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[Dunamisdeos]

I was going to send someone a quote from TST's Tenets, related to a topic we had discussed earlier. Within a few moments of typing out the quote I became so anxious that I nearly threw up. Even though the person knows TST isn't some spawn of evil, knows I don't believe in fundamentalism, and would probably be fine if they knew I didn't believe at all, bam, almost vomited.

Aiite I'll bite, what is a TST.

[Lord Shonus]

The Satanic Temple, an atheist organization structured as a parody of a church.

[Eschar]

I was going to send someone a quote from TST's Tenets, related to a topic we had discussed earlier. Within a few moments of typing out the quote I became so anxious that I nearly threw up. Even though the person knows TST isn't some spawn of evil, knows I don't believe in fundamentalism, and would probably be fine if they knew I didn't believe at all, bam, almost vomited.

Aiite I'll bite, what is a TST.

The Satanic Temple; a religious freedom and secular humanism advocacy group. In particular I was sending them Tenet III, "one's body is inviolable, subject to one's will alone."

They have no issue with it. That's not the problem. The problem is my automatic response to trying to send it was to get anxious and nearly vomit.

[scriver]

Well invoking the Satanic Temple for any reason is very pretentious and should be avoided at all costs

[LordBaal]

Obviously it's not free energy (in this house we obey the rules of thermodynamics), but it's in theory a hell of a vector for it when talking about a H economy. You make the alloys with renewable and distribute it and store it as you would do with fuel. Then "on site" is converted to hydrogen and then the hydrogen goes to the fuel cells.

Edit: Since you don't need the fuckhuge temperatures or any other special condition like in electrolysis this means is far easier to install a network virtually anywhere. Granted the efficiency of the powder manufacturing might make it unpractical BUT any spare renewable energy dumped into this would be far better, I think I read is better than say pumped hydroelectric reservoirs.

[Eschar]

Well invoking the Satanic Temple for any reason is very pretentious and should be avoided at all costs

It is? I haven't noticed. I just find their tenets a useful summary of one view of secular humanism.

[Mathel]

Obviously it's not free energy (in this house we obey the rules of thermodynamics), but it's in theory a hell of a vector for it when talking about a H economy. You make the alloys with renewable and distribute it and store it as you would do with fuel. Then "on site" is converted to hydrogen and then the hydrogen goes to the fuel cells.

Edit: Since you don't need the fuckhuge temperatures or any other special condition like in electrolysis this means is far easier to install a network virtually anywhere. Granted the efficiency of the powder manufacturing might make it unpractical BUT any spare renewable energy dumped into this would be far better, I think I read is better than say pumped hydroelectric reservoirs.

The issue is that producing the powder does require to use both high temperatures and electrolysis to produce the aluminium.

It would be much simpler and cheaper to use the renewable sources you mentioned to produce directly hydrogen by electrolysing water.
The hydrogen could then be sold in pressure cylinders.

[McTraveller]

Volume density of hydrogen storage is beyond terrible, even compressed. It's also mechanically volatile, requires relatively difficult to obtain materials (hydrogen is tiny!), etc..  Using a solid reagent to release hydrogen on-demand may make it more practical, even if it's slightly less overall energy efficient.

Remember the optima isn't the local minimum energy used - it's the lowest total cost (in energy, pollution, weight, etc.) to achieve the desired result.  Minimizing just the energy at the expense of other parameters just may not be worth it.

[Iduno]

Volume density of hydrogen storage is beyond terrible, even compressed. It's also mechanically volatile, requires relatively difficult to obtain materials (hydrogen is tiny!), etc..  Using a solid reagent to release hydrogen on-demand may make it more practical, even if it's slightly less overall energy efficient.

Remember the optima isn't the local minimum energy used - it's the lowest total cost (in energy, pollution, weight, etc.) to achieve the desired result.  Minimizing just the energy at the expense of other parameters just may not be worth it.

Yeah, even the dirtier of the two coals in a power plant producing electricity for cars is more efficient than the small gas-burning plants in cars. Partially because extracting gasoline from oil is inefficient, partially scale, and partially because engines are more effective when they're immobile, which is not a good sign for cars.

Hydrogen fuel cells are much safer than burning hydrogen, and produce an amount of power you'd actually want to use in a vehicle that isn't trying to achieve land speed records/kill the driver.

[LordBaal]

Exactly what I meant. You could have relative cheaper H infraestructure as in "gas stations" everywhere where both powder or tablets or whatever are keep along with regular water and produce H2 "on demand" requiring far smaller tanks and eliminating the need to transport actual hydrogen around.

[Lord Shonus]

Scary idea. People are bad enough with gasoline - having the average Joe at a hydrogen filling station feels like a recipe for disaster. Despite the drawbacks, conventional batteries feels like a much saner option.

[pisskop]

presumably robots/safety catches will be utilized?

[Trekkin]

presumably robots/safety catches will be utilized?

And then subverted on general principle.

As a general rule, the opponents of progress do not hold views discordant that are with reality so much as they are orthogonal to it. The dangers imposed by hydrogen won't even register with them. What will register is that everyone telling them not to barbecue their hydrogen tank has a STEM job and is therefore a lyin' elitist jerb-tookin' liebruhl to be actively defied, b'gawd angry gurning noises.

And then they will die, and the technoplutocracy will be blamed again, and we're back to square one.

[Iduno]

presumably robots/safety catches will be utilized?

And then subverted on general principle.

As a general rule, the opponents of progress do not hold views discordant that are with reality so much as they are orthogonal to it. The dangers imposed by hydrogen won't even register with them. What will register is that everyone telling them not to barbecue their hydrogen tank has a STEM job and is therefore a lyin' elitist jerb-tookin' liebruhl to be actively defied, b'gawd angry gurning noises.

And then they will die, and the technoplutocracy will be blamed again, and we're back to square one.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

[Eschar]

presumably robots/safety catches will be utilized?

And then subverted on general principle.

As a general rule, the opponents of progress do not hold views discordant that are with reality so much as they are orthogonal to it. The dangers imposed by hydrogen won't even register with them. What will register is that everyone telling them not to barbecue their hydrogen tank has a STEM job and is therefore a lyin' elitist jerb-tookin' liebruhl to be actively defied, b'gawd angry gurning noises.

And then they will die, and the technoplutocracy will be blamed again, and we're back to square one.

I'm having trouble translating "jerb-tookin"