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[pisskop]

1) Specifics that do not reach across the board.

2) Outdated and used back when they had to struggle againt paganistic religions.  Violently struggle.

3) Judaism recognizes, and has for a loooong tim now, that many of its stories are metaphorical and laws had to be revised with the times.  Their understanding of right and wrong evolved.

4) Secularism is not always better, and it has a huge headstart on religion in that is evolved when the concept right/wrong was relatively modern

5) Christianity used to be authoritarian.  Now its humanistic, mostly.  On the broad scale.

6) the 'Old Testament' was from a time with a different understanding of right/wrong.  Indeed, it mandated purity from couruption, insofar that other religions had far worse practices and the only way to keep social ideas such as religion out was to kill them.  At the time.

[Lord Shonus]

Lord Shonus, those are most definitely no the ideals of Christianity.

They certainly are. Christ vehemently condemned the Pharisees for paying more attention to petty ritual  than helping people, referred to money as a demon, and considered a beggar woman one of the most blessed of all people because she gave everythig she had to help those even worse off than she was. What many preach as "true Christianity" has been warped considerably from that, and mistranslations do not help. But if you look at the words written in red, then you find little besides love, mercy, and charity.

[PanH]

As for illogical, maybe to you, but many things seem illogical to us now but in the future will be easy.
Like at one point it was illogical to think humans would even be able to fly, or illogical to think the earth is round, now days? It's 100% logical, now keep in mind if we keep God as he is, he is

Logic is always objective. It has never been illogical to think the earth is round. It's not because the majority of people think something that this is logical or true. Then, most people ARE illogical.

Btw, we know earth is round since greeks/egyptian.

[Loud Whispers]

What many preach as "true Christianity" has been warped considerably from that, and mistranslations do not help. But if you look at the words written in red, then you find little besides love, mercy, and charity.

[Unless you're gay or a woman or an atheist or an adulterer]

4) Secularism is not always better, and it has a huge headstart on religion in that is evolved when the concept right/wrong was relatively modern

It tends to have the advantage of picking what seems to be the best course of action instead of blindly following rules. Buddhism is incredibly close in those regards.

[Lord Shonus]

What many preach as "true Christianity" has been warped considerably from that, and mistranslations do not help. But if you look at the words written in red, then you find little besides love, mercy, and charity.

[Unless you're gay or a woman or an atheist or an adulterer]

Despite what Dan Brown would have you think. women are not denigrated in the New Testament, except in out of context lines and mistranslations. (The much-cited line about women submitting to their husbands is paired with a command for husbands to submit to their wives. In other words, it's mutual submission.) In an age where execution for adultry (at least, adulterous women) was nigh-universal, Christ labasted and condemmed the very idea. As for gays, the only part of the Old Testament which contains unequivocal condmenation of it is the Levitical code which Christ explicitly discarded. (Despite what Pat Robertson and his ilk would have you believe, the sin of Sodom was discourteousness and intolerance of strangers. This is spelled out somewhere in the NT, can't remember the verse.) Even those references in the Epistles, which are explicitly not the words of Christ, but early sermons by a mortal, are of uncertain realatedness, in a case of dubious translation.

[pisskop]

^Sodom was also untamed, unabashed sex, which symbolized it coruption in other ways  Homosexuality was not the issue, as when the wife is sent out.  They killed her in their *i*nsatible lust.^

[penguinofhonor]

(The much-cited line about women submitting to their husbands is paired with a command for husbands to submit to their wives. In other words, it's mutual submission.)

I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself as a ransom for all people. This has now been witnessed to at the proper time. And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.

Therefore I want the men everywhere to pray, lifting up holy hands without anger or disputing. I also want the women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, adorning themselves, not with elaborate hairstyles or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God.

A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. But women will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith, love and holiness with propriety.

I didn't want to jump in here, but please, tell me where the male compliments to the women's lines are. Because I don't see any. I might have the wrong quote, I guess.

[Loud Whispers]

Woah hey I think Dan Brown's a moron too, at least there's common ground there.

No but seriously, Christianity and the bible are messed up. I don't want to post a whole list of the bible hating on heretics, homosexuals and witches unless I have to, as I think Jesus is a kinda cool guy, but he says quite a few nasty things himself.

"I am come to send fire on Earth; and what will I, if it be already kindled? But I have a baptism to be baptized with; and how am I straitened till it be accomplished! Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
Luke 12:49–53

*Division also translated as sword in some bibles.

[fqllve]

Despite what Dan Brown would have you think. women are not denigrated in the New Testament[.]

In fact, wasn't Pauline celibacy used as a form of proto-feminism?

Honestly, my oft-asked question is why does Christianity feel the need to retain the Old Testament when it is so vastly different from their main book? I think it only ends up hurting their positions.

[Mephansteras]

Ok, all of you, go to the religion thread for this. That's enough of a derail for now.

[penguinofhonor]

Aww, but I won't be able to be condescending there. I guess that's for the better.

[Mr Space Cat]

Honestly, my oft-asked question is why does Christianity feel the need to retain the Old Testament when it is so vastly different from their main book? I think it only ends up hurting their positions.

there's various Bibles (bible lines? bible models?) that contain only the New Testament, such as pocket bibles. I've got a copy myself, a nice gentleman was literally handing them out to random people at the time and I picked one up.

Anyway, I just saw a commercial for the "Avatar Christmas special" only on FXM. nothing gets you in the Christmas spirit like "Dances with Smurfs in Space" right?

[Happy Zippo]

The fact that I am always stepping on cigarrette butts. Like, WTF, isn't that littering, and, uh, isn't our mainstream tobacco radioactively contaminated, did you hear about this, did you see this?

[pisskop]

Is it radioactive?  My lungs are glowy?!?


And no, do tell.

[Happy Zippo]

Well I heard a disgusting rumor that there is radion RADION RADION in our cigarrettes, at least the stuff grown on the east coast, Virginia, New Jersey, Wahsington and Maryland; radion RADION is extremely harmful and would cause cancer at a much faster rate than simply inhaling all that dirty smoke.

Anyways just cut one death stick open. That tobacco is processed enuff as it is. You're basically smoking cardboard.