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Author Topic: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]  (Read 48978 times)

JanusTwoface

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #330 on: November 04, 2010, 05:22:49 pm »

JTF, this is actually a pretty interesting mafia variant, but it suffered pretty obviously from people not sending in their assists during the day. I think people just like the idea of sending it in the night a lot more.

So I'm going to suggest a two phase night, where apprentices can send in their support, and then the sorcerers get to use their actions.

Because getting people off their asses during the day is just too much work apparently.

It'd probably work, but it makes the night much longer.  I can't really justify giving less than 24 hours for any phase.

Optimally, people would just remember to send in their assists during the day...
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Zathras

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #331 on: November 04, 2010, 05:35:39 pm »

CRAP! I knew at the last minute those two were playing me. Damn the rest of the town to leave me alone at the last. Still, it wouldn't have happened any other way, as they would never have come together to hang Org or Irony, which were the only other choices.
In my experience, as a townie, you should basically never change your vote within the last few hours of the day.  That's when scum try to pull their gambits to lynch townies.  If anything, it should have confirmed Org and Jetsquirrel as scum. [...] Which is part of the problem... Townies shouldn't participate in 11th hour lynches.  Makes finding the scums job *much* easier when they do.

Yes. If I learned anything from this game, this is it. In retrospect, I should have unvoted, or called for an extension. I don't like to do that, as it just moves the deadline to the next time people have classes or homework or lives or whatever, instead of solving anything, but in this case it would have left evidence of JS/Org's concerted play.

Lesson learned.


Quote from: Janus
You should have claimed white sorcerer, gotten support, and keeping Org and everyone else in Sanctuary would prevent you from being NK'd! Crap, you could have won this almost singlehandedly!
Yes, that would have been an awesome strategy.  That's the main thing stopping the game from ending when there are equal scum and town.  The problem is that it only works if there are three Apprentices to support him.

It would have been awesome indeed. Loud raspberry to Eduren's lack of balls to suggest it. I'm reasonably sure enough support would have been gathered, moreso because his play hadn't been scummy at all. Only Irony had been going after him, and looked scummier in the process.


Quote from: Janus
And IronyOwl didn't assist day 2 either... Jim was Org's second supporter.

Jim, why did you support red N2? You trusted my claim for white, and you seemed to trust I was town; did you really think red was town too, or that I had supported the scum school by mistake?


So I'm going to suggest a two phase night, where apprentices can send in their support, and then the sorcerers get to use their actions.

I disagree with this. Games are slow enough as it is, and extending the locked down period only encourages lurkers. Maybe if the support was posted on thread instead of PM'd, like in WD, but even then I'd rather the town got off their asses and supported on their own. Perhaps listing on the votecount who has sent support? Send "none" if you don't want to support, but if you just forget it will be recorded in the votecount.
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Mr.Person

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #332 on: November 04, 2010, 05:39:29 pm »

I love how my scum picks were exactly right.

Instead of all that confusing junk, you could give the sorcerer a single night action and just make it better based on how many assists were given during the night. For example:

White Sorcerer:
No assists: Cantrip (no effect)
1 assist: Minor Protection (target can't be killed by Dark Wizards)
2 assists: Major Protection (target can't be killed by anything. Delayed kills still happen, however)
3 assists: Sanctuary (Sorcerer and target can't be targeted by anybody else. Note that the target can affect the White Sorcerer. If this seems kind of weak, make the players remain in Sanctuary for the rest of the game together)

Another thing you could do is just make the assists the night actions and the Sorcerer's stuff all day actions.

I was honestly expecting all the Sorcerers to be town. 9p with 3 scum, one of which is a PR seems more than a bit too unfair for the town, especially now that I've found out that if anybody else assisted Org, he'd have gotten a second nightkill and we'd of instantly lost.
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IronyOwl

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #333 on: November 04, 2010, 05:43:47 pm »

I love how my scum picks were exactly right.
Doesn't matter if you can't do anything with it.

Instead of all that confusing junk, you could give the sorcerer a single night action and just make it better based on how many assists were given during the night.
That'd be boring. It'd also be problematic in some cases, since every effect would need 3 different, viable strengths to exist.
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IronyOwl

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #334 on: November 04, 2010, 05:52:56 pm »

Also, half the players were lurking, town lost a PR day one, and everyone forgot to assist. It's really hard to say how over the top 3 Dark Sorcerers are from this, since so much else went wrong/weird.
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Jim Groovester

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #335 on: November 04, 2010, 07:31:06 pm »

Jim, why did you support red N2? You trusted my claim for white, and you seemed to trust I was town; did you really think red was town too, or that I had supported the scum school by mistake?

For lack of a better option I assisted Red again.
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Org

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #336 on: November 04, 2010, 07:47:08 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.
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JanusTwoface

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #337 on: November 04, 2010, 07:52:23 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.

That should be good motivation to teach yourself how to play a good active scum game rather than just lurking... :)
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Jim Groovester

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #338 on: November 04, 2010, 07:54:58 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.

But you incriminated yourself by lurking too.

What will you do, Org?
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Eduren

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #339 on: November 04, 2010, 08:02:06 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.

That should be good motivation to teach yourself how to play a good active scum game rather than just lurking... :)
Join the DMA game Org, that's what it's there for.
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Org

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #340 on: November 04, 2010, 08:25:11 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.

But you incriminated yourself by lurking too.

What will you do, Org?
Would have been worse if I posted something dumb.
I'm just lucky I could pull off the white sorc claim on the last day.
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JanusTwoface

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #341 on: November 04, 2010, 08:38:07 pm »

Yeah. I contributed with the lurking problem, mainly because I thought I would incriminate myself more if I had actually posted something.

But you incriminated yourself by lurking too.

What will you do, Org?
Would have been worse if I posted something dumb.
I'm just lucky I could pull off the white sorc claim on the last day.

I really don't think you did... I think that even if you hadn't claimed Zathras probably would have gone along with you and if he had Extended the day instead you would have been totally screwed by Eduren's likely counter-claim.  With both of you claiming White, you (probably) would have been the one lynched.

What really won the game was the 11th hour lynch which is a really risky gambit to pull off.  I've been burnt by it before, so I (for one) would much rather seen anyone trying to push a change in lynch with less than an hour to go hang rather than whoever they're targetting.  Could just be me though.

I really would rather you work on your active game though.  We need more active players!
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webadict

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #342 on: November 04, 2010, 09:41:43 pm »

Umm... how about the game having 3 scum in 9p? Who thought that was a good idea?
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Zathras

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #343 on: November 04, 2010, 09:44:35 pm »

Umm... how about the game having 3 scum in 9p? Who thought that was a good idea?

The scum seemed pretty happy about it. I'm sure they'd call it a good idea.    ;-)
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JanusTwoface

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Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice Mafia [Over - Dark Sorcerers Win!]
« Reply #344 on: November 04, 2010, 09:51:36 pm »

Umm... how about the game having 3 scum in 9p? Who thought that was a good idea?

I'm guessing this is a rhetorical question... but I'll answer you anyways.  I thought it was a good idea about until the middle of day 1.  Then I actually counted it out.  By then the game was already running, so I figured go with it.  So it goes.

It's already been noted and fixed for any future games I mod.

(For reference, the town was actually in surprisingly good shape until about 1-2 hours before the end of Day 2)
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