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Author Topic: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea  (Read 39572 times)

Azzuro

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #180 on: November 24, 2010, 09:45:58 pm »

Secondly, Iraqi's did welcome the US, flag waving and calling the US liberators.  No staging necessary.  The insurgency was mainly Iran/Syria motivated and it started well after Iraq was "conquered".  To even say the US and allies are still fighting the Iraqi war is a joke.  They are at war with Syria/Iran by proxy. and Russia/China by sub-proxy, since they backup Iran and Syria.

China is most likely behind the shelling of the island in South Korea (IMO).  They are beginning to exert their military influence in the region and are testing the US's resolve to protect Korea and Japan and what resources we might bring to bear.  If the Korea's were to return to war, the North would immediatly be protected by China, who is deeply in bed with the Norths government so that they can stripmine all the coal out of N Korea.  On a side note, China hates the North Korean peoples and could care less if they died whole sale in a war.

Firstly, the Iraq war and a hypothetical war with North Korea are two different things. In Iraq, the people were aware that they were oppressed, and they were aware that there were better things in the outside world. Iraq was a dictatorship, but the government didn't make much effort to suppress the flow of information about the outside world. In contrast, North Koreans have lived their entire lives believing that Kim was a literal god on earth, and they hardly know anything of the West besides knowing that they are evil, etc. Every single North Korean would willingly take up arms and fight a resistance movement against an occupying army.

Secondly, I find it hard to believe that China would shell an island and provoke another Korean war. China's top priority regarding Southeast Asia, Central Asia, and pretty much anywhere in its sphere of influence is stability. China does not wish to provoke war because that would undermine regional stability, which would in turn affect investments in China's economy. There seems to be much of a misconception in the US that China would want to take all of Asia for itself. There is no reason why China would want to 'exert their military influence in the region' because that would intimidate smaller nations, which would then view China as an oppressor. Chinese diplomacy does not hinge on displays of military might, they prefer to lead other nations into prosperity, therefore giving them possible allies.

To add on, China is not 'in bed with the Norths government' since the nuclear tests in 2006. While before they might have provided aid to North Korea simply to keep the regime from falling (and the subsequent blow to regional stability that would cause), now they are beginning to view North Korea as an active threat to stability in East Asia. Now, China would not enter a war on North Korea's side for any reason (other than perhaps territorial gain). Likely the only thing they would do in the war would be to repatriate North Korean refugees fleeing across the China border.
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Leafsnail

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #181 on: November 24, 2010, 09:46:21 pm »

Okay, it's good to get information from people who actually know what's going on over there.  Thank you!
No idea if that was sarcasm or not, but I'm pretty sure Gorjo knows more than us considering he's spent 1.5 years over there.
With all due respect... I think this is a false appeal to authority.  Being in the south doesn't mean you necessarily know any better if it's secretly all being controlled by China, or if there aren't actually that many artillery pieces in the north.
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #182 on: November 24, 2010, 09:48:13 pm »


Quote
To add on, China is not 'in bed with the Norths government' since the nuclear tests in 2006. While before they might have provided aid to North Korea simply to keep the regime from falling (and the subsequent blow to regional stability that would cause), now they are beginning to view North Korea as an active threat to stability in East Asia. Now, China would not enter a war on North Korea's side for any reason (other than perhaps territorial gain). Likely the only thing they would do in the war would be to repatriate North Korean refugees fleeing across the China border.

Did you see this bit?

http://www.cfr.org/publication/11097/chinanorth_korea_relationship.html
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Criptfeind

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #183 on: November 24, 2010, 09:49:35 pm »


Quote
To add on, China is not 'in bed with the Norths government' since the nuclear tests in 2006. While before they might have provided aid to North Korea simply to keep the regime from falling (and the subsequent blow to regional stability that would cause), now they are beginning to view North Korea as an active threat to stability in East Asia. Now, China would not enter a war on North Korea's side for any reason (other than perhaps territorial gain). Likely the only thing they would do in the war would be to repatriate North Korean refugees fleeing across the China border.

Did you see this bit?

http://www.cfr.org/publication/11097/chinanorth_korea_relationship.html

Did you read your own link?
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kuro_suna

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #184 on: November 24, 2010, 09:55:26 pm »

China only supports North Korea because they know that if the government collapses it won't be pretty, probably end up like Somalia.
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darkrider2

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #185 on: November 24, 2010, 10:01:28 pm »

Okay, it's good to get information from people who actually know what's going on over there.  Thank you!
No idea if that was sarcasm or not, but I'm pretty sure Gorjo knows more than us considering he's spent 1.5 years over there.
With all due respect... I think this is a false appeal to authority.  Being in the south doesn't mean you necessarily know any better if it's secretly all being controlled by China, or if there aren't actually that many artillery pieces in the north.

I got this out of a book, MARINE! (that book with chesty puller). But it says that massive amounts of troops were able to hide from our spy planes by wearing hats that were the same color as the rice paddies they were walking on. Also some tank crews keep bottles of spray paint inside the tank, they can use it to re-camouflage themselves in short time. Hiding artillery pieces doesn't sound so far fetched to me.

They may not have the resources that we do, but that doesn't mean they aren't resourceful.
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RedWarrior0

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #186 on: November 24, 2010, 10:02:59 pm »

China only supports North Korea because they know that if the government collapses it won't be pretty, probably end up like Somalia.
Right. If you were China and had to choose between your biggest trade partner (unverified) who owes you several trillion and the next door neighbor who's batshit insane, who do you ally with?
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ChairmanPoo

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #187 on: November 24, 2010, 10:07:28 pm »


Quote
To add on, China is not 'in bed with the Norths government' since the nuclear tests in 2006. While before they might have provided aid to North Korea simply to keep the regime from falling (and the subsequent blow to regional stability that would cause), now they are beginning to view North Korea as an active threat to stability in East Asia. Now, China would not enter a war on North Korea's side for any reason (other than perhaps territorial gain). Likely the only thing they would do in the war would be to repatriate North Korean refugees fleeing across the China border.

Did you see this bit?

http://www.cfr.org/publication/11097/chinanorth_korea_relationship.html

Did you read your own link?

Yes- and apparently you didn't, or read only the bits you liked. Read it again, please.
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kuro_suna

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #188 on: November 24, 2010, 10:08:15 pm »

North Korea has no economy, no infrastructure and a brainwashed and destitute population.
North Korea's greatest defense is being a turd nobody wants to touch with a 10 foot pole.
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Realmfighter

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #189 on: November 24, 2010, 10:08:51 pm »

A turd filled with high explosives.
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Criptfeind

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #190 on: November 24, 2010, 10:12:45 pm »

I read it again. Still saying what he said.

Are you agreeing with the guy you quoted? I thought not but clues is so hard to understand over the internet.
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Sir Finkus

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #191 on: November 24, 2010, 10:12:54 pm »

I have been doing my best to avoid this thread, but too much bad information has been tossed about concerning N Koreas artillery and capability to strike Seoul.  They only have a single type of piece capable, and very few of them are in range of Seoul.  They are designed to be mobile, but the current locations are well documented by all concerened goverments.  Satellites are a wonderful thing.

Secondly, Iraqi's did welcome the US, flag waving and calling the US liberators.  No staging necessary.  The insurgency was mainly Iran/Syria motivated and it started well after Iraq was "conquered".  To even say the US and allies are still fighting the Iraqi war is a joke.  They are at war with Syria/Iran by proxy. and Russia/China by sub-proxy, since they backup Iran and Syria.

China is most likely behind the shelling of the island in South Korea (IMO).  They are beginning to exert their military influence in the region and are testing the US's resolve to protect Korea and Japan and what resources we might bring to bear.  If the Korea's were to return to war, the North would immediatly be protected by China, who is deeply in bed with the Norths government so that they can stripmine all the coal out of N Korea.  On a side note, China hates the North Korean peoples and could care less if they died whole sale in a war.

For those who want info on the Norths ability to make war:
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?162240-Bluffer-s-Guide-North-Korea-strikes!-%282009%29

Full Disclosure:
I spent 1.5 years in South Korea while serving in the US military.
I am hawkish by nature.
More to come if i think of it.

Very interesting information, thanks for sharing. I'd seen maps of North Korea before, and I made some assumptions about their artillery capabilities.  I still wouldn't make any bets based on google maps though, and I highly doubt China is behind the attacks, especially since North Korea admits to firing the shots.

:Edit: If any of you haven't seen North Korea uncovered before, I'd suggest you check it out.  It's rather interesting.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2010, 10:15:36 pm by Sir Finkus »
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kuro_suna

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #192 on: November 24, 2010, 10:16:56 pm »


Quote
To add on, China is not 'in bed with the Norths government' since the nuclear tests in 2006. While before they might have provided aid to North Korea simply to keep the regime from falling (and the subsequent blow to regional stability that would cause), now they are beginning to view North Korea as an active threat to stability in East Asia. Now, China would not enter a war on North Korea's side for any reason (other than perhaps territorial gain). Likely the only thing they would do in the war would be to repatriate North Korean refugees fleeing across the China border.

Did you see this bit?

http://www.cfr.org/publication/11097/chinanorth_korea_relationship.html

Did you read your own link?

Yes- and apparently you didn't, or read only the bits you liked. Read it again, please.

form the link

Quote
China is North Korea's most important ally;
this doesn't mean North Korea is China's most important ally
just China is the only country that puts up with them

Quote
after Pyongyang tested a nuclear weapon in October 2006, experts say that China has reconsidered the nature of its alliance to include both pressure and inducements. North Korea's second nuclear test in May 2009 further complicated its relationship

Quote
China also agreed to stricter sanctions after Pyongyang's second nuclear test in May 2009. Alan Romberg, a former U.S. State Department official with the Henry L. Stimson Center in Washington, told TIME, "Pyongyang has spit in the [People's Republic of China's] eye." Despite their long alliance, experts say Beijing does not control Pyongyang. "In general, Americans tend to overestimate the influence China has over North Korea,"

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Luke_Prowler

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #193 on: November 24, 2010, 10:26:34 pm »

Okay, it's good to get information from people who actually know what's going on over there.  Thank you!
No idea if that was sarcasm or not, but I'm pretty sure Gorjo knows more than us considering he's spent 1.5 years over there.
With all due respect... I think this is a false appeal to authority.  Being in the south doesn't mean you necessarily know any better if it's secretly all being controlled by China, or if there aren't actually that many artillery pieces in the north.
Appeal to authority only applies if the authority is someone elses. One's own experiences is perfectly legal.
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Akura

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Re: North Korea fired artillery shells at South Korea
« Reply #194 on: November 24, 2010, 10:27:01 pm »

Wait, who said jungle warfare?
Korea's mountainous is it not?
Mountainous jungle, I think.
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