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Voting closed: November 05, 2010, 09:56:20 pm

[n9103]

chiming in to add I vote for a reset.

[Soulwynd]

The current VPS works just fine. We have never had huge slowdowns unless someone's summoning tons of cacti.

[ExKirby]

I call upon the forces of NEW MAP.

[Gara-nis]

I was able to connect fine a little bit ago, but now I'm having problems again. I'm pretty sick of this VPS provider. They suck, and are wildly unhelpful. If only I could afford a T1 line at my house.

I have a dell poweredge 2950 colocated in an excellent datacenter outside DC. I'm offering to run Jaycraft on it for free(depending on the bandwidth usage). Seems like a lot better deal than a VPS.

How much total transfer does Jaycraft do per month? I can go up to 90 gigs without a problem.

[Duke 2.0]

This is just a suggestion, but maybe we should disable cuboid on the new map (except for the /protect commands).  It seems to be directly responsible for all the current map problems.  Also, and maybe this is just me, but it kind of sucks when you put a lot of effort into finishing a big project only to have it completely dwarfed (no pun intended) and outdone by a giant cuboid construction in about 5 minutes.  I just think there's something special about the projects people build the old-fashioned way.

In my own defense my own project(The bell-thing) only used cuboid for the guides and I filled in most of everything else myself. It's really difficult to make large circles in a cubed environment, so it helps a bit. And we are very open to helping people using cuboid to do things like fill in pits people used to harvest dirt, or lay out guides for precise dimensions, or make a border aorund a project or something. Actual constructing should be done by hand, but the drugdework of designations and making the landscape not look like crap with scars in the terrain and making a border doesn't require human work. It's not like somebody will be impressed by them.

[Jay]

It uses a considerable amount of bandwidth, actually.
Roughly 300 kb/s per player...
That adds up pretty fast.

[lordnincompoop]

Supposing around 5 people are on at any one time of the day every day (300*5*60*60*24*31), each using 300kb/s, you are using 3831GB per month.

Supposing 4 people are on 18 hours a day for a month (300*4*60*60*18*31), you use about 2298GB per month.

Supposing at any one time only 1 person is on, but the guy's on all the time (300*60*60*24*31), you use 766GB per month.

These numbers sound really off. 0_o

[Jay]

Bah, so they are.
Didn't notice that extra 0.
30, not 300.
Still a large amount for a metered connection.
76 GB of transfer for one play-month.

[Gara-nis]

I highly doubt those numbers. I'll do some testing on my own, but when a player is not actively travelling across the gameworld, transfer drops to a very low rate. Downloading chunks or using cuboid causes sudden bursts of data traffic, but normal gameplay does not use a constant 30kbyte/sec rate, or even on average.

It makes no real difference to me where jaycraft ends up, but I think it should be somewhere with a stable connection, decent support, etc... I think my server would be fine in that regard.

[Soulwynd]

Yeah. My bandwidth monitor never points at 30kb/s on minecraft, unless I'm currently downloading chunks.

[Vactor]

This is just a suggestion, but maybe we should disable cuboid on the new map (except for the /protect commands).  It seems to be directly responsible for all the current map problems.  Also, and maybe this is just me, but it kind of sucks when you put a lot of effort into finishing a big project only to have it completely dwarfed (no pun intended) and outdone by a giant cuboid construction in about 5 minutes.  I just think there's something special about the projects people build the old-fashioned way.

In my own defense my own project(The bell-thing) only used cuboid for the guides and I filled in most of everything else myself. It's really difficult to make large circles in a cubed environment, so it helps a bit. And we are very open to helping people using cuboid to do things like fill in pits people used to harvest dirt, or lay out guides for precise dimensions, or make a border aorund a project or something. Actual constructing should be done by hand, but the drugdework of designations and making the landscape not look like crap with scars in the terrain and making a border doesn't require human work. It's not like somebody will be impressed by them.

I think that the builders on the last map proved that making spheres and circles, even at massive sizes are entirely possible, (ie. soulsphere, nomedome, iscdisc)and until the advent of cuboid building were a sign of great dedication and hard work.  While I'll acknowledge that not everyone cares to take that time, using a program to make arbitrarily large shapes dillutes the value of the effort of those who do it with their own handiwork.  I'm not an utter purist, i bought a lot of the materials for thicket castle for instance, but i'm not that big of a fan of cuboid use for constructions, or even framing.  Part of the coolness of making the iscdisc was working it all out.

[lordnincompoop]

The soulsphere was not a true sphere; it was a set of intersecting circles. That isn't too difficult.

Actual spheres are difficult though, expecially for somebody as geometrically incompetent as me. I make the initial sphere from glass, then fill everything in manually, and do the landscaping (mostly) myself. The Incipisphere, for example, is something I'd call a showcase of Cuboid's powers, and even then I had to do the spacing, the planets, scaffolding and some of the rings manually.

We aren't as reliant as you think. Cuboid is a useful tool, not the death of noble projects or the harbinger of inequality.

EDIT: As an example, imagine the birth of power tools, or computers. Did man try to ban the use of those things, simply becuase it disadvantaged people without it, or simplified and made easier the creation of things? No, they didn't. What matters is what one does with these tools. A structure, no matter how big, will be worth nothing if it is unappealing. If these tools allow us to create grander structures of greater beauty and charm, then I say let us have these tools.

Please forgive me if I'm rambilng, or if I'm not making sense. It's two in the morning and I'm tired.

[Vactor]

The soulsphere was not a true sphere; it was a set of intersecting circles. That isn't too difficult.

Actual spheres are difficult though, expecially for somebody as geometrically incompetent as me. I make the initial sphere from glass, then fill everything in manually, and do the landscaping (mostly) myself. The Incipisphere, for example, is something I'd call a showcase of Cuboid's powers, and even then I had to do the spacing, the planets, scaffolding and some of the rings manually.

We aren't as reliant as you think. Cuboid is a useful tool, not the death of noble projects or the harbinger of inequality.

EDIT: As an example, imagine the birth of power tools, or computers. Did man try to ban the use of those things, simply becuase it disadvantaged people without it, or simplified and made easier the creation of things? No, they didn't. What matters is what one does with these tools. A structure, no matter how big, will be worth nothing if it is unappealing. If these tools allow us to create grander structures of greater beauty and charm, then I say let us have these tools.

Please forgive me if I'm rambilng, or if I'm not making sense. It's two in the morning and I'm tired.

I think you might find http://www.blender.org/ to be more of the game that you're looking for. 

Now all snarkiness aside, the comparative value of everything made on the server is in the apparent effort that went into it.  Cuboid, as a useful tool, decreases the effort required for those who use it, which lessens the apparent effort of those who abstained, were unable to use it.  If you don't take the journey of building something, you won't have nearly the same amount of satisfaction when you complete it.  Think of it this way, you can paint a picture, or you can get a poster.  The poster might look better, but it won't fulfill you nearly as much.

^{_{and painting the picture won't kill the server/mar the landscape with an exploding sphere of cacti}}

I still think that cuboid building should only be used to patch up tnt griefers/accidents, and for public assets like the guest zone, or a peremiter boundary to prevent map bloat.  I set up the quarry specifically so people wouldn't have to tear up their back yard to get materials

[Empty]

Yeah. My temple would have taken just a few hours to built if I had access to and used cuboid.

But making your own smooth stone walls and spires is priceless

[breadbocks]

LNC, you  misspelled rambling. You really ARE tired.