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[Duke 2.0]

Also, good job twisting a clearly negative change into something "positive", guys. Going by the philosophy of "if it's imbalanced, remove it instead of balancing it" is never a good thing.

Oh fallacies.

 I'm with HLBeta on this, while the lack of customization is sad it was kinda poorly done in every previous installment. I embrace a change that makes mages more exciting to play casually instead of minning and maxing breaking of the system.

[3]

Bethesda's modding support ain't about restricting access to things, it's about giving access to the things the content developers use in a more accessible form. If all the spells are pre-made, then chances are the spells are hard-coded, with no accessible way of changing them.

My point exactly.

[Vibhor]

Really now people are defending why the removal of custom spells is good for the game?
At this rate, by the next few installments, they would have removed any sense of non linearity and just give you a sword, a shield and a healing spell(an offensive spell too if they are feeling lucky) and ask you to run down a few long ass corridors. I see where the Fable inspiration is going.

[Duke 2.0]

At this rate,

Frictionless Incline much?

 I will leave a little something for valid comparison though.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[HLBeta]

Really now people are defending why the removal of custom spells is good for the game?
At this rate, by the next few installments, they would have removed any sense of non linearity and just give you a sword, a shield and a healing spell(an offensive spell too if they are feeling lucky) and ask you to run down a few long ass corridors. I see where the Fable inspiration is going.

At least in Fable, a pure mage was fun to play. Oblivion's customization was so wonky and tedious that it actually managed to remove the fun from shooting lightning at fools. I have awful memories of having to spend 10+ minutes of my precious and limited lifespan killing one zombie, so you can take your reductio ad absurdum and stuff it. Magic was not fun in Oblivion. Magic was not fun in Morrowind. The established magic system of TES is fundamentally unfun. I personally appreciate their acknowledgement that the feature is dysfunctional and welcome their attempt to fix it.

[MorleyDev]

In Morrowind I found it possible and fun to play as a pure mage. Admittedly it made it very hard to start, but mages should be harder to start with...and it was expensive. The whole "spells cost money to learn" thing in Morrowind, whilst it makes sense (you're paying to be taught how to cast the spell) it is a tad frustrating when your broke at the start. Of course the economy soon gets fucked up and you become a god unto the tax payer, but hey selling artefacts in Tribunal would do that...

I would have liked more consequences for spell failure, like if you fail to summon a Dremora they might still be summoned but turn on you or if you fail a fire spell it exploded at you, but hey I like a challenge like that. After it was modded into Oblivion I found that there's something satisfying hilarious about finding yourself so out of your depth as to risk summoning something you aren't at all capable of, on the off-chance it saves your hide, only for it to join forces with your enemy and kill you...then turn on the enemy after you're dead xD

Then again I'm fundementally *not* a min-maxer. I like to play as a completely broke build, my favourite playthrough of Morrowind was actually with an orc that used only magic ^^ And if I find something makes the game completely unbalanced, like maxed out in magnitude drain magicka on self  1 second (which instantly replenished your magicka) then I usually avoid that thing...

Oblivion's entire enemy levelling system was fundamentally broken though...

[Ivefan]

Really now people are defending why the removal of custom spells is good for the game?
At this rate, by the next few installments, they would have removed any sense of non linearity and just give you a sword, a shield and a healing spell(an offensive spell too if they are feeling lucky) and ask you to run down a few long ass corridors. I see where the Fable inspiration is going.

At least in Fable, a pure mage was fun to play. Oblivion's customization was so wonky and tedious that it actually managed to remove the fun from shooting lightning at fools. I have awful memories of having to spend 10+ minutes of my precious and limited lifespan killing one zombie, so you can take your reductio ad absurdum and stuff it. Magic was not fun in Oblivion. Magic was not fun in Morrowind. The established magic system of TES is fundamentally unfun. I personally appreciate their acknowledgement that the feature is dysfunctional and welcome their attempt to fix it.

I often ended up cheating because combat in general was rather dull. I was in it for the sights and the phat lootz(which never where 'phat' in oblivion) and exploiting game mechanics and magic was the most suitable tool then.

[Jehdin]

I have to agree that the magic system in the previous TES games was terrible.

From what I've seen, it seems that spells in Skyrim will scale with your level of skill in that spell's school of magic. Meaning spellmaking as it was in the previous games would be damn near worthless as half the point of that system was to make a spell worth having at high levels and the other half was to make a SPELL OF AWESOME INSTANT WINNINGNESS, which, while fun, is not something I feel is necessary to make the game enjoyable as a whole.

I'm not saying the lack of spellmaking is a good thing, but I can see why it was cut. It just wouldn't be as useful as it was in previous games without completely remaking the system and broadening its capabilities. And I'm sure that would have taken a good chunk of development time, that's what it really comes down to, "How much time will it take to implement?", "How many people will use it?", "Is this a necessary feature?", "Should we work on this instead of x or y?"
Fact is, things have to get cut so they have time to implement more necessary/popular features and still make their deadlines. Without that we get Duke Nukem TES: Forever.

[Vibhor]

I have to agree that the magic system in the previous TES games was terrible.

Really? Can you show example of brilliant magic system?
There is not really a lot to compare to so it cannot be terrible.

[Jehdin]

I have to agree that the magic system in the previous TES games was terrible.

Really? Can you show example of brilliant magic system?
There is not really a lot to compare to so it cannot be terrible.

Not having a lot to compare it to doesn't mean it's good. Not a lot you can compare to Spore, for example, but is it good?

From what I've seen of Skyrim's it certainly looks like a step in the right direction. Even Fable's magic system was better than the previous TES games'.
As for brilliant... There is no magic system in any game so far that I would call brilliant.

[Draignean]

I have to agree that the magic system in the previous TES games was terrible.

Really? Can you show example of brilliant magic system?
There is not really a lot to compare to so it cannot be terrible.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9562

That, or the geomancy system that also got modded in. All midas needed was a bit of balancing in and a lot more of those spells in the cast list for NPC mages.

[Vibhor]

I have to agree that the magic system in the previous TES games was terrible.

Really? Can you show example of brilliant magic system?
There is not really a lot to compare to so it cannot be terrible.

http://www.tesnexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9562

That, or the geomancy system that also got modded in. All midas needed was a bit of balancing in and a lot more of those spells in the cast list for NPC mages.

If I remember correctly these spells fucked the game over its knees. The pumpkin atronach was so OP that you could complete the whole game without lifting a finger. Though one thing I agree that the spells had more variety but that still doesn't justify the removal of custom spells.

[Draignean]

They did indeed, although I would have cited stone crush or meteor, not the pumpkin king. They are not balanced, they are not a justification of why there should be no custom spells, they are an example of a brilliant magic system.

[Vibhor]

They did indeed, although I would have cited stone crush or meteor, not the pumpkin king. They are not balanced, they are not a justification of why there should be no custom spells, they are an example of a brilliant magic system.

Actually if they manage to add variety to the spells in game then I would excuse any mistake they make about the spell system but considering the whole dual wielding overcharge bullshit I am guessing that they will have the generic fireball, ice blast, thunderbolt selection of spells.

[Yoink]

I never really liked the magic business, nor did I like the setting of Morrowind or Oblivion.
Skyrim, with less magic and a better setting, as well as awesome combat, is pretty well set to make me happy, no matter what you 'high-up game critic types' think of it.
Each to their own, I guess.