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[Scood]

probably 8 points since it takes up 8 hexes... the jetstream may be several times more points depending on the size of the stream

[lemon10]

urk, my photobucket is acting stupid (and shrinking the picture to like 100 pixels for no reason), so ill save my points for next round

[monk12]

probably 8 points since it takes up 8 hexes... the jetstream may be several times more points depending on the size of the stream

That is the reason for my master flying turtle plan- if the island can move under its own power, I don't have to make a jet stream and can spend more time turning the air into wood!

[Scood]

even still the turtle would be more like a living creature...a race or an avatar and require more points per tile than it costs to alter the landscape per tile...i don't think moving continents is a feasable plan.

[lemon10]

Yeah, a giant turtle that size would be a avatar probably, or you could make it a race (with each one 1"), and have them breed, so they could work together to move it.

[monk12]

even still the turtle would be more like a living creature...a race or an avatar and require more points per tile than it costs to alter the landscape per tile...i don't think moving continents is a feasable plan.

Clearly you do not realize what kind of God I am.

Yeah, a giant turtle that size would be a avatar probably, or you could make it a race (with each one 1"), and have them breed, so they could work together to move it.

I suppose the situation is that I want there to be an immortal flying turtle the size of Madagascar which eternally crosses the world for no special reason, with neither plan nor purpose. It doesn't do any of the things other avatars do and is not beholden to any god any more than a regular island would be, but by the same token it is a unique feature of the world and not something that inhabits it, and is arguably not alive. For all intents and purposes it is an island, merely an island that happens to fly, and is shaped like a turtle.

This conundrum reminds me of the debates in high school biology about whether a Virus is alive. Thus, I present the following link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life#Definitions

I will now attempt to further define what the turtle IS.

1.) Homeostasis- Fail. The turtle does not regulate itself. If you mine through the turtle you will not be attacked by flying turtle white blood cells, although I may create such a race to preserve the turtle.

2.) Organization- Pass. The turtle, under the layers of rock and dirt, is composed of cells like a regular turtle. The cells never seem to change, grow, need energy, produce waste, or die, but they are cells. Little immortal turtle cells.

3.) Metabolism- Fail. The turtle does not need external sources of energy to maintain itself. This also implies that the turtle breaks the first law of thermodynamics, since it can somehow produce the energy to drag itself across the sky against the winds without consuming anything. Theoretically, a crafty civilization could harness the turtle for free energy.

4.) Growth- Fail. The turtle does not grow or heal.

5.) Adaptation- Fail. Being the only one of its kind and also unable to reproduce, the turtle does not evolve.

6.) Responds to stimuli- Pass. The turtle can chart a course across the sky- therefore it must be able to react to external forces for course correction.

7.) Reproduction- Fail. The turtle does not reproduce.

By my count, the turtle fails to be alive by a margin of 5:7, with a count of 'Making Physics Cry' thrown in for good measure. So what the hell is it- an immortal race of one creature, a fairly lifeless avatar, or a surprisingly lively hunk of matter?

[Scood]

we arnt arguing whether it is alive... its just that everytime the island does move it would require a total of 16 power points 8 to remove island from map, 8 to place it somewhere else, and that number would increase as the game progresses for instance, it takes 16 point to move the island now because it is the first age, but when we get to the 2nd and 3rd age it would take 80 and 128 points respectively. its not feasable. creating an avatar would be far easier. even for a god moving a continent aint easy

[lemon10]

from what i gathered, the island wanders randomly because of a strong air current (assuming its not using the giant turtle), so each turn it would move a bit, but it would be unpredictable, and you would only need to do it once.
A avatar would allow you to control it

[Scood]

thats not right, thats like editing one hex to have a viral plant and that every turn it spreads to the surrounding hex's. In reality u are altering more hex's than you are paying for.

[monk12]

The idea was that the turtle would fly in circles endlessly, not needing extra winds or risking blowing off course. The turtle doesn't do anything to alter what's beneath it, apart from blocking out the sun for a bit. It just floats, as opposed to some kind of  Shape Land Pseudopod locomotion. Since it neither creates nor destroys any other land, I didn't feel that it was a form of continuous Shape Land usage.

I think I may just go back to the original jet stream idea to save time and discussion, though.

Incidentally, who all are we waiting on?

[Furtuka]

i think bowdown, grey, and xanatos

[grey9]

yah cut me out, I think i will just observe

[bowdown2q]

Oh my. Yeah, moving land =/= recreating creating it. I'd say just a single use of edit terrain, making fly around (as has been done). Giant turtle has significantly less potential impact than an avatar (as it can't make people gen armies, etc.) pppffffttt... given your argument of it being non-alive, it's functionally identical to a turtle-shaped piece of land with a GPS. . as for mapping, imma just put a turtle under that island and leave it in the corner to save map space.

Imma say change land once more to turn it into a turtle-thing. Said object is to be considered weird terrain, and nothing more.

Also, due to the size of the map and #players, I'm upping the points to 3d6 as of next turn. I'm waiting on Xanatos to post, i believe.

Will update the map (without the shitty sprites in the middle) after my turn. Also: does anybody know of a way/place for images that preserves layers? If every edit was its own layer, it would make life easier for me to update the map.

Edit: Xanatos will not be joining us. I'll post my turn and edited map tonight, sometime, unless I pass out.

[monk12]

Hoorah for turtle islands! I would just copy the outline of it and move it around at random so we know which random bit of land it is floating over. In case it comes up. Not that I'm saying it will or that I have very specific plans related to coincidental positions of the flying turtle island.

I also propose that we implement an "update every 4 days" system or something, so that we don't end up waiting forever for other folks to update.

[ragnarok97071]

I would prefer 'every day unless you have a REALLY good reason', but that's because I am a bit impatient, and we need to make up for lost time.