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Author Topic: Current Bugs & Workarounds  (Read 27890 times)

Maltay

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #60 on: October 25, 2010, 07:16:24 pm »

Correction: Water only evaporates at 1/7. A room full of 2/7 and 3/7 of water will NEVER evaporate. You must have some 1/7 depth patches of water present for evaporation to happen. If you have no 1/7 tiles of water, something must be done to lower the water level. Mining more tiles, pumping out the water, whatever.

Corrected.
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Maltay

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #61 on: October 25, 2010, 07:17:11 pm »

Buckets are slightly bugged. I have one bucket on the map that the dwarves will not touch at all.

Is this the bug where the bucket has both lye and water in it?
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FuzzyZergling

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2010, 07:22:24 pm »

Could you add the bug where a bucket/barrel has both lye and water in it, making it unusable until one is removed?

I have not seen other references to this bug.  Can you provide additional details?
When you make lye, it is possible for the lye maker to use a bucket that already has water in it.
This resultes in abucket that has both lye and water in it, rendering it useless. I have seen the mixture be transfered to a barrel, but the barrel was also unusable.
A fix that I have seen involves bringing the bucket/barrel to the trade depot, then forbidding the water while moving the bucket/barrel out of the depot, but I have not tried this myself.
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Tsarwash

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2010, 07:30:51 pm »

I've just looked at the bucket closer and it has (10) of stagnant water in it with grime covering. It can't be dumped or join a stockpile. It sounds like the same bug as the lye water thing.
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Sphalerite

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #64 on: October 25, 2010, 08:21:35 pm »

In reference to the buckets, one possible solution to getting the water out may be to have an active dairy.  I have a farmer's workshop milking cows non-stop.  Tiles around the workshop are covered with 'a smear of water'  It seems that dwarves are grabbing buckets to use for milking cows and dumping out the water before they do the milking.  The buckets of milk are eventually taken to the milk barrel stockpile where the milk is removed, resulting in empty buckets.
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Sphalerite

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #65 on: October 27, 2010, 02:47:33 pm »

Bump, because there are questions on the front page answered by this thread.

I suggest this thread be stickied, since it has actual useful advice.
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Another

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #66 on: October 28, 2010, 03:03:19 am »

Correction: Water only evaporates at 1/7. A room full of 2/7 and 3/7 of water will NEVER evaporate. You must have some 1/7 depth patches of water present for evaporation to happen. If you have no 1/7 tiles of water, something must be done to lower the water level. Mining more tiles, pumping out the water, whatever.

Corrected.
A room with anything less than 7/7 WILL eventually evaporate. Be it water or magma. It may just take too long (about a year for 4/7 water to completely evaporate, may take even longer for magma). Conduct an experiment and see yourself.

Starting with 1/7 and a few 2/7 is of course recommended for fast farming.
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Another

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #67 on: October 28, 2010, 03:11:21 am »


Buckets containing both lye and water are unusable.  The cause for this bug requires additional research.

- No solution.

Wait for a trading caravan and order those buckets to be brought to the Depot. Water from them will be lost somewhere in the process. Cancel the trading and get buckets with lye that is usable to be automatically transferred to an empty barrel on your food stockpile or just buy 1 barrel with 10 lye from the traders if they have one.
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Lord Darkstar

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #68 on: October 28, 2010, 06:02:48 pm »

Correction: Water only evaporates at 1/7. A room full of 2/7 and 3/7 of water will NEVER evaporate. You must have some 1/7 depth patches of water present for evaporation to happen. If you have no 1/7 tiles of water, something must be done to lower the water level. Mining more tiles, pumping out the water, whatever.

Corrected.
A room with anything less than 7/7 WILL eventually evaporate. Be it water or magma. It may just take too long (about a year for 4/7 water to completely evaporate, may take even longer for magma). Conduct an experiment and see yourself.

Starting with 1/7 and a few 2/7 is of course recommended for fast farming.

I've never had water in an UNDERGROUND/INSIDE area evaporate unless it was at 1/7. Water in outside areas can evaporate if the biome is correct for that (and even 7/7 tiles will "evaporate" then). Even in these "hot" biomes, a pool of 3/7 water in an INSIDE/UNDERGROUND reservoir never evaporates. That's never as in 20 years and running.

Evaporation only happens UNDERGROUND/INSIDE if the water is 1/7. OUTSIDE evaporation will happen if water evaporates in that biome.

I have seen reservoirs with water in them go down from DWARVES using it as a nearby source of water. Pehaps this is the source of your "evaporation"? Or is the area marked "outside"? As that would also allow water to disappear/evaporate.
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Another

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #69 on: October 29, 2010, 05:41:31 am »

I've seen water evaporate from initial average more than 2/7 everywhere in completely enclosed (no wells or channels to drink from above) INSIDE (and UNDERGROUND if it matters) rooms. Carry out a dedicated experiment (you will definitely be able to see the difference in average water level after at least 6 in-game months even if you start with 5/7) and see for yourself.
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Quietust

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #70 on: October 29, 2010, 07:43:10 am »

I've seen water evaporate from initial average more than 2/7 everywhere in completely enclosed (no wells or channels to drink from above) INSIDE (and UNDERGROUND if it matters) rooms. Carry out a dedicated experiment (you will definitely be able to see the difference in average water level after at least 6 in-game months even if you start with 5/7) and see for yourself.

I already have plenty of evidence that this does not happen - I've filled underground passages to 7/7 from a river and then sealed them off with floodgates, and they never drop below 7/7, even after over ten years of game time.
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Miuramir

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #71 on: October 29, 2010, 09:00:07 am »

Glass has no sharpness.  It is useless for trap weapons.

- Make traps out of different materials.
Not quite correct.  Glass, unlike most materials, has statistics generated internal to DF instead of loaded from the raws.  Due to a bug, the sharpness value is uninitialized; this means that it is effectively random.  It could be *anything* for a given fort, including far sharper than any known material; but the most common result is zero, or the dullest material in the universe. It may also change every time you reload the fort; if it were reliably blunt, it could be used for training, but there is no way to tell whether it will be ridiculously sharp or hopelessly blunt on any given load of a savefile. 

Possible fix: The live image memory-hacking techniques used by various external DF utilities to clean contaminants, embark with more or less than 7 dwarves, etc. should be able to insert the correct sharpness value for glass once someone finds the right location (signature).  This would need to be run each time you started DF, and possibly each time you loaded a fort. 

Quote
Dwarves refuse to pick up ammo stored in stockpiles or in bins.  This makes ranged weapons somewhat useless after a few rounds of practice during training.

- Store ammo in a stockpile then remove the stockpile to get Dwarves to pick up the ammo.  To get around the problem with bins, assign 0 bins to ammo stockpiles and make sure the rest of your bins are used elsewhere.  Requires some micromanagement.  Also requires lots of space.  It might be easier to not use ranged weapons.

More research is needed; most reports I've seen and my personal experience is that they don't pick up ammo in bins, but that stockpiles with no bins (max bins set to 0, in forts that have never produced a bin, etc.) still work.  I've not tested this in detail in the current version however. 
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Tsarwash

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #72 on: October 29, 2010, 09:31:35 am »

You can tell this bucket thing is bugging me. Firstly, underground water at level 4 does not evaporate at all over one year.

If you have dwarves carrying water to a pond, while you disable / delete the pond then the water in the bucket they are carrying instantly becomes stagnant water. This bucket would seem to be forever useless thereafter. No amount of dumping, forbidding, taking to and from a trade depot and back again, will get them to empty the bucket of stagnat water with grime coating. The game doesn't even seem to recognise it as a bucket anymore. If you D the bucket while in the trade depot it actually disappears and you have to use Z stocks to locate ti again.  The dwarves did dump the bucket once, with water intact, but after that they won't touch it apart from taking it to a trade depot. The only solution that I can see is to trade it away.
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ioi101

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #73 on: October 29, 2010, 09:47:48 am »

Quote
Dwarves refuse to pick up ammo stored in stockpiles or in bins.  This makes ranged weapons somewhat useless after a few rounds of practice during training.

- Store ammo in a stockpile then remove the stockpile to get Dwarves to pick up the ammo.  To get around the problem with bins, assign 0 bins to ammo stockpiles and make sure the rest of your bins are used elsewhere.  Requires some micromanagement.  Also requires lots of space.  It might be easier to not use ranged weapons.

More research is needed; most reports I've seen and my personal experience is that they don't pick up ammo in bins, but that stockpiles with no bins (max bins set to 0, in forts that have never produced a bin, etc.) still work.  I've not tested this in detail in the current version however.

I actually don't find this to be true. I wasn't aware of this being an issue so I was storing all my wooden bolts in bins, and the dwarves picked them up with no problems.

However, I seem to have the bug with military dwarves leaving food all over the place, and as far as I can tell, none of them have woodcutter/miner labors enabled. The bug is related to the labors right, not just having skill in woodcutting/mining? I've ended up simply disabling carrying food in backpacks.

Also for the gauntlets problem - if I understand the bug correctly, dwarves don't care about left/right at all. So even if you had, say, 10 masterwork left and 10 masterwork right gauntlets, with everything else forbidden, your 10 military dwarves might decide to take 2 left gloves, or 2 right gloves instead of one of each. The only way forbidding would work is if you forbid all gauntlets of a certain quality except for 2, which were a left/right pair.

Instead of trying to do that, I've decided I'd rather assign specific left/right gauntlets, that way I can guarantee proper equipping. This works, the only problem is that when you go to assign specific gauntlets, ALL gauntlets are shown, even the ones already claimed by other dwarves, and it's impossible to distinguish between claimed/unclaimed. And to top it off it seems like the game crashes if you try to assign the same gloves to two dwarves. I've managed to assign gloves to my 3 main dwarves properly basically by educated guesswork as to which gauntlets are unclaimed. When the rest of my military/gear is ready though I plan to un-claim all gauntlets and then I should be able to go down the list and arm everyone properly.

If anyone has a better workaround I'd love to hear it... :)
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Burning_Iceman

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Re: Current Bugs & Workarounds
« Reply #74 on: October 29, 2010, 10:10:30 am »

Also for the gauntlets problem - if I understand the bug correctly, dwarves don't care about left/right at all. So even if you had, say, 10 masterwork left and 10 masterwork right gauntlets, with everything else forbidden, your 10 military dwarves might decide to take 2 left gloves, or 2 right gloves instead of one of each. The only way forbidding would work is if you forbid all gauntlets of a certain quality except for 2, which were a left/right pair.

Instead of trying to do that, I've decided I'd rather assign specific left/right gauntlets, that way I can guarantee proper equipping. This works, the only problem is that when you go to assign specific gauntlets, ALL gauntlets are shown, even the ones already claimed by other dwarves, and it's impossible to distinguish between claimed/unclaimed. And to top it off it seems like the game crashes if you try to assign the same gloves to two dwarves. I've managed to assign gloves to my 3 main dwarves properly basically by educated guesswork as to which gauntlets are unclaimed. When the rest of my military/gear is ready though I plan to un-claim all gauntlets and then I should be able to go down the list and arm everyone properly.

If anyone has a better workaround I'd love to hear it... :)

With gloves the problem seems to be that they get assigned in a certain order: say you want to assign steel gauntlets then the ones that will get assigned will be the first 2 (unassigned) steel gauntlets of the highest quality you have in the list of "specific gloves" from the equipment screen.
Example from my current game:

The list of specific gloves looks like this:
☼steel left gauntlet☼
☼steel right gauntlet☼
☼steel right gauntlet☼
☼steel right gauntlet☼
☼steel left gauntlet☼
☼steel left gauntlet☼
☼steel right gauntlet☼

Then the first dwarf to have "steel gauntlets" assigned to him will get a left and right glove, the second dwarf will get 2 right gloves assigned (one of which he cannot equip) and the 3rd dwarf gets 2 left gloves.

Incidentally it seems this order is the reverse of how they show up in the stocks screen. So I believe the default assignment order is the reverse order of production, i.e newest goes to your first dwarf etc.

The order stays the same so long as you produce no new ones. So once you have enough masterwork gloves the assignment is easy enough although fairly tedious. Just directly assign the 1st right glove and the 1st left glove in the list to your 1st dwarf. 2nd dwarf gets 2nd right and 2nd left glove etc.

Edit: Btw assigning the same gauntlet to another dwarf doesn't cause a crash for me. It simply gets un-assigned from the other one.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2010, 10:15:01 am by Burning_Iceman »
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