Yes, I'd not hesitate to assert that ritualistic murder is objectively wrong -- I don't subscribe to the central argument of cultural relativism, and think that killing a person without meaningful justification (that is to say, not in legitimate self-defense &c.) is not acceptable.
Thing is though, ritual murder usually has a built in cultural reason behind it. To make an extreme example, imagine an isolated group of people which uniformly believes that a human sacrifice on the winter solstice is required to bring summer again. In this society it would be immoral not to perform the sacrifice, because everyone would starve and die otherwise. My point is that "meaningful justification" is itself essentially determined by culture. Yours simply happens to have different ideas than theirs on what meaningful justification means.
This is why I personally hold ALL cultures in contempt - even my own, just in case.
That's not an unhealthy view to have. That aside:
Yes, I'd not hesitate to assert that ritualistic murder is objectively wrong -- I don't subscribe to the central argument of cultural relativism, and think that killing a person without meaningful justification (that is to say, not in legitimate self-defense &c.) is not acceptable.
Thing is though, ritual murder usually has a built in cultural reason behind it. To make an extreme example, imagine an isolated group of people which uniformly believes that a human sacrifice on the winter solstice is required to bring summer again. In this society it would be immoral not to perform the sacrifice, because everyone would starve and die otherwise. My point is that "meaningful justification" is itself essentially determined by culture. Yours simply happens to have different ideas than theirs on what meaningful justification means.
Yes, I'd not hesitate to assert that ritualistic murder is objectively wrong
Except 'wrong' (in this sense) is something subjective by nature.
I'm not supporting ritualistic murder and I also think it's wrong, but please don't bring objectivity into somewhere where it has no place.
1+1=3 is objectively 'wrong' (incorrect is a better word, though), 'X action, x thoughts, x feelings, x things' are not.
I actually agree with you otherwise (for the most part). It's just the misuse of 'objectively' that I dislike.
I mean, I could say that ritual murder is objectively right. Doesn't actually make it anything objective, it's just a misuse of words and me trying to present my opinion as undeniable fact, and I really dislike it when people do that. Probably due to interacting with several religious nutcases before...
That's the issue with cultural relativism. It was spawned with the best of intentions (namely, avoiding the issues traditionally associated with Western Europeans interacting with other cultures), but was put together incredibly poorly. It's ethics' best example of lack of forethought, as it can be used to justify pretty much any atrocity which could be argued to be an element of a culture.
Let's have some examples: To Nazi Germany (pardon the semi-Godwin, but it's one of the best ways to make this point), executing undesirables was perfectly acceptable from a moral and ethical standpoint -- they were polluting the blood of ethnic Germans, taking resources and living space which could be used to better German lives, and had betrayed Germany at the end of the First World War. You can substitute the Cultural Revolution, the Soviet purges, Pol Pot's genocide, &c. as you please.
To the U.S. after 9/11, torture of suspected terrorists was ethically and morally acceptable; they had attacked the U.S., they were foreign combatants, and torture was the best way to extract information which could prevent future attacks.
Let's go back to WWII for a moment. Just about every major power engaged in bombing campaigns against civilian targets, typically guided by the belief that breaking civilian morale would produce a victory. Likewise, when the Wehrmacht advanced into Russia, its soldiers raped millions of women and girls. But it was all right, because they were subhuman by the cultural norms of the Third Reich. When the Red Army was rolling through eastern Germany, it was likewise ethically acceptable for them to do the same; after all, the Germans needed to feel the same pain and loss.
I could go on listing historical examples, but let's hit closer to home. If I'd been born in the late nineteenth century, it would not only have been ethically acceptable by the standards of the time but also looked upon favorably for me to beat my children. Likewise, if my wife wished to express political views, take up work outside the home, or engage in intellectual activity, I would have been praised by many of my peers for stifling that and condemned if I did not.
If I were born sixty years ago, the society in which I live would have praised me for vocally expressing racist and homophobic sentiment.
Et-fuckin'-cetera.
Few things irk me more than people perpetuating this bullshit masquerading as accepting and multicultural thought. Moreover, what you're shilling is a misrepresentation of what the idea actually was.
So here. If you're lazy, just read this: It originated with Herodotus' observation that people will always, when given a choice, prefer the beliefs of their own society, which are explicitly described as religious practices. Cultural relativists combined this with Kant's argument that we are incapable of directly observing the world, as everything we perceive is viewed through the filter of our mind.
There are two arguments there.
1. People tend to prefer their own religious practices regarding treatment of the dead &c.
2. Humans cannot perceive the world without the bias of their minds.
What you're trying to turn it into is:
1. You can't judge the actions of anyone not of your own culture and time because their culture had different ethical standards.
I reiterate.
Bullshit. When you're supporting an ethical worldview which excuses genocide, mass rape, torture, and any other horrible thing you can think of, you might want to reconsider your stance.
Author
Topic: Things that made you go "WTF?" today o_O (Read 14910598 times)