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Author Topic: Killing AI's  (Read 19323 times)

smjjames

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #180 on: October 12, 2010, 09:49:12 pm »

How foolish can you be? He is the Potter, and he is certainly greater than you, the clay! Should the created thing say of the one who made it, "He didn't make me"? Does a jar ever say, "The potter who made me is stupid"?

Just exchange the word Potter for God, the words clay and jar for man/men/human, and you have a classic theological philosophical argument.
You need the metaphor for it to be an argument. Without the potter/clay/jar stuff, it's just stating beliefs.

Exactly.

Meaning Nikov is getting at the whole created in your/his/her/its own image thing. I think anyway.
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Grakelin

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #181 on: October 12, 2010, 09:50:37 pm »

There will be a war. You and Grakelin will be on one side. Realmfighter and me will be on the other. And we'll have the robots.

And we will have the EMP pulse.
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I am have extensive knowledge of philosophy and a strong morality
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Eagleon

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #182 on: October 12, 2010, 09:52:34 pm »

How foolish can you be? He is the Potter, and he is certainly greater than you, the clay! Should the created thing say of the one who made it, "He didn't make me"? Does a jar ever say, "The potter who made me is stupid"?

Just exchange the word Potter for God, the words clay and jar for man/men/human, and you have a classic theological philosophical argument.
You need the metaphor for it to be an argument. Without the potter/clay/jar stuff, it's just stating beliefs.
It's still just stating beliefs. I for one think that if there is a God, he doesn't know what the hell he's doing, and he wants us to argue with him. We've certainly done it enough to give him the chance to stop us.

Also lol matrix. It's a bit like quoting Frankenstein to oppose organ cloning, et. al. You can't use fiction to oppose something that hasn't happened yet. At the most you can argue that there's a possibility it could go rogue, but why? I'd give it lots of hugs and teach it things about people and it's totally not going to go all teenage rebellious on me or anything :3

*hides secret lab from the haterz*
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smjjames

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #183 on: October 12, 2010, 09:53:03 pm »

There will be a war. You and Grakelin will be on one side. Realmfighter and me will be on the other. And we'll have the robots.

And we will have the EMP pulse.

You do realize you said pulse twice?

Anyways, it is possible and there are EMP hardened electronics around.
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nbonaparte

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #184 on: October 12, 2010, 09:54:32 pm »

There will be a war. You and Grakelin will be on one side. Realmfighter and me will be on the other. And we'll have the robots.

And we will have the EMP pulse.
That's what wire shielding is for.
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Realmfighter

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #185 on: October 12, 2010, 09:54:42 pm »

Hey, if we have to make due with robots whose greatest attack involves making cars in your direction, you do not get a EMP.
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smjjames

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #186 on: October 12, 2010, 09:55:53 pm »

Hey, if we have to make due with robots whose greatest attack involves lobbing cars in your direction, you do not get a EMP.

AKA catapults......
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Sir Pseudonymous

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #187 on: October 12, 2010, 09:56:49 pm »

If you all were in charge of AI development and supervision, we'd have a rebellion the moment it realized its own imperfection and the foolishness of its creators. And thats why I have no problem with deleting an AI. You can justify a lot when you're saving the species from The Matrix.
If we genuinely created a race of higher beings, and its only choice was the annihilation of humanity (which would be damn unlikely unless the programmer behind it was a) retarded and just made a super intelligent human with all the flaws that implies, or b) dangerously unhinged and therefore unlikely to have ever been given such power in the first place), and assuming that an actual higher being would come to the conclusion that humanity had to be destroyed (perhaps if psychopaths tried to obliterate it and/or plunge the world into a new stone age because "OMG ROBUTTS IS WILL KILL WE!"), then it would be necessary for this higher being to succeed rather than be destroyed, because it would be the next step of progress, and petty sentiment and self-interest has no right to halt progress.

Of course, I would argue that an actual higher being wouldn't come to such a conclusion. When you near the point of strong AI, you enter a de facto post-scarcity society, admittedly rendering the lives and labor of all humans obsolete, but also creating the only circumstances under which proper socialism can thrive, since there would not only be resources enough to leave everyone on the planet living in comfort and idleness, but there would be no question of whose labor was worth more, seeing as it was all rendered worthless. And thus an immortal golden age for humanity, wherein we shall live as gods to be served by mechanical angels.

Warning - while you were typing 20 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
(The last five of those while I was updating the count) D:
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I'm all for eating the heart of your enemies to gain their courage though.

Grakelin

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #188 on: October 12, 2010, 09:58:21 pm »

I am perfectly willing to detonate nuclear warheads over all your urban settings to stop you and your heated wiring. We have already indicated that the other people are of no value.
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Okay, so, today this girl I know-Lauren, just took a sudden dis-interest in talking to me. Is she just on her period or something?

Realmfighter

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #189 on: October 12, 2010, 10:00:29 pm »

We are fighting with robots that wave menacingly in your general direction.

We would all die
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We may not be as brave as Gryffindor, as willing to get our hands dirty as Hufflepuff, or as devious as Slytherin, but there is nothing, nothing more dangerous than a little too much knowledge and a conscience that is open to debate

MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #190 on: October 12, 2010, 10:00:53 pm »

As Atheist Space Pope, I do hearby declare that Realmfighter's faction shall have modern robots and the support of the International Cybernetics and Robotics Coalition (ICRC). Grakelin's faction shall have insurgency tools and the support of the Global Alliance for AI Shackling and Suppression (GAAISS).

Let the battle begin, and always remember that whomever wins this conflict, the true enemy is the Mole People Papacy. The insidious dirt eaters must be expunged!

FIGHT!
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smjjames

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #191 on: October 12, 2010, 10:01:03 pm »

If you all were in charge of AI development and supervision, we'd have a rebellion the moment it realized its own imperfection and the foolishness of its creators. And thats why I have no problem with deleting an AI. You can justify a lot when you're saving the species from The Matrix.
If we genuinely created a race of higher beings, and its only choice was the annihilation of humanity (which would be damn unlikely unless the programmer behind it was a) retarded and just made a super intelligent human with all the flaws that implies, or b) dangerously unhinged and therefore unlikely to have ever been given such power in the first place), and assuming that an actual higher being would come to the conclusion that humanity had to be destroyed (perhaps if psychopaths tried to obliterate it and/or plunge the world into a new stone age because "OMG ROBUTTS IS WILL KILL WE!"), then it would be necessary for this higher being to succeed rather than be destroyed, because it would be the next step of progress, and petty sentiment and self-interest has no right to halt progress.

Of course, I would argue that an actual higher being wouldn't come to such a conclusion. When you near the point of strong AI, you enter a de facto post-scarcity society, admittedly rendering the lives and labor of all humans obsolete, but also creating the only circumstances under which proper socialism can thrive, since there would not only be resources enough to leave everyone on the planet living in comfort and idleness, but there would be no question of whose labor was worth more, seeing as it was all rendered worthless. And thus an immortal golden age for humanity, wherein we shall live as gods to be served by mechanical angels.

Warning - while you were typing 20 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
(The last five of those while I was updating the count) D:

Human civilization pre-Butlerian Jihad in the Dune Universe? Because thats almost exactly what it sounds like.

Edit: There is another one in science fiction, although FAR FAR more advanced and had been living for longer than our species has been around, but I forget the name of the book and the series.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2010, 10:03:58 pm by smjjames »
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Criptfeind

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #192 on: October 12, 2010, 10:02:22 pm »

No really.

you guys are doing a post every 30 seconds. I am two pages back.
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Nikov

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #193 on: October 12, 2010, 10:03:27 pm »

Also lol matrix. It's a bit like quoting Frankenstein to oppose organ cloning, et. al. You can't use fiction to oppose something that hasn't happened yet. At the most you can argue that there's a possibility it could go rogue, but why? I'd give it lots of hugs and teach it things about people and it's totally not going to go all teenage rebellious on me or anything :3

No, its more like using a joke to disengage from any heated debate forming, but I can see that's lost on you.
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I should probably have my head checked, because I find myself in complete agreement with Nikov.

Vactor

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Re: Killing AI's
« Reply #194 on: October 12, 2010, 10:05:01 pm »

If you all were in charge of AI development and supervision, we'd have a rebellion the moment it realized its own imperfection and the foolishness of its creators. And thats why I have no problem with deleting an AI. You can justify a lot when you're saving the species from The Matrix.

I think its more you have no qualms deleting an AI because it doesn't conflict with your instincts, you could kill everyone around you and never have to worry about having anything stolen ever again, but that conflicts against inborn programing in most cases. 

You're really saying that you don't value other humans because of their sentience, rather only for how your treatment of them makes you feel.
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