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[Virtz]

If Conan the Friggin' Barbarian wants to lead the mages guild, who's going to stop him?

The Morrowind mages guild. Or the Lliac Bay mages guilds.

Conversely, there's no real reason you couldn't have a game with nothing but claymore-wielding nords that still had an interesting world. Even if the cell transitions took twelve seconds and the graphics were shit. It's been pulled off by shoddier games in the past.

In a setting where they constantly fight stuff that's much bigger than them, it would indeed be an impediment. Why? Because it shows that everyone in the world cannot grasp what tool to use for the job. It's like watching someone trying to stick a square shape in a round hole.

I'm fighting a dragon. No, I don't want a spear. I want customizable magic so I can hit him with whatever he's weakest to from a safe range, and make him weaker to that effect as well, or possibly paralyze his wings and mouth, make him fall out of the sky, and be unable to use his breath weapon or wing buffet due to the paralysis. (You'd kind of expect dragons to be able to use magic themselves and possibly counteract what you're trying to do, though)

That's nice and all, but I was talking specifically about physical weapons. I think the fighters guild would be doing more than just twiddling their thumbs while dragons attack. Though there's no customizable magic either, so there's that.

Skyrim QuakeCon Demo

Video freezes at around the 25 minute mark, audio about a minute later. Both come back around the 28 minute mark but they're out of sync.

HD version was taken down.

"Quick! Do the stupidest thing possible!!! If I scream at you to do it, I'm sure you'll do it!!!". What a great audience.

The only new thing the video showed me though, is that you can escape dragons through doors even if the area behind that door has openings.

On a positive note, it does reassure that it looks much better than Oblivion in graphical style. Less reliant on bloom and all that.

[Sordid]

What a great audience.

I strongly suspect it's fake. You know how sitcoms have laugh tracks? I suspect Bethsoft had a cheer track. Either that, or the audience is composed entirely of blithering idiots, because I can't imagine why else they'd cheer at stuff that isn't new and/or is utter shit. Like that bit where he snipes a guy with a bow and the other person the guy was talking to just stands there and does nothing. Doesn't attack, doesn't run for cover, just stands there, even though their conversation partner just got killed in mid-sentence. And they cheer and applaud that. Oh em gee.

Edit: I just have to reiterate just how speechless I am at that. That exact problem was grudgingly tolerated in Morrowind and harshly criticised in Oblivion. And ten years later, Skyrim still has it! Does anyone still doubt that Bethsoft are a bunch of feckless, lazy layabouts? I don't understand why he wasn't booed off the stage at that point.

[shadenight123]

i liked the part of the npc grabbing a chunk of wood, which moves, and ends up in the sawmill.
if what he said about interactions is true and not "hype" it's a nice added touch.
now i don't recall, but it's possible also to destroy buildings, right? it was mentioned something about destroying sawmills to reduce wooden products in a city...so also taverns/walls can be razed...right?

[Sordid]

i liked the part of the npc grabbing a chunk of wood, which moves, and ends up in the sawmill.
if what he said about interactions is true and not "hype" it's a nice added touch.
now i don't recall, but it's possible also to destroy buildings, right? it was mentioned something about destroying sawmills to reduce wooden products in a city...so also taverns/walls can be razed...right?

I'm suspecting that's going to take the form of a "press the Use key to sabotage the windmill" prompt when you look at the millstone or something like that (at which point your character will snap said millstone in twain with his bare hands). Destructible environments definitely aren't in. If they had that, they'd have shown it off and hyped it massively.

Also, I absolutely can't imagine a better way to make combat intense and immersive than to make the player have to pause it and navigate cascading menus three layers deep to change weapons or spells. Mmm, yeah.

Edit: On the plus side, I used to be worried that watching the hype would raise my expectations unrealistically high and subsequently cause me to be disappointed when the game fails to deliver. Fortunately it's done the exact opposite so far, so I'm probably going to be pleasantly surprised in the end.

[scriver]

I think the fighters guild would be doing more than just twiddling their thumbs while dragons attack.

On this topic - if the side quest-lines is as unrelated to the main quest (i e, dragons!), I know what my first big modding project is going to be. Their inactivity was ridiculous in Oblivion. Especially the Mages Guild. They should have been all over the gates, studying, experimenting, making expeditions into them, gathering Oblivioneous resources. Hell, it could've been used as an explanations as to why the necromancers were kicking their asses so easily, the having their manpower stretched thin between both the Oblivion and Necromancer crises.
But hardly even a recognition that the world was about to end around them.

Uh, so yeah. If that's the case for Skyrim too, I'll definitely attempt to remedy it. And, knowing myself, probably abandon the project halfway through, but whatever.

i liked the part of the npc grabbing a chunk of wood, which moves, and ends up in the sawmill.
if what he said about interactions is true and not "hype" it's a nice added touch.
now i don't recall, but it's possible also to destroy buildings, right? it was mentioned something about destroying sawmills to reduce wooden products in a city...so also taverns/walls can be razed...right?

The chunk was a bit large, though. Looked a bit too light. But yeah, nice. I wonder how/when it resets. Maybe every time you leave the area, or by time.

And I doubt you can destroy anything you want. Sordid is probably right.

Also, I absolutely can't imagine a better way to make combat intense and immersive than to make the player have to pause it and navigate cascading menus three layers deep to change weapons or spells. Mmm, yeah.

Heh, yeah. I think it looks more functional/easier to navigate than Oblivion's, though. But it still seems to suffer from the same issues.

Except for the skill menu. That is going to be such a damn hassle to move around in, even more with the perks and all. Why couldn't they just list them next to each other? That just looks unnecessarily complicated and stupid. I'm guessing it won't be long after release until someone releases a mod completely redesigning that thing and making it accessible.

[Sordid]

It looks more functional/easier to navigate than Oblivion's.

Oh sure, if only because it actually says what the various options are instead of using incomprehensible icons that bear no relation whatsoever to the function of the button they're assigned to. Credit where credit is due, telling the player what the menu options do was a good call on Bethsoft's part.

Except for the skill menu. That is going to be such a damn hassle to move around in, even more with the perks and all. Why couldn't they just list them next to each other? That just looks unnecessarily complicated and stupid. I'm guessing it won't be long after release until someone releases a mod completely redesigning that thing and making it accessible.

Oh god, don't even get me started on that. What was so wrong with a simple, ordinary skill list and perk tree? The thing is, I'm terribly worried it's going to be hard-coded or otherwide made unmoddable. Even Oblivion UI mods just made it a bit more PC friendly by not using ginormous fonts designed to be viewed on a TV screen from across the living room, but they couldn't change the fundamental structure of the UI.

[shadenight123]

as i said before, mods should fix 99% of things players don't like within the first year. and with the modding community that's around the series, you can be sure they are so going to create mods till the ends of time. in the end, you get the double or the triple from any bethesda games....because of the MODS. i mean. just think of nehrim and morroblivion for oblivion. and those who add quests, npc, new areas...developper develop core functions and main quests...then i think they say "hey, we're done, let's leave the rest to the modders community"

[MasterFancyPants]

When he talking about the Radiant AI I wanted someone to yell out: "Just like in Oblivion!" so badly.

[Soadreqm]

If Conan the Friggin' Barbarian wants to lead the mages guild, who's going to stop him?

The Morrowind mages guild. Or the Lliac Bay mages guilds.

The implication was that the Mages Guild would find itself unable to stop Conan, as Conan would wipe the floor with the mages. >:]

In a setting where they constantly fight stuff that's much bigger than them, [wielding nothing but claymores] would indeed be an impediment. Why? Because it shows that everyone in the world cannot grasp what tool to use for the job. It's like watching someone trying to stick a square shape in a round hole.

You mean like Morrowind did, with the Levitation? It's possible in the setting to mix a potion of levitation out of racer plumes and trama root, both of which are readily available in the Ashlands. If you don't feel like killing a cliff racer, you will have to do it anyway, but you can also use coda flowers. Yet, everyone but the Telvanni still bothers with city walls. Locking the city gates against a dragon makes pretty much the exact same amount of sense as locking it against an army, except the army probably has a few battlemages who can also turn themselves invisible before flying over the wall.

Besides, Smaug was killed with an arrow, and Glaurung with a sword. There's nothing traditional about fighting dragons with spears. >:]

[Vibhor]

as i said before, mods should fix 99% of things players don't like within the first year. and with the modding community that's around the series, you can be sure they are so going to create mods till the ends of time. in the end, you get the double or the triple from any bethesda games....because of the MODS. i mean. just think of nehrim and morroblivion for oblivion. and those who add quests, npc, new areas...developper develop core functions and main quests...then i think they say "hey, we're done, let's leave the rest to the modders community"

You do know that they are still charging full 60$ for this atrocity?

[shadenight123]

as i said before, mods should fix 99% of things players don't like within the first year. and with the modding community that's around the series, you can be sure they are so going to create mods till the ends of time. in the end, you get the double or the triple from any bethesda games....because of the MODS. i mean. just think of nehrim and morroblivion for oblivion. and those who add quests, npc, new areas...developper develop core functions and main quests...then i think they say "hey, we're done, let's leave the rest to the modders community"

You do know that they are still charging full 60$ for this atrocity?

i know, still, one can always wait a year. price goes low with americas imminent economical crash, get it, and in a year mods are already in the thousands. or the milions. be happy. >.>

[MasterFancyPants]

as i said before, mods should fix 99% of things players don't like within the first year. and with the modding community that's around the series, you can be sure they are so going to create mods till the ends of time. in the end, you get the double or the triple from any bethesda games....because of the MODS. i mean. just think of nehrim and morroblivion for oblivion. and those who add quests, npc, new areas...developper develop core functions and main quests...then i think they say "hey, we're done, let's leave the rest to the modders community"

You do know that they are still charging full 60$ for this atrocity?

i know, still, one can always wait a year. price goes low with americas imminent economical crash, get it, and in a year mods are already in the thousands. or the milions. be happy. >.>

It's not about if the game can be fixed, it's about how the game should already be good when you buy it.

[Virtz]

If Conan the Friggin' Barbarian wants to lead the mages guild, who's going to stop him?

The Morrowind mages guild. Or the Lliac Bay mages guilds.

The implication was that the Mages Guild would find itself unable to stop Conan, as Conan would wipe the floor with the mages. >:]

Uh-huh. So he'd try to murder everyone? Even he did succeed, you can't lead a guild of dead people.

You mean like Morrowind did, with the Levitation? It's possible in the setting to mix a potion of levitation out of racer plumes and trama root, both of which are readily available in the Ashlands. If you don't feel like killing a cliff racer, you will have to do it anyway, but you can also use coda flowers. Yet, everyone but the Telvanni still bothers with city walls. Locking the city gates against a dragon makes pretty much the exact same amount of sense as locking it against an army, except the army probably has a few battlemages who can also turn themselves invisible before flying over the wall.

When was any city gate locked in Morrowind? Most of the cities/towns had no gates to lock. I think the walls served more as something to ease blight storms than anything.

And some of the cantons were actually made in a way that would allow holding off an army, levitation or not.

Some of the Imperial forts were more traditional and had gates that were never locked, I think, but then they had like a dozen archers that'd skewer any mage once he lost the invisibility. Then he'd be boned and move slow as shit with levitation.

Besides, Smaug was killed with an arrow, and Glaurung with a sword. There's nothing traditional about fighting dragons with spears. >:]

It ain't about tradition, it's about practicality. If something's bigger, it's got greater reach by default. You'd want to minimize that difference by having a weapon with greater reach.

[Wolf Tengu]

Wait, what's wrong with the game? Did something happen?

[shadenight123]

one time, games were made and published.
and if there were mistakes, new games were made and old games taken back.
patches were non existent. bugs were to be kept.
then patches were invented.
from there on developper got a little bit lazy.
"if the program works for the 99% of time, we publish it, if they complain we patch it"
then it went "for the 98%" then "97%" think about Elemental, the game. from the original game to the last patch, it changes the game COMPLETELY.
it's not pleasant, to spend 60$ for an "95%" complete game, or even less, but still, one may hope that patches should "fix" it. to at least a "99%" playability. (change percentages as you may see fit they are here only for simplicity purposes)
and games are made by humans, so humans tend to make mistake, which can however be corrected later. point is, it's not one can go and tell the gaming industry "until you make a perfect job the game cannot be published" because otherwise, you end up like Duke nukems last game case...hyped for centuries, pubblished with under the edge graphics, it was fun, it might also have been "duke" material, but still, it wasn't quite...good. had it been pubblished years before, even buggy, and then patched, it might have been better reviewed.