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[wierd]

I will certainly be flamed for this, but this is one of the reasons I get rankled at the "anti-patriarchy!" aligned form of modern feminism. -- The goal is clearly not female equality with men at all, but is instead female protectionism on a scale that makes the victorian age seem quaint.  I thought the purpose of feminism was to get OFF the goddamn pedistal?

Legislation like yours screams "I have a vagina, so I am a delicate flower, that needs to be protected! Wrap me up in 10 layers of bubblewrap! Why, a single unwanted look could destroy me forever!"

Apparently it was less "I want off the pedistal to prove I can stand and walk for myself amid life's slings and arrows." and more "I wanted off THAT pedistal, so I could get on THIS one! it's much taller, and more stylish!"



Cue the "You dont know how hard it is to be a woman!" rhetorical deluge in 3, 2, 1...
(Hint, Life is hard for everyone, and life being hard does not justify fundamental hipocrisy. Go read Animal Farm, and see where the thinking "some are more equal than others" leads. It isn't pretty. Equality means getting bumped and bruised along the way just like everyone else, and having a penis does not make males magically immine from sexual abuse, so spare me that canard as well. IIRC, the statistic is 1 in 6 men have been sexually abused at some point in thier lives.  If anything, it is culturally HARDER for males, because admiting that sexual abuse is a cultural taboo that is percieved as an indicator of weakness and ersion of masculine identity. The point here? Women get abused about as often as men do, men get abused earlier in life is all. As a consequence, treating male abuse as a non-issue is straight up specious and a stark denial of reality.)

[Neonivek]

The impression I get is more that for a lot of feminists they look at an injustice that hits women and they don't always know how to fix it.

So some use ideas that end up being quite regressive as a result.

But that is because there is no one feminism, nor one idea of how to achieve it. It is why you get completely opposite ideas.

As for "Men seem overly vilified and ignored" that is... true... But that isn't news. Well actually that isn't true EXACTLY (true but untrue... it is complicated)

Honestly the best advice I have for people is just to pretend feminism doesn't exist (and yes I know I am a feminist)... Just treat whatever BS statistic as if it was coming from an idiot rather then a feminist. Treat any great idea like it was coming from someone with intelligence rather then a feminist.

[Rolan7]

It's probably too late for this, but we *know* how these discussion always go.  It's frustrating, but this just isn't a place where the topic can be discussed rationally.  Every thread on the topic has devolved and been deleted, and Toady keeps having to excise it when it causes derails in other topics.

As someone who pretty much agrees with you guys - why the hell are you discussing it again here?  Particularly you weird, with the "hurr now the other side will vilify me".  Yeah no shit, you're basically taunting them - and breaking an armistice.  That *does* make you the bad guy.

Any chance we can just roll this back *without* involving Toady?

[Neonivek]

Ehhh I think the topic is over frankly.

A lot of people are just frustrated because school basically crams this down your throat for your entire highschool experience.

As for the non-consent for things like kissing.

I'd HAVE to see that to believe it. There is just no way something like that can pass.

[Gunner-Chan]

So does the internet, college, work, TV, radio...

Basically we're at the point that average people are more obsessed with rape than the rapists, poi.

[wierd]

Neon- The OP was discussing a college. Add minumum 4 years on top of the highschool flavor.

Rolan-- I find the rhetoric behind policies like the above sufficiently antagonistic to warrant an address of grievance, and merely preemptively shot down the most likely retort.  It was mostly rhetorical in itself; I dont really want to debate this issue. I was more hedging it back toward the center, where the real world lives. I merely would like for the feminists of this flavor to stop being misandronists, and become humanists.

[Neonivek]

Neon- The OP was discussing a college. Add minumum 4 years on top of the highschool flavor.

Ehhh College and university only beats this in further if you take any of the humanities.

[scrdest]

misandronists, and become humanists.

Misandronist == a person hating androids? The latter part of the sentence implies so

Misandrist is what you were shooting for.

[Neonivek]

Goodness I hate androids with such a passion...

[wierd]

scrdest-- So it is!

Yes, less hatred of males, more love for humans.

[Dutchling]

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[ArKFallen]

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?
WTF?

[Furtuka]

nvm

[Loud Whispers]

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?
WTF?

eror 505: pos nod foun :D:D:D:D:D

[Bohandas]

It's probably too late for this, but we *know* how these discussion always go.  It's frustrating, but this just isn't a place where the topic can be discussed rationally.  Every thread on the topic has devolved and been deleted, and Toady keeps having to excise it when it causes derails in other topics.

As someone who pretty much agrees with you guys - why the hell are you discussing it again here?  Particularly you weird, with the "hurr now the other side will vilify me".  Yeah no shit, you're basically taunting them - and breaking an armistice.  That *does* make you the bad guy.

Any chance we can just roll this back *without* involving Toady?

They don't "devolve". Whiners throw hissy fits about them to the mods when someone broaches an opinion that doesn't tow the forum's party line.

The real problem is that the topics are never g8ven the chance to be resolved before being sent down the memory hole.