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[plynxis]

wouldnt that kick ass! like making oil from animal fat, into buckets, and building a rock bucket triggered by a lever, which spills oil on invaders (or babies )

dwarves can already burn wood and stuff so i guess making it so they can just set the oil on fire (depending on what oil it is i guess - not all oil will just burn) or spend a unit of fuel to make it boil wouldnt skew the gameplay.

doesnt have to kill them instantly like magma, just give them "Extreme Pain" - thats all i want, slow, gradual damage coupled with long-lasting agony - reserved only for special guests! so it could be like a happy medium between water and magma, if you dont have magma yet or dont wanna risk it burning your rosy dwarves before it bakes your goblins

plus, its all about sharing traditional home-made goods with invaders! warming it up with all your love for them - it can change the world!  [ok maybe not]

[Knigel]

Isn't the idea of boiling pitch being poured on invaders just a myth (oil was too expensive to use like that back then), and what they actually use was molten tar?

[plynxis]

maybe it is a myth - here's a wikipedia article on such weapons which at least in the introductive summary (yeah i didnt read it through ) doesnt mention them being a myth. and the section on hot oil actually does mention that they were rarely used due to cost and dangers but doesnt dispute they were actually used.

and, i dont see the point of using realism as a strong argument when talking about dwarf fortress no offense

the wiki article has a LOT of interesting ideas though... i mean, hot sand is easily viable in the game, as is animal fat (ofcourse) and quicklime, sulfur, pitch could all just be refined from already existing materials or included (wood burning -> tar, limestone -> quicklime, um, not sure -> sulfur). its not like there arent non-functional or nearly useless items and materials included already (not implying they dont have a future purpose, just that they dont fulfill it as of now).

edit - forgot to include the article

[Knigel]

^OK, you're right it wasn't a myth (that wasn't the right word to use), it was just very uncommon.

You're right that it not being realistic shouldn't limit it, but we also shouldn't limit it to oil because, as the article said, they used a lot of other stuff.

[GaxkangtheUnbound]

Brimstone is just a fancy word for sulfur.

[plynxis]

Brimstone is just a fancy word for sulfur.

yeah... i feel like an idiot again
 

[Knigel]

Brimstone is just a fancy word for sulfur.

Technically, sulfur just means the element in any form but brimstone specifically means elemental sulfur (not in a compound or solution) in the form of a crystal.

[Max White]

Sort of like saying graphite is just a fancy word for carbon. Just because something makes something else up, dosn't mean it is it, thus the differance between hydrogen and hydrogen gas.

But back on topic, can't we do this already? Just replace tar with magma?

[Andeerz]

Wow.  That wikipedia article is cool.  Regardless of burning oil or brimstone or whatever, having the option of using heated sand and water would be absolutely awesome.  I mean, the boiling water thing can already sorta be done, but it would be great to be able to have people able to haul vats of boiling water (or other hot materials) to pour down on invaders.  And according to what is said in the article, though burning oil wasn't terribly common due to expense, other forms of thermal warfare were frequently used. 

And I think that if oil could be used for thermal warfare in the game, other things (just about any fluid or fluid-like substance, and I mean any) should be able to be used.

[Akjosch]

Sort of like saying graphite is just a fancy word for carbon.

No, not quite. "Graphite" refers to a specific allotrope of carbon (the other common one is called "diamond"), while "brimstone" was used for general sulphur, as well as its native form (which is usually 99% pure sulphur anyway)

[plynxis]

And I think that if oil could be used for thermal warfare in the game, other things (just about any fluid or fluid-like substance, and I mean any) should be able to be used.

like... blood? like... having floor grates that collect dead invaders' blood and then boil it and then maybe, just maybe... pour it on the remaining invaders? like that? if so, then i agree!

if i put buckets under a grate, will it gather blood?... gotta experiment with those animal blood barrels...

But back on topic, can't we do this already? Just replace tar with magma?

well isnt that like saying tar is just a fancy word for magma? ;P - puns aside, the idea is that while magma is indeed the hermaphrodite king/queen of thermal weapons (as it only needs to mate with itself to create undiluted awesomeness) other materials can have different processes in order to be used (hence being usable without having to create a pump/channel/drain network to make sure you dont burn your fort down) and are available on nearly every embark space, not just those which have magma (that you have found ofcourse). its like, you make leather armor before you make metal right? and you use copper instead of iron if thats what you have. makes for a bit of variety. as said, it doesnt have to be equally potent, just equally painful

[Akjosch]

like... blood? like... having floor grates that collect dead invaders' blood and then boil it and then maybe, just maybe... pour it on the remaining invaders? like that? if so, then i agree!

if i put buckets under a grate, will it gather blood?... gotta experiment with those animal blood barrels...

Unfortunately, grates don't just let anything drip down on the level below (assuming there is open space below them, of course). This doesn't stop me from having them at nearly every room entrance along with a "sewer system" every other height level, of course. It's just all non-functional now, though it doubles as a flood prevention and containment mechanism quite nicely.

[rephikul]

Burning oil? I have had a similar idea for a long while.
The idea is that You need to construct lamp posts underground to keep field of vision over that area. without them dwarves have to walk in the dark with very limited vision range. Naturally they refuse to work anywhere they cannot see, except to haul things around in which case they have to reroute everytime they realize an obstacle.... generally not something you want to do.

Oil is made from fat. The more skilled the operator the more oil produced from a single unit of fat. It has no quality modifier.

Lamp post can be constructed with a stone/wood, a bucket and a rope, lamp posts require oil to operate and will consume them over time. Lamps can be tasked to turn on/off. Lamp post can hold a limited amount of oil. Better constructed lamp posts consume less oil and/or provide more vision.

Oil tanks are 3x3 buildings built from 3 blocks, a barrel and a pipe. It can hold as much oil as about 25 lamp posts and act as lamp posts themselves. They can be linked to other oil tank using pipes and other lamp posts in the same z level using mechanisms. Once linked, tanks share fuel and automatically fuel any lamps they are linked to. However, there must be an existing path provided by lamp post/tank vision between the oil tank and the destination lamp post for them to be linked. The lamp posts in between can be turned off after linking, though. Links between oil tanks while can be done regardless of distance if you have enough pipes, consume extra oil (they leaks away) Pipes do not hinder  creature movement but buildings cant be built over them.

Both lamp posts and oil tanks explode when exposed to fire and has a large chance of doing so when destroyed. This will greatly burn and spill !!Oil!! to surrounding area. Needless to say oil tanks are more likely to do this, and to greater effect then simple lamp posts.

[Footkerchief]

Oil has been suggested several times:

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=48528.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=3087.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=2942.0
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=59679.0

Spoiler: tags (click to show/hide)

oil hydrocarbon crude petroleum mineral

[thijser]

Well there are a few ways of getting oil:
1 By digging into a natural oil deposit.
2 By squizing it out of certain plants.
3 By making it from fat.

All of those ways could be inplented. However we already have alcohol for fire based traps. The thing we really need is a way to light them on fire maybe we could create burning arrows trough modding which would be usable in order to light the alochol on fire?

I think that oil will definetly be added once toady got around to a new liquid system. Currently the system works by stating how much liquid there is somewhere and whatever it's magma or water which is done with a 1 or 0. This system does not work when oil is added so it would have to be redone.