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Author Topic: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim  (Read 266053 times)

Neonivek

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2310 on: July 08, 2011, 03:37:33 pm »

Call me crazy but I DIDN'T like the Oblivion mechanic for magic weapons.

It felt like they ran on batteries.
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Virtz

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2311 on: July 08, 2011, 03:52:07 pm »

As for teleportation and levitation, just get over it already. I know, you just loved hovering around. But the fact is, being able to escape from places easily ruins a huge number of stories. They should never have been added in the first place.
A huge number of what? What stories? Like someone's description of them playing the game? Or one of the in-games books? I don't recall a book describing someone running away via levitation. What do you mean?

Also, if you want to disable someone from running away, then put a roof over their head, a magical barrier or have enemies that can dispell you and make you fall to your death. And you'd hardly be able to run away from someone who can fly after you (like I dunno, a dragon?) either way. Stop trying to justify crappy design decisions with unimaginative excuses.
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Soadreqm

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2312 on: July 08, 2011, 04:10:03 pm »

The answer mentioned that they were trying to make the various forms of combat actually feel different in a meaningful manner. In Morrowind, it didn't REALLY matter whether you had a sword or a spear. If you didn't have "use best attack" ticked, your footwork would be a bit different for each weapon, but what actually mattered was the damage output, not whether you could effectively attack while running toward of away from the enemy. It's trivial to add an arbitrary amount of weapons to a game where fighting is about grinding away each other's hit points. Apparently Skyrim is trying not to do that, so things are a bit harder. Spears would have been nice to have, but I totally understand the developers not bothering with them. They have a deadline and a budget to work with.

Levitating in Morrowind was amazing, but yeah, it kind of did break the game. It'd be difficult to properly integrate into the world, too. Telvanni towers are built by insane wizards for insane wizards, and feature several architectural choices that completely disregard gravity. If levitation was as easy to pull off as it is for the protagonist, a lot of places should be like that. Any fight with a powerful battlemage involved should be less pseudo-medieval fantasy and more Ender's Game.
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Jehdin

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2313 on: July 08, 2011, 06:06:37 pm »

Quote
Magic weapons use charges and have to be refilled with soul gems. Magic armor is always on and doesn’t need to be recharged. Soul gems and their lore and usage are a staple of the Elder Scrolls.

So, basically, they're saying "Soul gems are part of the lore so we had to use them for something."

I know what mod I'll be getting first.
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Shadowlord

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2314 on: July 08, 2011, 06:27:10 pm »

As for teleportation and levitation, just get over it already. I know, you just loved hovering around. But the fact is, being able to escape from places easily ruins a huge number of stories. They should never have been added in the first place.
A huge number of what? What stories? Like someone's description of them playing the game? Or one of the in-games books? I don't recall a book describing someone running away via levitation. What do you mean?

No, they mean stuff like "So, we're spawning like 8 super-deadly werewolves directly on top of the player, but those pesky players... They just use an enchanted item to instantly jump into the sky and then levitate up there and fireball them to death! Oooh that makes me SO MAD! We'll have to make sure they can't do that anymore in our future games!" Then for Skyrim, "We'd better make it double hard by only letting them make enchantments that they get from breaking down existing enchanted items, so that they'll never be able to make anything cool that we haven't already thought of and made, making enchantment completely safe for our design, but also completely boring." No more items that grant invisibility, health regen, or icarian flight (unless they include jumping / skill boosting items, and you can include multiple effects in one item). :(

(I, for one, was being instakilled by those werewolves in Solstheim until I just decided to solve the problem by going straight up at approximately the speed of sound the instant they spawned, and to stay up there until they were all dead. I was a mage and enchanter, not a tank. I couldn't fight 8 werewolves at point blank range. 1 was pushing it. I had to create new weapon enchantments just to be able to kill individual werewolves with short sword class weapons in melee combat.)
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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2315 on: July 08, 2011, 07:14:05 pm »

Levitating in Morrowind was amazing, but yeah, it kind of did break the game. It'd be difficult to properly integrate into the world, too. Telvanni towers are built by insane wizards for insane wizards, and feature several architectural choices that completely disregard gravity. If levitation was as easy to pull off as it is for the protagonist, a lot of places should be like that. Any fight with a powerful battlemage involved should be less pseudo-medieval fantasy and more Ender's Game.

My point exactly. If you're going to have a game about a universe were everyone can levitate at the drop of a hat, that's cool. But don't just slap levitation on top of a normal world and leave it at that.
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Yoink

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2316 on: July 09, 2011, 12:48:29 am »

I haven't read all of everyone's posts, seems like an interesting discussion but I don't have time to.
I just wanted to say, one of the things that really annoyed me about Oblivion, was the way you started off with some spells.
"Whaaat?!" I hear you say. "What's wrong with starting off with spells?! That's so incredibly minor compared to [insert perceived game-breaking fault here]!"
Well, it shoehorned you into playing some magical superhero character whether you liked it or not. Even if you DIDN'T intend to use those spells, they're always there... Calling to you... Whispering to you to use them whe you're in a jam. And more likely than not, when you're low on health and out of potions, you use 'em. I know I did, and it annoyed me, because suddenly my barbarian warrior, relying on his wits and his sword, is spewing out magic to make things a breeze.

I love the look of Skyrim, the world and combat and everything, but seems like you're still gonna be forced to play some uber magician. Sure, I get that your character has a mighty destiny to become a legendary hero, but does that mean you have to be able to fly and burp fireballs?! [/end rambling]
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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2317 on: July 09, 2011, 07:08:14 am »

Levitating in Morrowind was amazing, but yeah, it kind of did break the game. It'd be difficult to properly integrate into the world, too. Telvanni towers are built by insane wizards for insane wizards, and feature several architectural choices that completely disregard gravity. If levitation was as easy to pull off as it is for the protagonist, a lot of places should be like that. Any fight with a powerful battlemage involved should be less pseudo-medieval fantasy and more Ender's Game.

My point exactly. If you're going to have a game about a universe were everyone can levitate at the drop of a hat, that's cool. But don't just slap levitation on top of a normal world and leave it at that.

I'd say that a world with levitation should have non wizards equipped with bows and such as standard armament even if those are pure barbarians. Also, levitation is not that game ending in a world with dragons :D
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Sordid

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2318 on: July 09, 2011, 07:41:59 am »

Call me crazy but I DIDN'T like the Oblivion mechanic for magic weapons.

It felt like they ran on batteries.

Yeah, personally I hate that. Daggerfall was much better in this respect. Magic weapons just worked indefinitely, problem was getting them enchanted in the first place. Most materials had very few enchantment points, so the enchantments you could put on them were rather feeble. There were two ways out of that, either get a daedric weapon, and/or get a soul gem. Using a soul gem during enchanting gives you extra enchantment points, so you can put a more powerful enchantment on the item than you could without it. The only downside is that now that item is soul-bound, ie. if the item breaks, the creature whose soul you used is brought back to life and obviously not very happy about what you did to it. So if you have a sword enchanted with the soul of a daedra and no backup weapons and it breaks... good luck.
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Lysabild

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2319 on: July 09, 2011, 07:51:47 am »

Call me crazy but I DIDN'T like the Oblivion mechanic for magic weapons.

It felt like they ran on batteries.

Yeah, personally I hate that. Daggerfall was much better in this respect. Magic weapons just worked indefinitely, problem was getting them enchanted in the first place. Most materials had very few enchantment points, so the enchantments you could put on them were rather feeble. There were two ways out of that, either get a daedric weapon, and/or get a soul gem. Using a soul gem during enchanting gives you extra enchantment points, so you can put a more powerful enchantment on the item than you could without it. The only downside is that now that item is soul-bound, ie. if the item breaks, the creature whose soul you used is brought back to life and obviously not very happy about what you did to it. So if you have a sword enchanted with the soul of a daedra and no backup weapons and it breaks... good luck.

This sound much better than batteries.
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Karnewarrior

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2320 on: July 09, 2011, 08:05:08 am »

Call me crazy but I DIDN'T like the Oblivion mechanic for magic weapons.

It felt like they ran on batteries.

Yeah, personally I hate that. Daggerfall was much better in this respect. Magic weapons just worked indefinitely, problem was getting them enchanted in the first place. Most materials had very few enchantment points, so the enchantments you could put on them were rather feeble. There were two ways out of that, either get a daedric weapon, and/or get a soul gem. Using a soul gem during enchanting gives you extra enchantment points, so you can put a more powerful enchantment on the item than you could without it. The only downside is that now that item is soul-bound, ie. if the item breaks, the creature whose soul you used is brought back to life and obviously not very happy about what you did to it. So if you have a sword enchanted with the soul of a daedra and no backup weapons and it breaks... good luck.

This sound much better than batteries.
Especially when you soul-trap a dragon.
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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2321 on: July 09, 2011, 08:05:38 am »

Call me crazy but I DIDN'T like the Oblivion mechanic for magic weapons.

It felt like they ran on batteries.

Yeah, personally I hate that. Daggerfall was much better in this respect. Magic weapons just worked indefinitely, problem was getting them enchanted in the first place. Most materials had very few enchantment points, so the enchantments you could put on them were rather feeble. There were two ways out of that, either get a daedric weapon, and/or get a soul gem. Using a soul gem during enchanting gives you extra enchantment points, so you can put a more powerful enchantment on the item than you could without it. The only downside is that now that item is soul-bound, ie. if the item breaks, the creature whose soul you used is brought back to life and obviously not very happy about what you did to it. So if you have a sword enchanted with the soul of a daedra and no backup weapons and it breaks... good luck.

This sound much better than batteries.
Especially when you soul-trap a dragon.
I wonder if it would be possible to mod this in the game.
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anzki4

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2322 on: July 09, 2011, 08:14:09 am »

Speaking about Daggerfall, this looks great.
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Vibhor

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2323 on: July 09, 2011, 09:40:46 am »

Speaking about Daggerfall, this looks great.

Meh,I have been following that for ages. It is going to take atleast 3 full years to get it working the way he wants to.
What I really want is a remake of daggerfall with modern capabilities. Mod support, 3d polygonal graphics, better randomly generated worlds etc with the gameplay intact(minorly updated to go with modern systems like smoother mouse movement, better controls. Thats it)
The combat system would do surprisingly well in this day because of the whole analog stick thingy
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Sergius

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Re: Elder scrolls V: Skyrim
« Reply #2324 on: July 09, 2011, 01:30:20 pm »

Maybe Daggerfall would benefit from one of those fractal terrain generators that work on-the-fly.

The pseudorandom dungeons could use a LOT of improvement, I would definitely not reuse the ones generated in the original (or the algorithm used to create them).
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