December 2011.

Therefore, the world must end on that date!

(In fact, there are a lot of other similarities, like the fact both we and the Mayans party like it's nineteen ninety-nine whenever the new calendar year rolls about.)

[Grakelin]

Gee, guys, this is case closed already. Mayans have already predicted their downfall three times. This time has to be legit too.

[ILikePie]

It ends on the 31st of December 2011.

Therefore, the world must end on that date!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[The Merchant Of Menace]

Anyone else think that, when creating the calendar the just went "2012? Fuck it, that'll do" or "2012 *snigger* this'll mess some idiots up in a few thousand years"?

[Il Palazzo]

As for me, I know that the world will not end on 2012, because Nostradamus predicted events happening even further in time.

a phenomenon known as procession/precision (not sure which; this is coming from NPR). As I understand it, it represents a subtle shift in the pitch of the Earth that takes about 5000 years to complete.

"precession", and it's ~26000 years. Unless you mean the little "wobbling" of the speed at which it changes(nutation), but then it's 18,5 years.

This is the only thing I've found re: Maya calendar vs precession:
http://www.instituteofmayastudies.org/Milbrath2012.pdf

[tomas1297]

 No. Because:

1: You can't create a calendar that goes forever.
2: There were a lot of predictions of the world ending, none of which were true.
3: ...The world already ended for the Mayans...

[Grakelin]

Imagine if a person from another civilization took a look at a Western calendar.

It ends on the 31st of December 2011.

Therefore, the world must end on that date!

(In fact, there are a lot of other similarities, like the fact both we and the Mayans party like it's nineteen ninety-nine whenever the new calendar year rolls about.)

It ends on the 31st of December 2011.

Therefore, the world must end on that date!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Anyone else think that, when creating the calendar the just went "2012? Fuck it, that'll do" or "2012 *snigger* this'll mess some idiots up in a few thousand years"?

No, I don't think anybody else thought of that.

[Argembarger]

I still morn the lost of the History Channel. 8/


Down with PsedoHistory Channel!

Just going to point out that the spinoffs, Military History and History International, are awesome and retain the spirit of the old History channel. It is sad that it has to come to watching spinoff networks, but hey, it gives me my authentic History channel fix every day.

[Soadreqm]

1: You can't create a calendar that goes forever.

Uh... Yes you can. The Gregorian calendar goes forever. As does the Mayan. In fact, I don't know of any calendar that couldn't be extended arbitrarily far to the future. As time approaches infinity, it will eventually rack up more digits than the universe has particles, but that doesn't really matter.

(words)

Yes I agree.