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[Monsterfurby]

Well, since it has been demonstrated that building a computing mechanism in DF is possible, wouldn't it theoretically be possible to make the game develop itself? Using cats, catapults and magma?

Also, if anyone has ever tried (like me) to actually reassemble all the information in Legends mode into a coherent narrative on a global scale, I think it is safe to say that in DF, developer DDoS-attacks you.

[breadbocks]

I've seen the Minecraft forums, and I don't think I've ever seen a gaming forum more full of trolls and childish whiners elves. On the other hand, I've never seen a fan-base as fantastic as the DF community (sociopaths notwithstanding). Comparing the two is unimaginable.

And yet, somewhere (Read: On infiniminer) I heard the Natch said he intended Minecraft to be Infiniminer with DF.

I cried.

[Max White]

1: I'm sure toady gets some Emails every now and then from angry people who can't wait for an update, but from what I can see its water off hes back. Thats not to say you can do it, but still, I think toady is a bigger man then that.

2: No we do not have the right to act like this at all! We, as clients, can not demand something we do not have a closed contract for, that simple. Nor should we! Ok, there is a slight differance in that minecraft players pay for the full game, so have a little more right to ask for updates, but not enough to demand, and certainly not enough for a DDoS.

WE however, living off Toadys hand outs, have no right to demand, DDoS, or even ask for updates. What ever we get is because of toadys kindness and love of the game, as the same with our donations. For us to attack Toady would be an outright sin.

3: Yes, I would battle wave after wave of angry, immature kid, doing my best to calm them down and explain that they shouldn't be angry with Toady or Bay 12, they should be happy with what they have.


You have to remember, these ARE minecraft players that hosted this DDoS, were talking about people that want to play DF but can't because there not smart enough to navigate the interface, so there stuch drinking strange brown liquid rather then a fine rich coffie, so to speek. 

[Zrk2]

I really don't think there will ever be a need to defend him but if there is he will have my bestest trollering ever.

Srsly whenever I have had to ask him for help he has been just fine and I can see no reason for anyone to be a dick to him.

[The Merchant Of Menace]

Has anyone ever needed a legitimate reason to be a dick?

[plynxis]

Has anyone ever needed a legitimate reason to be a dick?

+2

its funny to see a thread like this because i started playing DF because i read about it somewhere (wikipedia, tvtropes? cant remember) and was drawn to it because of how super hard it was made out to be (not really though, but still much harder than most games - refreshingly so) so i actually expected people who play it to be a lot more serious and mature than the average game forumer. suprisingly i was right (because that wasnt a good argument). and i'm glad i was. gone are the days of wow forums (a game i ditched because it sucks monkeyfuck), retarded 14yr olds and others that cant stand a challenge if it meant their life and game developers that try to pander to these morons so much that their games end up sucking more ass than they did to begin with. my brother plays league of legends and he doesnt hear the end of it - he tells me himself, like 95% of the players (no different from wow and shit) are fucking assholes, calling literally everyone in the game noobs, never learning anything about how to play it even though they have more than a thousand games under their belt and keep whining about losing on the forums because everything is OP or IMBA and shit (though believe me, some electronics forums are so much worse you wouldn't believe what goes on there...).

what it boils down to is, some people want to juice stones while most just want the juice fed to them intravenously. fuck them, i'd rather savescum, bug-report, look at ascii characters and die fps deaths anyday than insult myself by playing braindead games where morons that cant spell can succeed as much as people who are actually trying and know where their country is on the map.

[breadbocks]

I'm shocked and appalled that no one has made a Gieco ad joke yet.

*Manly Voice*

Could switching to Gieco save you 15% or more on car insurance?

Would Bay12 forumites defend Toady One?

Troll from under the bridge: We have begun DDoS attacking Bay12 due to la- ARG!!!

(A bunch of curiously short and well bearded people charge out carrying strange blue dual-bladed axen charge out and attack Troll from under the bridge.)

[Max White]

What it boils down to is, some people want to juice stones while most just want the juice fed to them intravenously. fuck them, i'd rather savescum, bug-report, look at ascii characters and die fps deaths anyday than insult myself by playing braindead games where morons that cant spell can succeed as much as people who are actually trying and know where their country is on the map.

Can we get this engraved on the wall by the enterance to the forums?

[DwarfFortress]

To be honest, it saddens me to see so much hate for minecraft.  Had you been there this time last year the community was great.  Not as civilized as this one, but just as nice and cooperative.  It was really refreshing.

Then it became more popular and it went downhill...

Now it really is a cesspool.  There are still good users, many of the same from the begining, but they are far outwayed by the trolls and complainers.  Most of them don't even realize the difference between voicing and opinion and being a dick is.  Almost every topic these days (Not even exagerrating) degrades into screaming fits by people complaining that the game doesn't get updated enough/is too hard/is unfair/has glitches from the updates he rushes to please them/etc.

http://notch.tumblr.com/

That is his blog, check out the comments.  75% are complaining of lack of updates or there not being enough in the updates.

I sincerely hope this game never gets that popular.  I would rather it stayed a fringe game and kept its friendly community.  Once it becomes popular, we will degrade into minecraft's community.  :\

Minecraft itself is a gem though.  Comparing it to brown water is far from accurate, it is just different than DF.  Apples and oranges, but both masterpieces in their own right.

[breadbocks]

The above is very true. Pretty much Hipsters/Hippies (No, not Elves) have it right. Only the fringe stuff is worth playing/listening to/seeing.

[Max White]

The above is very true. Pretty much Hipsters/Hippies (No, not Elves) have it right. Only the fringe stuff is worth playing/listening to/seeing.

Oh come now, that isn't always true. Take splunkey for example! Another indie game that uses procedual algorithems to generate a 'random' world to explore, and also has an underground theme to it, similar to both minecraft and DF, and it has hit big. So much so that it is currently being developed for the Xbox360 platform. It has had referances made to it from several other indie games, and is one of the most popular free games out these days.

Far from fringe, in other words.

And it is still a great game and VERY worth playing, for many hours on end, and then again the next day. It also has a reletivly good community (Not realy DF standard, but you can have a relaxed conversation there) and the semi-regular updates are enough to keep people happy. This is even more impressive when you take into account that how splunkey presents itself is far more accsessable to kids, yet still it holds out.

We can't just say popular = bad.

[breadbocks]

Hmm... *looks into massive "My Games" folder and sees Spelunky* true... But it is still a fairly decent rule-of-thumb.

[nbonaparte]

DF will never get a playerbase that large. Minecraft exploded because it's addictive. The gameplay is relatively simple, aside from things like redstone and minecarts. DF is... different. the type of player likely to be incapable of seeing the difference between asking a question and being a dick isn't likely to be drawn by DF. Even later in the development cycle, when there's a real interface, it's still damn complex.

[Max White]

Hmm... *looks into massive "My Games" folder and sees Spelunky* true... But it is still a fairly decent rule-of-thumb.

Well lets do a quick analysis then.
DF, an semiregularly updated indie game that is notibly challenging involving going underground: Good gameplay and good community.
Splunky , an semiregularly updated indie game that is notibly challenging involving going underground: Good gameplay and good community.
Minecraft, an semiregularly updated indie game that is notibly easy involving going underground: Alright gameplay and poor community.

See I think it is less about how well known a game is, and more to do with the game itself. A harder game will encorage a more mature community who look for the challenge, rather then the childish feeling of being told 'YOU ROCK!!!' on every win screen. The reason why so many mainstream games such is because companys don't like to gamble on harder games, while indie games love nothing more then gaking the hardest game they can.

What we need isn't to spend half our time looking through tones of half decent fringe games for a few gems, we need the games industry to man up and start making games because there good, not because they will sell.

[breadbocks]

The problem is, America is spawning more 7 year old gamers then can grow up to mature into gamers who enjoy a challenge. So, the gaming industry has no choice but to put out PoS easy games to not fall into bankruptcy. The reason I think fringe games are the best is because generally, they are harder (Think La-Mulana) and so scare away the lame children who couldn't get past level 1 on Donkey Kong. In effect, fringe games end up being fringe because they are usually so hard, and them being fringe becomes a sort of a at-a-glance difficulty/community maturity gauge.