So, thanks for the remainder. JetSquirrel, are you buddying me, or merely agreeing with the unvarnished truth that is my impeccable analysis?
I'm agreeing with your arguments which are very convincing atleast from my point of view, while some can disagree like jim
are you convinced Jim is scum or do you just think it likely? What do you think Jim's scummitude says, if anything, about Zathras?
I am clearly convinced that jim is scum due to the things Zathras mentoined and a few other things. Scummitude? I honestly dont think Zathras is scum, he's giving good reasoning, good solid defense and a good scumhunting attitude.
How could I disagree with this kid when he's so
obviously correct? His arguments are strong and reasoned, a shining beacon of clarity and truth...
But,
JetSquirrel, while I am very full of myself and proud of my impeccable and persuasive analysis, it would be good for you to add a few original thoughts to lessen the impression that you are just buddying me and using my words to avoid scumhunting of your own. I'm easily swayed by flattery, sure, and can't fault you for being right, but this does seem a bit fishy of you. Leaving Jim aside, if you wish, how about you expound on the scumminess of Org and Person? IronyOwl did have some insighful thoughts about Person, but I don't want to see you repeat them -- I want to hear you make your own.
Zathras, this:
Noooo! OK. It's true that most of Jim's Day Two play (except for the plan-related stuff) has been townie enough. I've pushed him, and he's not verbally cracking as scum. It might be better to stop trying. But I have one major problem with this:
Is more important than this:
Yesterday's Support
Red Magic - 1 Apprentice
Black Magic - 0 Apprentices
White Magic - 1 Apprentice
Even if we discount all the verbal play, there is this. If he is town, and he voted in accordance with his plan, it means that the entire scum team voted "none" or simply forgot. I find this extremely hard to swallow. It would be rank incompetence if they forgot, so much that I find it implausible, or a very cunning gambit, so cunning that I find it implausible as well. Therefore, I have no option but to remain convinced that Jim did vote red, supporting it as scum supporting his scum school. The alternative is too implausible.
You're holding a bunch of ifs, about my alignment, about how competent the scum are, more important than the things I've actually done. And you're holding rigidly to an unverifiable assumption.
Is it really such a stretch to believe the scum are incompetent? I mean, you suspect Org and Jetsquirrel, right? Look at the night kill too, if you want some more evidence. What purpose did the scum gain by killing Jokerman-EXE? I have no fucking clue. They actually did me a favor, since I suspected him at the end of Day 1.
And indulge me the WIFOM for a moment. Don't you think I'd be running a tighter ship than just one assist? If you don't believe that, then at the very least, don't you think I'd have picked a more productive night kill target?
You shouldn't vote me on a bunch of ifs and maybes if everything else I'm doing says I'm town.
I disagree. First, the fact that you aren't verbally cracking may just be good scumplay, or insufficient hunting on my part. It doesn't absolve you, it merely does not condemn you. Second, you have seemed "mostly townie enough", except where you haven't, like when talking about the (fucking goddamned) plan, and other bits. It ain't like you're sporting a clean bill of health. There is no "everything else says I'm town". It's merely "mostly townie enough".
On the incompetence theory, no I really don't think they would all forget or vote none. JetSquirrel might, but not Org. Sure, he talks funny and walks with a limp, but it's irresponsible to dismiss him as incompetent. He's good, especially at playing with night actions and powers and gaming the system. No, from the field of play, JS is the only one I could grant may have "forgotten" to support his scum school. All the others must have chosen it, and I see that difficult.
On the other, I don't see Jokerman's kill as a bad choice; you generally want to NK someone who hasn't taken the spotlight much. Sure, he may not have been the best target, but within acceptable limits of competence. As to how tight a ship you would run, I can't say. Two supports would have been too conspicuous, so one was probably the right number. And one is what scum had, with my theory. No need for untidy ships.
And I did consider other options and permutations (which I can list if people are curious, but I'm sure you can work them out). The only other one that makes sense with you being town is that all three schools are town, and scum is all vanilla. Not impossible, I suppose, but just as implausible as the others.
I keep my vote on you because the support numbers are
hard data, as opposed to people's wording or lurking or missteps or whatnot. It is indisputable that this happened. Interpretations may vary, and the alternatives are not impossible, merely too implausible, but I can't in good conscience call you "town".
When we close up on the end of the day, I may switch my vote to some other scum, if consensus is building and the reasons valid, but I'm afraid you won't leave my "scum" column for the rest of the game. For the reasons above. Colour choices.
Jetsquirrel - Since Jetsquirrel is a completely incompetent noob who can't string together a coherent thought, I have several issues with you thinking he is town.
This I vehemently dispute. I do not think he's town. I asked Eduren once, long ago "although JS has seemed townie enough to me, I may be missing something". Up to that point, he had seemed townie enough to me, then, partly thanks to your help, I realised several points I had missed before ("maybe I'm missing something" was the point of the question -- your answers were more helpful than Eduren's, though they took a more torturous road). I have since asked him about the stuff you so kindly pointed out that I had indeed missed: "are you buddying me? Why didn't you vote D1?" (and annex points).
I have never said he was town. I said that I didn't have anything on him yet, asked others for pointers on what I had missed, and you helpfully obliged. I now no longer think he "seems townie enough", at least until he answers my pending questions to my satisfaction.
although JS has seemed townie enough to me, I may be missing something.
There's three scum out there. I think I've been able to smoke out only one (you), and get smells of scum from another (Org). Whoever has most support at end of day will hang, and my vote will be on one of these two... unless someone else comes and becomes even scummier -- I'm pretty sure at least one of Eduren, IronyOwl & Person is scum, but I don't know which (since almost half the players are scum by now, it's not a particularly adventurous guess, but there you go).
Zathras, why must you lie? He was "townie enough" for you, and you were "pretty sure" he wasn't scum by process of elimination, but now you're trying to deny it.
[bi]Irony[/b], you are being wilfully disingenuous. I clearly made the point in my earlier note that I never thought he was town. I thought he "seemed townie enough so far, but I may be missing something". Which I was, as I suspected, and has since been corrected.
No lie. The second one with the "pretty sure" is at the same time as my question to Eduren, and indeed just because at the time I thought he was the least scummy that doesn't mean I thought he was town. If you order your thoughts in order of decreasing scummitude, the last place is not necessarily someone you think is town, is it? Who is your least scummy pick as of right now? Are they town?
You lie when you say I lie, and I have proved it. Liars are scum.